The Democrat Party is collapsing! No, wait, the Democrat Party is surging!!!

[vraiblonde]

So why is it I can look at the same online news thing and it will say the Dems are in trouble, but a story right next to that one says Dems are winning seats in previously deep red districts??

The Democrat Party is not collapsing. You can look at elections and see that. The Party is quite strong and getting stronger. It *should* collapse but when you own all the biggest megaphones yours is the message that will prevail; and when your Party base is deranged lunatics.....excuse me, passionate people...it won't lose steam any time soon.

Democrat voters are obstinately loyal. You can't reason with them, or have a discussion with them, and you certainly can't show them proof that what they believe is a lie.

 

[Hijinx]

As long as there are Government handouts and entitlements and Democrat politicians to vote for these handouts and entitlements in order to get a public that lives off these handout and entitlements to vote for them, Democrats are not in trouble.

 

[limblips]

There is a 30-35% group on both sides. Kill puppies in Times Square and the headline would be "Devoted to Solving Animal Shelter Crowding"! It is the middle 30-40% that they target with their campaign lies and promises. When elected they make excuses as to why their lies can't happen. Spermberger and Mamdani are prime examples. She campaigned on "Affordability! Yet day one taxes, taxes, taxes. Mandani promised all the free stuff a voter could ever need. Day one he says the city is broke and can't afford to provide.

 

[vraiblonde]

There is a 30-35% group on both sides. Kill puppies in Times Square and the headline would be "Devoted to Solving Animal Shelter Crowding"! It is the middle 30-40% that they target with their campaign lies and promises. When elected they make excuses as to why their lies can't happen. Spermberger and Mamdani are prime examples. She campaigned on "Affordability! Yet day one taxes, taxes, taxes. Mandani promised all the free stuff a voter could ever need. Day one he says the city is broke and can't afford to provide.

Then the "middle" are a bunch of retards who shouldn't be allowed to vote at all. Democrats do this stuff, then blame the Republicans...and get away with it. I guarantee you Spamburger will blame Trump when Virginians complain about the high cost of living in that state. Mamdani is already doing it. And the idiot voters will be all, "Yeah! Damn you, Donald Trump!" when Trump has precisely nothing to do with it.

It stuns me that any decent person would vote for Democrats. And when you ask them why it becomes clear they have no idea any of this stuff is going on. They get their "news" from Reddit and Tik Tok. They genuinely think ICE is rampaging through cities for no reason other than to shoot Americans to death. If you point them toward news stories reporting the truth, they say it's lies.

I don't get it.

A judge just threw out the MURDER!! charge on Luigi Mangioni. He's on freaking camera gunning that guy down in cold blood, and because the judge doesn't like the death penalty he kicked out the most pertinent charge. I feel like this country is going crazy.

 

[Grumpy]

I feel like this country is going crazy.

 

[22AcaciaAve]

So why is it I can look at the same online news thing and it will say the Dems are in trouble, but a story right next to that one says Dems are winning seats in previously deep red districts??

The Democrat Party is not collapsing. You can look at elections and see that. The Party is quite strong and getting stronger. It *should* collapse but when you own all the biggest megaphones yours is the message that will prevail; and when your Party base is deranged lunatics.....excuse me, passionate people...it won't lose steam any time soon.

Democrat voters are obstinately loyal. You can't reason with them, or have a discussion with them, and you certainly can't show them proof that what they believe is a lie.

It is all a pendulum. People who are too far to the left or right don't have the ability to see it. They don't understand how people can ever vote for the other side. President's, and now congress people, go way to far trying to appease their radical bases. They do not realize that there is a very large middle and independent base that decides every election.

That middle is what decides every election. Red states and blue states will always be that way. Swing states are determined by independents and moderates. They elected Trump in 2016 because they did not want Hillary. They took it away from Trump in 2020 because they grew tired of his endless chaos. Then, they gave him another chance because they realized Biden was so bad and the border was an absolute failure under him. They will just as easily return at least one house of congress back to the democrats if the republicans don't read the temperature of the country.

