You're being manipulated

SamSpade

Well-Known Member
Said this so many times, my mouth is getting dry - when you see anything in the news that outrages you, bet the farm that someone is creating the image specifically to manipulate your outrage.

Because when the news cycle moves on to something else - your outrage and white guilt will dissipate and you won't give a fig what happens to blacks throughout the country - frequently or infrequently, deserved or undeserved - because the entire point is to get you all worked up over it. I wouldn't put it past the kinds of people who manipulate issues to stage and KILL a person, just to get YOU all worked up over it. That's a bit far-fetched - but consider - how often do you think this sort of thing happens? Why are you upset NOW? Because it's been on the news? How "angry" will you be in four months when you've long forgotten the name of the man who died?

Permit me to wax a little - religious on you. You can roll your eyes afterward. But the "enemy" isn't cops; it's not "white people". And it's probably not even "racism" although it plays a part. The enemy is evil; it's hatred. Cops don't do this - evil people do. WHITE people don't do this - evil people do. But evil doesn't wear a label allowing you to fight back at it with a rock or a torch. So you are encouraged to be enraged at cops, at whites, at anyone who will satiate your anger. Once it is satiated - and time has worn it down - things will GO BACK to where they always were before, because the whole point was to make you angry, not to compel you to action. You're never going to DO anything about it - you're just going to point fingers and stay angry over it - but you'll move on.

One more thing - if this weren't on every channel and being broadcast to your face in living color every waking hour - would you care at all? My Facebook is on fire with virtue signaling from white lefties all outraged at everything. By some twist of irony, almost all of them LIVE in VERY white enclaves of America. It's extremely unlikely they interact at all with an appreciable number of minorities or black people. For most of them, this issue will disappear and all they will know is, it's all Trump's fault and all those conservative white people, because the easiest thing in the world to do is get all pissed off and then do nothing about it.
 

SamSpade

Well-Known Member
Mad Maxine Waters already came out yesterday blaming Trump
I read a pages long description and explanation of "dog whistling". No matter how intricate it got - I kept thinking - this is bullshit. Nobody I know "hears' special language that points to hate that others do not.

There WERE good points - when an evangelical hears "wonder working power" they do hear "There's Power In the Blood" in their minds - it's something an evangelical would hear that others might not. That makes sense - I can think of a dozen phrases that politicians might hear that certain groups might know that others - don't. BUT - I don't "hear" Antisemitism when someone says "international banking". You have to be a die-hard bigot to "hear" that.

Maxine Waters' explanation was that Trump's racism - which no one really has spelled out all that well - somehow was a dog whistle to racist cops that killing a black man in their custody would be excused. That's crap.
 

vraiblonde

Board Mommy
PREMO Member
Patron
Maxine Waters' explanation was that Trump's racism - which no one really has spelled out all that well - somehow was a dog whistle to racist cops that killing a black man in their custody would be excused. That's crap.
Because that never happened under Obama.....

Good thread, Sam. I don't think the point can be hammered home enough.

The TV tells people what to think and do, so they think and do it. And if you question them, they flip out and get abusive because they have no idea what they're freaking out over. They've been told to freak out, and that's that. We get these partial stories with very little context and the TV tells us to be mad, so we're mad. They show a pic of the subject when they were a little kid or their high school graduation pic, and his mama comes on TV to cry and say what a good boy he was, and we buy it.

Because the TV said so.

One more thing - if this weren't on every channel and being broadcast to your face in living color every waking hour - would you care at all?
I think the people who are most outraged over these incidents are acting out some virtue signaling because they're indifferent and ignorant in general. This overreaction is supposed to make up for ignoring black ghettos and the murder rate in metropolitan areas, the drugs, the crime, the general decay. The TV people in particular do this - ignore the every day degradation, then flip out excessively over a single incident to make up for it. "See me caring? See me not being a racist?"
 

SamSpade

Well-Known Member
The TV people in particular do this - ignore the every day degradation, then flip out excessively over a single incident to make up for it. "See me caring? See me not being a racist?"
I have a friend on Facebook who - from time to time - flips out on Trump for some racist thing - she and her husband, we met them in Ethiopia and their daughter was a friend of ours, when there. She began a post with "white people need to just shut up about this" - and then goes on a tear for four or five pages of diatribe (and she's white, in one of the whitest counties in the country). I've had to mute her posts for a month, because every day since this began, another rant.

