They are whining about the ..

mrweb

Iron City
FromTexas said:
$255 death benefit payment from Social Security...

:lmao:

That benefit has no meaning anymore! Its never adjusted and it does nothing to compensate or help pay for the loss.
We just buried a relative. $255 would have essentially done nothing to help. I wonder how much the administrative costs are to process the request, administrate the paperwork, process and send the check, process the cancelled check and render payment. I'll wager that it costs more than the benefit itself to provide the benefit. I (aaack) agree with the premise of this cut and I am a :middleoftheroad: Democrat.
 

vraiblonde

Board Mommy
PREMO Member
Patron
The Dems go on and on about Social Security - I'd just as soon Congress did away with it period. The whole thing is a scam and should, by rights, be illegal (as all pyramid schemes are).

That's MY money, yet I don't get it until I reach the age THEY say I should retire? That's crap.
 

ylexot

Super Genius
vraiblonde said:
The Dems go on and on about Social Security - I'd just as soon Congress did away with it period. The whole thing is a scam and should, by rights, be illegal (as all pyramid schemes are).

That's MY money, yet I don't get it until I reach the age THEY say I should retire? That's crap.
At the very least, I'd like the ability to opt-out of it and plan for my own retirement (I'm doing fairly well on my own so far).
 

Pete

Repete
vraiblonde said:
The Dems go on and on about Social Security - I'd just as soon Congress did away with it period. The whole thing is a scam and should, by rights, be illegal (as all pyramid schemes are).

That's MY money, yet I don't get it until I reach the age THEY say I should retire? That's crap.
I disagree, if you take away the SS safety net there will be old people litterally starving on the street. I don't have the stomach for that.

Also

I have paid in a whole lot of money into that system and I want as much back as I can get.
 
B

Bruzilla

Guest
Pete said:
I disagree, if you take away the SS safety net there will be old people litterally starving on the street. I don't have the stomach for that.

Also

I have paid in a whole lot of money into that system and I want as much back as I can get.

I don't think that anyone's calling for an end to SS payments for those who already rely on them, or those who will be needing them in the near term. The need for change/replacement is for us folks who will be needing them in 20 years or so.
 

vraiblonde

Board Mommy
PREMO Member
Patron
ylexot said:
At the very least, I'd like the ability to opt-out of it and plan for my own retirement (I'm doing fairly well on my own so far).
That would make sense. But they don't give you the option because they know that the opt-outers would be the people who contribute the most money, who they rely on to fund others.

It's my money. I should be able to do with it what I want.
 

Pete

Repete
Bruzilla said:
I don't think that anyone's calling for an end to SS payments for those who already rely on them, or those who will be needing them in the near term. The need for change/replacement is for us folks who will be needing them in 20 years or so.
I still disagree. People cannot be trusted to save for themselves. They will opt out to keep the $300 in their checks and blow it on DVD's, DVR's, Cell phones with 10,000 ring tones, blingbling and cars; Then wake up one morning shocked to be 65 years old with a bad back and failing eyesight, no savings, no investments and no SS. WTF do we do then, say TFB for you, you should have thought about that then? Do you honestly believe that our society will stand by and see hoards of elderly homeless, on the street and starving? No it won't, it will then have to come up with some expensive system to care for these people. They will skip out on paying SS, and STILL get benefits.
 

Railroad

Routinely Derailed
vraiblonde said:
The Dems go on and on about Social Security - I'd just as soon Congress did away with it period. The whole thing is a scam and should, by rights, be illegal (as all pyramid schemes are).

That's MY money, yet I don't get it until I reach the age THEY say I should retire? That's crap.
Mrs. Railroad and I are grateful for Social Security, because now that she's unable to work, we would be in very dire straits financially without it. We're also grateful for Medicare, without which we'd be unable to get medical insurance for her.
 

Railroad

Routinely Derailed
Pete said:
I still disagree. People cannot be trusted to save for themselves. They will opt out to keep the $300 in their checks and blow it on DVD's, DVR's, Cell phones with 10,000 ring tones, blingbling and cars; Then wake up one morning shocked to be 65 years old with a bad back and failing eyesight, no savings, no investments and no SS. WTF do we do then, say TFB for you, you should have thought about that then? Do you honestly believe that our society will stand by and see hoards of elderly homeless, on the street and starving? No it won't, it will then have to come up with some expensive system to care for these people. They will skip out on paying SS, and STILL get benefits.
There are life events that gobble up savings. Without going into gory details, a close friend of mine retired (early) a few years ago. Then, he lost most of what he had saved due to a family crisis connected with a bad illness. He is back from retirement working full-time, and when he's physically unable to work anymore, he will need that Social Security. Stuff happens. The original idea behind Social Security was a good one, even though now it seems like a bust.
 
B

Bruzilla

Guest
Pete said:
I still disagree. People cannot be trusted to save for themselves. They will opt out to keep the $300 in their checks and blow it on DVD's, DVR's, Cell phones with 10,000 ring tones, blingbling and cars; Then wake up one morning shocked to be 65 years old with a bad back and failing eyesight, no savings, no investments and no SS. WTF do we do then, say TFB for you, you should have thought about that then? Do you honestly believe that our society will stand by and see hoards of elderly homeless, on the street and starving? No it won't, it will then have to come up with some expensive system to care for these people. They will skip out on paying SS, and STILL get benefits.

I think that the answer to your concerns was in President Bush's reform plan, which the Dems and the press did everything possible to squelch. The core point that Bush was trying to make is that in 20 years or so a lot of bad things are going to happen. We who retire at that age will either have to work longer, or get benefits cuts, and most likely both. Also my kids are going to have to see major increase in their SS contributions. This is not a "what if..." scenario. It's going to happen, and when that time comes the politicians in charge aren't going to be able to push the problem back anymore. So, what can we do now to help offset the primary problem, which is going to be cuts to our benefit payments?

What Bush proposed is taking a piece, not all, but a piece of our withholdings and letting us put it into an investment program that yields a lot more than the pittance SS currently gets. Even if this external investment program completely failed you wouldn't be that much worse off. But, when the cuts come, and they are coming, you would have additional resources to help offset the loss. His plan was never to replace or end SS, only to make it a little easier for folks like me to deal with the cuts when they come.

The Democrats have proved 100% resistent to doing anything that upsets the status quo out of fear of angering seniors already drawing SS, even though these people would not be effected by anything Bush was calling for. The Dems keep acting like some friggin miracle is going to occur in 20 years and prevent all of this, but I'm sure future politicians are going to be as guttless as the ones of today and until the "bank closed" sign goes up at SS, and we're in crisis mode, they'll keep postponing taking even minimal preventive action like Bush wants to do.
 

FromTexas

This Space for Rent
Actually, you don't have any money in Social Security saved up for later and even if we agreed that all people 20 years or more out would not have it, we would still have to pay some of the insurance bill. Social Security is not retirement savings it is social insurance.

Like other insurance, all of us pay in to make payouts. Any surplus you get from social security (Clinton's real surplus) is the difference between what is collected and what is paid out in the current year. There is no magical savings account holding your money and gaining interest to pay you out.

In 2042 (approximately), Social Security will be collecting enough "premiums" to pay out 73% of the currently mandated amount.

When you retire, the workforce is the insurance and you are paid out of it. It may be taking 20+ workers to pay your insurance "payout". The workers are also insured (once paying in so much) against being unable to work for certain reasons (death providing income to raise children, disability providing income to self for being unable to work).
 
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