You say democrat voters are obstinately loyal. Very true. Same can be said about republican voters. That's the base for both sides I mentioned. If you want to get honest opinions or good solid discussions, talk to the middle ground. Talk to the people who actually vote based on what a candidate says and does, rather than those who just vote party line. You will get much better view points that are not clouded by blind loyalty to a party.

And, BTW, the founders warned about political parties. They knew how bad they were for the country, they just didn't know what to do about it and they ran out of time. In our history it is well known that George Washington and Alexander Hamilton were very much opposed to political parties. The two party system is the biggest problem our country has at this point.

 

[22AcaciaAve]

Then the "middle" are a bunch of retards who shouldn't be allowed to vote at all. Democrats do this stuff, then blame the Republicans...and get away with it. I guarantee you Spamburger will blame Trump when Virginians complain about the high cost of living in that state. Mamdani is already doing it. And the idiot voters will be all, "Yeah! Damn you, Donald Trump!" when Trump has precisely nothing to do with it.

It stuns me that any decent person would vote for Democrats. And when you ask them why it becomes clear they have no idea any of this stuff is going on. They get their "news" from Reddit and Tik Tok. They genuinely think ICE is rampaging through cities for no reason other than to shoot Americans to death. If you point them toward news stories reporting the truth, they say it's lies.

I don't get it.

A judge just threw out the MURDER!! charge on Luigi Mangioni. He's on freaking camera gunning that guy down in cold blood, and because the judge doesn't like the death penalty he kicked out the most pertinent charge. I feel like this country is going crazy.

Don't agree with that at all. I would rather see the radical ends of the spectrum be stripped of their voting ability. The people who vote blindly for the D or the R have brought us to what this country is today.

The middle are the only people who weigh both sides of the argument and make informed decisions. They aren't the ones out there impeding ICE operations. They weren't the ones storming the Capitol on 1/6. They are the ones trying to figure out how to get the country back on track.

The judge did not throw out a murder charge on Mangioni. He threw out the death penalty. I don't agree with that. I believe the death penalty should be on the table in any murder. I hate that liberals have basically abolished the death penalty. IMO, anyone who commits murder without a valid self defense reason should be terminated.

But yeah, the country is going crazy. Most of it is because we have divided into two entities that each believes the other is a monster. Maybe the middle ground is where we all should meet. Many differences, but we all live in the same country. Maybe let's turn the rhetoric down and try to just meet each other in the middle. Sounds like a good idea, I doubt it happens. We are all just marching toward a cliff and nobody wants to listen to the guy who says we will all fall over.

 

[GURPS]

It stuns me that any decent person would vote for Democrats. And when you ask them why it becomes clear they have no idea any of this stuff is going on. They get their "news" from Reddit and Tik Tok. They genuinely think ICE is rampaging through cities for no reason other than to shoot Americans to death. If you point them toward news stories reporting the truth, they say it's lies.

Because they operate on feelings NOT Logic or common sense

 

[DPAT]

Don't agree with that at all. I would rather see the radical ends of the spectrum be stripped of their voting ability. The people who vote blindly for the D or the R have brought us to what this country is today.

The middle are the only people who weigh both sides of the argument and make informed decisions. They aren't the ones out there impeding ICE operations. They weren't the ones storming the Capitol on 1/6. They are the ones trying to figure out how to get the country back on track.

The judge did not throw out a murder charge on Mangioni. He threw out the death penalty. I don't agree with that. I believe the death penalty should be on the table in any murder. I hate that liberals have basically abolished the death penalty. IMO, anyone who commits murder without a valid self defense reason should be terminated.