What can I say? She has two black children - she knows about racism. But she is being manipulated and is running these rants for exactly the reason you cite - this need to say "everyone ELSE is a racist, but not ME". The virtue signaling so common on the Internet this week. I do agree with her on one point - if you're white, you probably should just shut the hell up. It's not going to help. But this urge to virtue signal is "it's really bad, but I am not one of the bad ones. Really". And I want to say, look, you THINK you know - but you don't. You live in a very white state in a very white town, and you think racism is a few townsfolk reacting funny. You don't KNOW. If you did, you'd hear the remarks of Floyd's girlfriend saying he would have been horrified at the idea of riots done in his name. You'd know that this happens - and there's dealing with it - and reacting to it.

Ultimately - and this will sound dumb and naive - you must WIN the hearts of at least some of the people who are bigoted today. You cannot win by forcing the issue. That perpetuates the racism. Ghandi said he would win by making the British embarrassed. He would win because they would eventually feel ashamed of their behavior, and he would do BECAUSE he wasn't violent. It would take LONGER, but it would also last. Too many want to go the violent route because it produces fast results - but the cause of the racism never dies. To end racism, you have to stop it where it starts; you must make the bigot not want to be bigoted.
 

Auntie Biache'

Well-Known Member
To end racism, you have to stop it where it starts; you must make the bigot not want to be bigoted.
Until everyone is exactly the same, there will be bigotry. People fear the unknown, the fear what is different from their own norm.

What people need to do is stop trying to make everyone the same. Stop trying to put people together who have nothing in common. I'm not saying we need black and white water fountains, but we need to just stop pushing the issue. People who want to venture out of their bubble, will.
 

SamSpade

Well-Known Member
Until everyone is exactly the same, there will be bigotry. People fear the unknown, the fear what is different from their own norm.

What people need to do is stop trying to make everyone the same. Stop trying to put people together who have nothing in common. I'm not saying we need black and white water fountains, but we need to just stop pushing the issue. People who want to venture out of their bubble, will.
I think you've hit very nearly on the thinking. I think there's fear - there's hate - and there's ignorance.
My daughter was terrified of every animal she encountered. At four years of age and in China - a dog might as well have been a giant SPIDER. They totally terrified her. This was ignorance and fear - she knew nothing about dogs - and was afraid of them. Now she takes care of our dog, and the dog loves her.

There's ignorance - not being around people of another culture or race - and making mistakes. When my sister's best friend's daughter turned 15, she was invited to her birthday party. Actually a quinceanera . My sister had no idea what that was - so she blew it off. She could not understand what the deal was and why her friend was SO hurt by it. Another relative comes to town and has never been in a town surrounded by blacks. I reassured him they don't give a crap what color he is and they haven't noticed. It may be prejudicial - but it is just ignorance. They don't know anything.

There's honest mistakes. I once worked with a black man and made the mistake of saying boy am I thirsty. He was furious that I called him "boy" (which I actually didn't). That's experience. When you're with people of different races and cultures, you become familiar with things. If I'm with a black friend, and I'm in the mood for fried chicken or a watermelon, they KNOW I'm not thinking of them being black - they realize I just want to have one of those and really wasn't making a judgment of anything.

And there's hate. And I have seen it. It's kind of a willful ignorance combined with hostility. For example, I've seen Canadians demonstrate a willful, mindful hatred of French Canadians. Something I really have no concept of. How do you hate a French Canadian and not just dislike plain old regular Canadians? Like, there's a difference? Like, how does a Brit hate a Welshman, when to us, there's almost no difference? How does a Spaniard hate a Basque or a Hungarian hate a Romani - when to most of us, they're kind of the same? HATRED of another group is hard for me to grasp - it has to be something personal, something they have DONE to me personally. Otherwise, I don't understand it.
 

Hijinx

Well-Known Member
Well first I have to say I have zero white guilt.
Next thing I have to say is that maxine waters is evil personified..---------and she ugly along with it.
I tell it like it is, if you don't like it put me on ignore.

