So - the Russians believe Dohensk and Luhansk regions....

SamSpade

Well-Known Member
PREMO Member
Belong to Russia.

Been doing a little reading and trying to piece together what Russians are saying. I just watched a video made by a Russian, and another interview by a Russian official. He smirks a little about how the world thought nothing of the attacks made on Russians in 2015.

From their point of view, those two regions in eastern Ukraine declared independence as separate republics, and Russia accepted them, just as we annexed Texas after it declared independence from Mexico (albeit some years afterward). Once that happened, in the Russian mind - Ukrainians were attacking RUSSIA. The way they see it, they were just protecting a region that had freely chose to join Russia out of years of mistreatment at the hands of the Ukrainian government.

Again, from their point of view - they'd have just about enough, and have determined that the only way to keep the regions they've - annexed - is to overthrow the government in Kyiv and end the fighting in the east.

Lest anyone get the wrong idea, I disagree entirely with everything Russia has done, and nothing can justify the barbaric shelling and destruction they have heaped upon all areas of Ukraine. Perhaps the world didn't notice, but I don't recall the necessity of millions of citizens of Luhansk and Donetsk FLEEING the horror of the war zone as their cities were summarily leveled.

Russia seems to believe that the transition of regions don't need recognition legally or by the world or whatever - when South Sudan broke away it took fighting and conflict, but it was resolved by referendum, law and recognition by all involved, including Sudan. Try to imagine if Puerto Rico had a "referendum" where they decided they wanted to be part of Cuba, and the Cuban army "annexed" it. This is akin to what the Russians did - no official recognition by Ukraine or the rest of the world.
 

HemiHauler

Well-Known Member
Belong to Russia.

Been doing a little reading and trying to piece together what Russians are saying. I just watched a video made by a Russian, and another interview by a Russian official. He smirks a little about how the world thought nothing of the attacks made on Russians in 2015.

From their point of view, those two regions in eastern Ukraine declared independence as separate republics, and Russia accepted them, just as we annexed Texas after it declared independence from Mexico (albeit some years afterward). Once that happened, in the Russian mind - Ukrainians were attacking RUSSIA. The way they see it, they were just protecting a region that had freely chose to join Russia out of years of mistreatment at the hands of the Ukrainian government.

Again, from their point of view - they'd have just about enough, and have determined that the only way to keep the regions they've - annexed - is to overthrow the government in Kyiv and end the fighting in the east.

Lest anyone get the wrong idea, I disagree entirely with everything Russia has done, and nothing can justify the barbaric shelling and destruction they have heaped upon all areas of Ukraine. Perhaps the world didn't notice, but I don't recall the necessity of millions of citizens of Luhansk and Donetsk FLEEING the horror of the war zone as their cities were summarily leveled.

Russia seems to believe that the transition of regions don't need recognition legally or by the world or whatever - when South Sudan broke away it took fighting and conflict, but it was resolved by referendum, law and recognition by all involved, including Sudan. Try to imagine if Puerto Rico had a "referendum" where they decided they wanted to be part of Cuba, and the Cuban army "annexed" it. This is akin to what the Russians did - no official recognition by Ukraine or the rest of the world.

None of this can be right.

SLURPS and Ballsy McBall Face INSIST it's all a ruse to out the U.S. bioweapon labs.

They are smart lads, those two. Just ask them.
 

LightRoasted

If I may ...
If I may ...

Belong to Russia.

Been doing a little reading and trying to piece together what Russians are saying. I just watched a video made by a Russian, and another interview by a Russian official. He smirks a little about how the world thought nothing of the attacks made on Russians in 2015.

From their point of view, those two regions in eastern Ukraine declared independence as separate republics, and Russia accepted them, just as we annexed Texas after it declared independence from Mexico (albeit some years afterward). Once that happened, in the Russian mind - Ukrainians were attacking RUSSIA. The way they see it, they were just protecting a region that had freely chose to join Russia out of years of mistreatment at the hands of the Ukrainian government.

Again, from their point of view - they'd have just about enough, and have determined that the only way to keep the regions they've - annexed - is to overthrow the government in Kyiv and end the fighting in the east.

Lest anyone get the wrong idea, I disagree entirely with everything Russia has done, and nothing can justify the barbaric shelling and destruction they have heaped upon all areas of Ukraine. Perhaps the world didn't notice, but I don't recall the necessity of millions of citizens of Luhansk and Donetsk FLEEING the horror of the war zone as their cities were summarily leveled.