But yeah, the country is going crazy. Most of it is because we have divided into two entities that each believes the other is a monster. Maybe the middle ground is where we all should meet. Many differences, but we all live in the same country. Maybe let's turn the rhetoric down and try to just meet each other in the middle. Sounds like a good idea, I doubt it happens. We are all just marching toward a cliff and nobody wants to listen to the guy who says we will all fall over.

You won't like what happens when the pendulum isn't allowed to swing as much. There will become a new left and new right, which you will then have to remove until effectively everyone is now left or right. Having such a wide left and right is how you're able to be in the peaceful (if not somewhat oblivious) middle.

A lot of folks talk about the Overton window in reference to shifting it left and right, but a big part people miss is how pleasantly wide that window is for us US citizens. Meaning you have a wide array of topics to discuss that are considered mostly centrist.

 

[Hijinx]

Then the "middle" are a bunch of retards who shouldn't be allowed to vote at all. Democrats do this stuff, then blame the Republicans...and get away with it. I guarantee you Spamburger will blame Trump when Virginians complain about the high cost of living in that state. Mamdani is already doing it. And the idiot voters will be all, "Yeah! Damn you, Donald Trump!" when Trump has precisely nothing to do with it.

It stuns me that any decent person would vote for Democrats. And when you ask them why it becomes clear they have no idea any of this stuff is going on. They get their "news" from Reddit and Tik Tok. They genuinely think ICE is rampaging through cities for no reason other than to shoot Americans to death. If you point them toward news stories reporting the truth, they say it's lies.

I don't get it.

A judge just threw out the MURDER!! charge on Luigi Mangioni. He's on freaking camera gunning that guy down in cold blood, and because the judge doesn't like the death penalty he kicked out the most pertinent charge. I feel like this country is going crazy.

The crazies are those which listen to the main stream media and Hollywood and their liberal agenda, which is owned and operated by Democrats.
The credibility of the media is zero. Hollywood is a biased circus.
Our schools are being taught by liberals who were taught and brainwashed in Marxist and liberal colleges.
Our colleges are infected with a liberal disease that is spreading their pandemic to our youth.

 

[somdwatch]

The 2 party system worked well until 1 party allowed "a ghost" party to join its ranks. The democrats should now be called Democratic Socialist since 2008.

 

[vraiblonde]

The middle are the only people who weigh both sides of the argument and make informed decisions.

See, that is not my experience with "the middle". My observation is that the middle, dead center, is largely made up of people who don't follow politics, don't care, and have no opinion on the issues. Which is fine - there's more to life than politics but if people don't want to be educated on the issues and candidates....they shouldn't vote.

And as DPAT said, "the middle" is wide and diverse and looks like this:

| L |__________CENTER__________| R |

 

[22AcaciaAve]

You won't like what happens when the pendulum isn't allowed to swing as much. There will become a new left and new right, which you will then have to remove until effectively everyone is now left or right. Having such a wide left and right is how you're able to be in the peaceful (if not somewhat oblivious) middle.

A lot of folks talk about the Overton window in reference to shifting it left and right, but a big part people miss is how pleasantly wide that window is for us US citizens. Meaning you have a wide array of topics to discuss that are considered mostly centrist.

I don't know. I think allowing the pendulum not to swing as much would be a more stabilizing thing. The Overton window was meant to identify politically acceptable policies to most Americans. The thought was to shift it by radical policies. But the Overton window was also developed well before politicians began to severely test the limits. Just because you are a centrist, does not mean you do not lean toward a side. But independents have been growing for decades. To the point that more people now identify as independent than do either of the other two parties. That speaks to the growing middle. Most of those lean toward one side. Unfortunately, most of those face bad choices every election. Either vote for a person closer to your views on the spectrum, or don't vote.

See, that is not my experience with "the middle". My observation is that the middle, dead center, is largely made up of people who don't follow politics, don't care, and have no opinion on the issues. Which is fine - there's more to life than politics but if people don't want to be educated on the issues and candidates....they shouldn't vote.