The cop that knelt on that man's neck was an evil a-hole.
But so are the looters and arsonists.
Being a drunk did not give that cop a right to kneel on his back until the man died.
His dying does not give that crowd of mixed races any excuse to riot and burn.
There is good and bad in every race. Smart and Dumb in every race.

But I swear that Congressional Black Caucus---well what can I say, they are overburdened with dummies and racists.
 

UglyBear

Well-Known Member
And there's hate. And I have seen it. It's kind of a willful ignorance combined with hostility. For example, I've seen Canadians demonstrate a willful, mindful hatred of French Canadians. Something I really have no concept of. How do you hate a French Canadian and not just dislike plain old regular Canadians? Like, there's a difference? Like, how does a Brit hate a Welshman, when to us, there's almost no difference? How does a Spaniard hate a Basque or a Hungarian hate a Romani - when to most of us, they're kind of the same? HATRED of another group is hard for me to grasp - it has to be something personal, something they have DONE to me personally. Otherwise, I don't understand it.
Yep, SamSpade, you got it right --there's always some kind of hatred.
In US, it's just simpler -- white vs black, slavery, etc. Clear cut and on the surface. Visual, with its own conflict origin story built in.
This hatred exists everywhere, it's just not as evident. (

I fully suspect that it's somehow a feature of humanity. The need to identify and hate some other group. Maybe it's a relic of our spread from Africa to all the other corners of the world, eliminating whoever was there before? Or just a built-in pressure-release valve?
(if population density gets above certain number, we go on a bit of genocide, to relieve stress on our environment?)

Whatever reason, it's there, and will always be.
 

GURPS

INGSOC
PREMO Member
..... when to most of us, they're kind of the same? HATRED of another group is hard for me to grasp - it has to be something personal, something they have DONE to me personally. Otherwise, I don't understand it.

Simple Raise that way

Serbs / Bosnians / Croats

Rasied to HATE Each other over some sht from 1500 yrs ago
 

Auntie Biache'

Well-Known Member
Hey can someone answer me something ? Who was filming George Floyd? Why didn't they help him? Why didn't anyone try?

Just been bugging me.
They probably didn't wanna' get shot. I don't understand why no one called 911. Or, if someone did, will we ever hear about it?
 

Yooper

Up. Identified. Lase. Fire. On the way.
PREMO Member
Hey can someone answer me something ? Who was filming George Floyd? Why didn't they help him? Why didn't anyone try?

Just been bugging me.
My understanding was that the person filming tried to stop it and when (s)he was rebuffed by the police kept filming in case it got to where it unfortunately got to. Sorry, in advance, but I forget where I read that so I can't post a link.

--- End of line (MCP)
 
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Yooper

Up. Identified. Lase. Fire. On the way.
PREMO Member
Simple Raise that way

Serbs / Bosnians / Croats

Rasied to HATE Each other over some sht from 1500 yrs ago
But that actually wasn't entirely the case. In the villages friendly relations and inter-marriages (etc.) were quite common-place. But there's always that person (or, in this case, groups of people) who decided the break-up of Yugoslavia could be profitable (both literally and figuratively). Also happened with the divorce of the Czechs and Slovaks, but fortunately didn't get nearly as hot (for a variety of reasons).

In both cases (Yugoslavia and Czechoslovakia), many folks thought there would be bloodshed when the artificial countries were assembled post-WWI. To the surprise of these many, it didn't happen; people could actually live together. In the case of Yugoslavia that was especially surprising.

But if an ethnic group needs to be pointed out it would be the Serbs as they believed (as a group) that they remained the only pure South Slavs (the Croats being Roman Catholic and the Bosniaks being Christians who chose Islam meant these two groups were essentially heretics). And of the Serbs I believe it was the Belgrade-residing cultural elites who were the instigators of the post-break-up violence.

Anyway, enough rambling. Have a great evening! Cheers!

--- End of line (MCP)
 
I've had this general discussion with all types of people over the last few days. I try to moderate becoming too conspiratorial... But it was too easy to lock everyone up for months. Condition people to wear the mask. Then take a tiny singular law enforcement action gone bad. Then unleash the masked hordes nationally to spread mayhem and hellfire.
 
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