Russia seems to believe that the transition of regions don't need recognition legally or by the world or whatever - when South Sudan broke away it took fighting and conflict, but it was resolved by referendum, law and recognition by all involved, including Sudan. Try to imagine if Puerto Rico had a "referendum" where they decided they wanted to be part of Cuba, and the Cuban army "annexed" it. This is akin to what the Russians did - no official recognition by Ukraine or the rest of the world.
So ..... the shelling and murder of over 14,000 Russians in the Dohensk and Luhansk regions by Kiev for the only reason that those people were loyal to Russia, are perfectly fine? Does Israel have the "recognition legally or by the world or whatever" to continue apartheid activities, the theft of land, and the destruction of the Palestinian peoples?
 

vraiblonde

Board Mommy
PREMO Member
Patron
Belong to Russia.

Been doing a little reading and trying to piece together what Russians are saying. I just watched a video made by a Russian, and another interview by a Russian official. He smirks a little about how the world thought nothing of the attacks made on Russians in 2015.

From their point of view, those two regions in eastern Ukraine declared independence as separate republics, and Russia accepted them, just as we annexed Texas after it declared independence from Mexico (albeit some years afterward). Once that happened, in the Russian mind - Ukrainians were attacking RUSSIA. The way they see it, they were just protecting a region that had freely chose to join Russia out of years of mistreatment at the hands of the Ukrainian government.

Again, from their point of view - they'd have just about enough, and have determined that the only way to keep the regions they've - annexed - is to overthrow the government in Kyiv and end the fighting in the east.

Lest anyone get the wrong idea, I disagree entirely with everything Russia has done, and nothing can justify the barbaric shelling and destruction they have heaped upon all areas of Ukraine. Perhaps the world didn't notice, but I don't recall the necessity of millions of citizens of Luhansk and Donetsk FLEEING the horror of the war zone as their cities were summarily leveled.

Russia seems to believe that the transition of regions don't need recognition legally or by the world or whatever - when South Sudan broke away it took fighting and conflict, but it was resolved by referendum, law and recognition by all involved, including Sudan. Try to imagine if Puerto Rico had a "referendum" where they decided they wanted to be part of Cuba, and the Cuban army "annexed" it. This is akin to what the Russians did - no official recognition by Ukraine or the rest of the world.

Psh. You're not supposed to be actually thinking about this all intellectual and chit. You're supposed to mindlessly gobble CNN talking points and barf them back up while putting a Ukraine flag on your social media accounts and declaring "I STAND WITH UKRAINE!" You're supposed to call anyone who questions it a Putin Puppet, and say they should be hung for treason.

Don't you want to be in with the mob? Stop being so smart!
 

SamSpade

Well-Known Member
PREMO Member
? Does Israel have the "recognition legally or by the world or whatever" to continue apartheid activities, the theft of land, and the destruction of the Palestinian peoples?

How did Israel enter this discussion, or is this another instance of you having to insert it into EVERY conversation? I swear, I could be talking recipes, and you'd bring Israel or Jews into it.

I've heard all kinds of versions of the war in Donetsk and Lohansk. So far I am skeptical of just about every stat I hear. To hear the Russians declare it (on this war) they've committed 200,000 troops to sit around and just let the bombs and missiles do their work, while they waste precious time and supplies sitting on their tanks. To hear the Ukrainians side of this, they've killed so many Russians, at this rate by spring's end they will have killed or captured them all.

What I deduce is what the Russians have done before and did in Georgia in South Ossetia and Abkhazi, and likely did in Crimea, Luhansk and Donetsk - and have BEEN trying to do in the Baltic states - migrate ethnic Russians into those regions, create unrest and make calls for independence or otherwise "join" Russia. I don't believe any of these regions WANT to join Russia. Why would they? Russia is a third world nation with nukes or as McCain said - a gas station with nukes.

So just as before, these regions called for independence and Russia rolled in their troops and said that's enough for us, we're taking it.

And they fought a war. No kidding. A foreign power not widely known for honesty and candor took control illegally and THEN cried foul when that country FOUGHT BACK. This is like stealing your neighbor's kids and then show outrage when they shoot at you.
 

HemiHauler

Well-Known Member
How did Israel enter this discussion, or is this another instance of you having to insert it into EVERY conversation? I swear, I could be talking recipes, and you'd bring Israel or Jews into it.
I have a great brisket recipe for Passover.
 

Kinnakeet

Well-Known Member
None of this can be right.

SLURPS and Ballsy McBall Face INSIST it's all a ruse to out the U.S. bioweapon labs.

They are smart lads, those two. Just ask them.
Somehow you are correct and I guess you are superior to us then
Calling people names is not very nice did your parents not teach you that when you were little
 
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