And as DPAT said, "the middle" is wide and diverse and looks like this:

| L |__________CENTER__________| R |

I agree that there is somewhat of an uneducated voter base out there. But it is more than the middle. I've seen people who grow up as D or R only because that is what their parents are. Question them and all they can spit out are the talking points they have heard all of their life. I registered as a democrat because that is what my parents were. I changed it during the Reagan administration because I started looking at policies and realized I did not align with democrats.

Reagan said in his farewell speech that people said his ideas were radical. He thought they were desperately needed. His ideas were not radical, they were simply ideas that had not been used for quite some time. The middle is only the middle because of two fringe ends that get all of the press in politics. Most of the middle is comprised of people who lean one way or the other, but can accept compromise as long as it works for both sides. It doesn't have to be the hammer from either side that destroys the other. It can work out for both, if people are willing to do it. Going back to Reagan, nobody in this era has even come close to the electoral landslide or popular percentage vote win. Because he knew how to push his policies, but temper them so that he could appeal to everyone.

As for those who vote and have no idea what they are voting for, yeah that bugs me too. But neither side is going to change that, nor should they. That is what a free society is about. You take the bad with the good.

 

[Grumpy]

...The middle is only the middle because of two fringe ends that get all of the press in politics. Most of the middle is comprised of people who lean one way or the other, but can accept compromise as long as it works for both sides.

Thank you, I have said that for years but not so much in those words...Perfect!

 

[Squiddie]

The Democrat Party is not collapsing.

It's never going to collapse. The thing with two-party systems is that they're incredibly stable. Dating back to the creation of politics there has always been a faction that caters towards reform and populism and a faction that caters towards upholding what is seen as traditional values.

Third parties do exist within this system, it's just that they are never bound to go anywhere. Any worthwhile ideas brought up by a third party are going to get absorbed into policies of one of the big two parties faster than the Raiders can sign a new head coach. The only way that this gridlock would be broken would for some event to deeply divide Americans and politicians as much as slavery did in the 1800s to cause one of the main parties to fracture and collapse. Then we'd just go back to a two party system with another party as the opponent in a few election cycles.

 

[DPAT]

I don't know. I think allowing the pendulum not to swing as much would be a more stabilizing thing. The Overton window was meant to identify politically acceptable policies to most Americans. The thought was to shift it by radical policies. But the Overton window was also developed well before politicians began to severely test the limits. Just because you are a centrist, does not mean you do not lean toward a side. But independents have been growing for decades. To the point that more people now identify as independent than do either of the other two parties. That speaks to the growing middle. Most of those lean toward one side. Unfortunately, most of those face bad choices every election. Either vote for a person closer to your views on the spectrum, or don't vote.



I agree that there is somewhat of an uneducated voter base out there. But it is more than the middle. I've seen people who grow up as D or R only because that is what their parents are. Question them and all they can spit out are the talking points they have heard all of their life. I registered as a democrat because that is what my parents were. I changed it during the Reagan administration because I started looking at policies and realized I did not align with democrats.

I'm not saying it would be bad for the window to be narrower. I was saying it would be bad to strip "radical" left and right wing voters of their ability to vote (as you suggested, unless you were sarcastic), because then you get new "radical" edges that would lose voting rights.

Just like if you stripped uneducated voters of voting rights, then you have a new edge of people who, by comparison to the rest, now seem uneducated, who would lose voting rights.

 

[vraiblonde]

I agree that there is somewhat of an uneducated voter base out there.

I will submit that the Democrat Party as a whole is so extreme that there can't be such a thing as a "moderate" Democrat. Because again, these are the Party leaders and elected representatives out there running around being lunatics and bloodthirsty scumbags, and saying these things in their own words in speeches and on social media. Forget the screaming progchicks on Tik Tok - look at Ilhan Omar, and AOC, and Bernie Sanders, and Jamie Raskin, and Chuck Schumer, and and and. You don't get to champion illegal alien child rapists and call yourself a moderate. You don't get to be in favor of men taking over women's sports and call yourself a moderate. Those are extreme positions, and anyone who votes for them is an extremist.

