Vote on flag desecration may be 'cliffhanger'

[BuddyLee]

WASHINGTON — The Senate may be within one or two votes of passing a constitutional amendment to ban desecration of the U.S. flag, clearing the way for ratification by the states, a key opponent of the measure said Tuesday.

"It's scary close," said Terri Schroeder of the American Civil Liberties Union, which opposes the amendment. "People think it's something that's never going to happen. ... The reality is we're very close to losing this battle."

A poll released last week by the Freedom Forum First Amendment Center in Nashville found 63% oppose a flag amendment, up from 53% last year.

"Clearly, more Americans are having second thoughts about using a constitutional amendment to" instill respect for the flag, said Gene Policinski, the center's executive director. "Many Americans consider it the ultimate test of a free society to permit the insult or even desecration of one of the great symbols of the nation."

Don't like it, leave.


http://www.usatoday.com/news/washington/2005-06-14-flag-desecration-vote_x.htm?csp=24&RM_Exclude=Juno

 

[Bustem' Down]

This is one of those issues I don't really care about. If someone wants to burn the flag, whatever, it should just be made so that if someone punches them for it, that guy doesn't get in trouble. The flag is just an object, it's the meaning behind it I respect.

 

[Ken King]

Title 4 United States Code

Chapter 1 § 8. Respect for flag

(j) No part of the flag should ever be used as a costume or athletic uniform. However, a flag patch may be affixed to the uniform of military personnel, firemen, policemen, and members of patriotic organizations. The flag represents a living country and is itself considered a living thing. Therefore, the lapel flag pin being a replica, should be worn on the left lapel near the heart.

If the flag is already considered a living thing, how is it they allow for its desecration?

 

[Railroad]

Title 4 United States Code

Chapter 1 § 8. Respect for flag

(j) No part of the flag should ever be used as a costume or athletic uniform. However, a flag patch may be affixed to the uniform of military personnel, firemen, policemen, and members of patriotic organizations. The flag represents a living country and is itself considered a living thing. Therefore, the lapel flag pin being a replica, should be worn on the left lapel near the heart.

If the flag is already considered a living thing, how is it they allow for its desecration?

I was raised to consider the flag to be a sacred symbol to be treated with reverence. I pledged allegiance to that flag and the U.S. every morning in school. It literally makes me feel physically ill when I see video of flag-burning or other desecration.

 

[czygvtwkr]

I don't think we need an ammendmant to the constitution but I do think it should be a crime. I think too many people display the flag incorrectly also.

 

[Chasey_Lane]

Ken, wasn't there a huge discussion about the flag and what it stands for a while ago? I remember someone(s) talking about beach towels, swimsuits, etc. that were flag-inspired. Let me see if I can't find the thread.

 

[Chasey_Lane]

I found this, though I'm not quite sure it was what I was looking for.

 

[vraiblonde]

I think flag-burning is juvenile and moronic and those who do it should get the chair. If you can't express your displeasure in a more mature fashion, I don't want to hear what you have to say. The only reason people do it is for shock value and to piss off people like me. And since shock value and pissing people off has no place in civil discourse, I'm all for this amendment and I think the penalty should be death.

 

[sleuth]

I think flag-burning is juvenile and moronic and those who do it should get the chair. If you can't express your displeasure in a more mature fashion, I don't want to hear what you have to say. The only reason people do it is for shock value and to piss off people like me. And since shock value and pissing people off has no place in civil discourse, I'm all for this amendment and I think the penalty should be death.

Tell us how you really feel, Vrai.

 

[Bruzilla]

I remember the debate in the Lousiana State Assembly, which was passing a bill that would make it a crime to desecrate the flag, and they had to stop the process due to Freedom of Speech issues. So instead they passed a law stating that anyone who attacks or batters someone in the process of desecrating an American flag can only be punished by a $5 fine.

 

[SamSpade]

I think any infidel dog who desecrates the Koran should be beheaded!

 

[czygvtwkr]

What do you think our founding fathers would do to someone burning a flag?

I like the idea about being able to punch that person in the nose.

 

[czygvtwkr]

But really officer I thought he was on fire and I was just trying to put it out.

 

[mAlice]

:goldencalf:

 

[newtosomd]

I don't agree with flag burning and it really pisses me off when I see them showing people on TV doing it. However, I think that our constitution provides for it in the 'Freedom of Speech.' I would absolutely beat my kids if I ever saw them doing it and I would never think of doing it, nor do I think citizens of the US should do it. However, I don't know if banning it is the right thing to do.

 

[Tonio]

I don't think we need an ammendmant to the constitution but I do think it should be a crime.

I agree. Since it's intended to cause a disturbance, I think the laws we already have on the books are sufficient to prosecute the crime.

If you can't express your displeasure in a more mature fashion, I don't want to hear what you have to say. The only reason people do it is for shock value and to piss off people like me.

Yes. Those idiots are just attention whores. I would love to see society ignore them just to drive them nuts. Maybe the crime's punishment should involve some sort of public shunning.

 

[ylexot]

Maybe the crime's punishment should involve some sort of public shunning.

There's an idea...flag burner registry! I'm sure nobody would track them down and kick their @sses

 

[Larry Gude]

Burning a flag is no more...

...speech than smoking a cigarette.

Example of free speech: I do not like the policy of the government in doing X. We should stop it and I shall work to bring about the change I believe is proper.

A flag is a symbol and symbols are intended to give meaning. Our national flag is suppossed to be a symbol representative of our Declaration of Independence, our Constitution and our Bill of Rights. The flag is the simple, readily visible symbol that we salute to honor what the United States of America is.

That symbol spurs various levels of emotion, the purpose of symbols, in the eye of the beholder. Whatever your level, misty eyed to boredom during the pledge:

"I pledge allegiance to the flag of the Untited States of America and to the Republic for which it stands, one nation, under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all"

...it is clearly a pledge for the good of all. It is not a threat to anyone.

Burning a flag is in defiance of mans shortcomings (we are not perfect, we are under God) and in defiance of the concept of liberty and justice for all.

Anyone who desecrates our flag is an enemy of self government, individual liberty and freedom protected by law, guaranteed to all.

It is an act of war against mankind to destroy with violent intent the one universal symbol of freedom and hope for all mankind.

It is not speech.

Under that banner lies the path to peacefully change any government policy, to right any wrong, to seek, as it says, liberty and justice for all. It ain't perfect and it says so; 'Under God'.

So, if you're unhappy, go to work for change, don't engage in destroying the very concept of your ability to right wrongs and don't exepct anyone to see violence to the flag as anything other than what it is.