Now, I know people who don't agree with those things but still vote for them anyway. They say all those hate-America screamers are DINOs, and I tell them the same as I told the Republicans: No, bebe, they are the Party; you are the INO. But as long as you sport that D, you are the exact same as the crazies gluing themselves to the street because they don't want illegal alien drug gangs and child sex traffickers to be deported.

 

[Hijinx]

I will submit that the Democrat Party as a whole is so extreme that there can't be such a thing as a "moderate" Democrat. Because again, these are the Party leaders and elected representatives out there running around being lunatics and bloodthirsty scumbags, and saying these things in their own words in speeches and on social media. Forget the screaming progchicks on Tik Tok - look at Ilhan Omar, and AOC, and Bernie Sanders, and Jamie Raskin, and Chuck Schumer, and and and. You don't get to champion illegal alien child rapists and call yourself a moderate. You don't get to be in favor of men taking over women's sports and call yourself a moderate. Those are extreme positions, and anyone who votes for them is an extremist.

Now, I know people who don't agree with those things but still vote for them anyway. They say all those hate-America screamers are DINOs, and I tell them the same as I told the Republicans: No, bebe, they are the Party; you are the INO. But as long as you sport that D, you are the exact same as the crazies gluing themselves to the street because they don't want illegal alien drug gangs and child sex traffickers to be deported.

I notice those you named and many more are sitting in Congress and getting fat off the fools that voted for them.
Now that is not a weird thing only happening with Democrats.
IMO any politician who gains great wealth while being a politician is a crook, and our country is run by thieves.

 

[vraiblonde]

I notice those you named and many more are sitting in Congress and getting fat off the fools that voted for them.

I've always said that if people are going to be stupid, someone should be able to make money off them. The only thing is that *I* don't want to suffer because of it.

 

[22AcaciaAve]

I will submit that the Democrat Party as a whole is so extreme that there can't be such a thing as a "moderate" Democrat. Because again, these are the Party leaders and elected representatives out there running around being lunatics and bloodthirsty scumbags, and saying these things in their own words in speeches and on social media. Forget the screaming progchicks on Tik Tok - look at Ilhan Omar, and AOC, and Bernie Sanders, and Jamie Raskin, and Chuck Schumer, and and and. You don't get to champion illegal alien child rapists and call yourself a moderate. You don't get to be in favor of men taking over women's sports and call yourself a moderate. Those are extreme positions, and anyone who votes for them is an extremist.

Now, I know people who don't agree with those things but still vote for them anyway. They say all those hate-America screamers are DINOs, and I tell them the same as I told the Republicans: No, bebe, they are the Party; you are the INO. But as long as you sport that D, you are the exact same as the crazies gluing themselves to the street because they don't want illegal alien drug gangs and child sex traffickers to be deported.

I would agree with you. It is very hard to find a moderate democrat. But if i would stand on the other side, it is also very hard to find a moderate republican. And that is where the problem lies. I don't give a sh*t about all of the democrats that you named. Just like I don't give a Sh*t about the same people on the republican side who identify as MAGA.

I want all of the scumbags on the D side gone. Same as I do all of the scumbags on the R side gone. As much as you call the D supporters crazies, so are all of the R supporters who don't want to look at issues and just blindly support their party.

I'm with you on all of the things you said about illegal alien rapists and trans sports. I really think we could find some common ground on a lot of issues, but both the democrat and republican party have shifted so far to the extreme that it prevents that.

The only thing that will unite the country is if an independent party can somehow win high enough office to change things. Not very hopeful for that. The two party system has screwed America. Both democrats and republicans have failed. They look out for their own interests. They have both become slaves to the most radical ends of their party. Both parties have forgotten what made America great.

Our political system is broken and it is not likely to be fixed as long as people can game the system and win.