Ok Why is it?

[Zguy28]

So. Judas started out as a pretty legit fellow and just fell in the end? Was his final relinquishment of hope in the suicide or the betrayal?

This has me wondering where grace fits...or was he still under law? #headscratch

Well the question I ask is this: can Satan enter in and possess a person who has experienced salvation?

It would seem not since:

1. Christ is our Shepherd who guards His sheep and nobody can snatch them away.
2. Paul describes Christians as "those who receive the Spirit" (do a search on "Spirit" in Galatians) and that we are then a temple of the Spirit. How can Satan possess God's Holy Temple where His Holy Spirit dwells?

So I'd say no. I'd also say that Judas' choosing by Jesus was not to salvation, but to ministry. There is a difference.

 

[hotcoffee]

So. Judas started out as a pretty legit fellow and just fell in the end? Was his final relinquishment of hope in the suicide or the betrayal?

This has me wondering where grace fits...or was he still under law? #headscratch

Judas had a problem when it came to money. He was a tax collector.... the money he made was skimmed from those who could least afford it.

Jesus knew that.

Judas left everything and followed Jesus. Now he could have been hanging around Jesus just so he could pilfer what money Jesus did get.... but that's not really likely because Jesus had no need for money. There would have been no treasury.

I really can't believe that Jesus would have sent him out if he hadn't gone through some kind of a change. Jesus had that affect on people.

We all have our weak areas tho and Judas had his. I think he was fooled by the Pharisees.... I think when Jesus was crucified I think it really horrified him.

The story of Judas is the story of free will and it's affect on humans.

 

[Zguy28]

Judas had a problem when it came to money. He was a tax collector.... the money he made was skimmed from those who could least afford it.

Jesus knew that.

Maybe I missed it, but I don't believe the Scripture says he was a tax collector (that was Matthew), but rather he was the disciples treasurer and dipped his hand in the money bag.

Judas left everything and followed Jesus. Now he could have been hanging around Jesus just so he could pilfer what money Jesus did get.... but that's not really likely because Jesus had no need for money. There would have been no treasury.

I really can't believe that Jesus would have sent him out if he hadn't gone through some kind of a change. Jesus had that affect on people.

Judas (just like Peter during the "Get behind me Satan!" rebuke scene) most likely did not understand Jesus' mission to come and die. Rather, he was looking for the conquering king that would crush the yoke of the Romans in a military and political way. When Jesus was determined to die as an atonement, Judas saw his hopes and dreams evaporate and may have been determined to force Jesus' hand to bring about his hopes, or he became hardened and felt betrayed.

We all have our weak areas tho and Judas had his. I think he was fooled by the Pharisees....

It says Judas sought them out, not the other way. That's all we have to go on.

I think when Jesus was crucified I think it really horrified him.

Seems that way, maybe it was remorse? He definitely realized that his betrayal had played a part in a truly innocent person being crucified.

The story of Judas is the story of free will and it's affect on humans.

Its also the story of God who loves mankind enough to purposely make a way for them to be saved despite their sinfulness, at great cost to Himself. It's the greatest love story ever told!

"Greater love has no one than this, that someone lay down his life for his friends." John 15:13

 

[Bavarian]

Judas could have been forgiven like St. Peter if he had asked for forgivness. God would have forgiven him.

 

[hotcoffee]

The question was.... Since Jesus knew that Judas was going to betray Him... why did He send Judas out to tell people about the kingdom and who did He tell?

So now that we have established who Judas was and that Judas could have asked for forgiveness [as Peter did].... could we get back to the question I asked.... I came up with my answer but I would like to know....

 

[Zguy28]

The question was.... Since Jesus knew that Judas was going to betray Him... why did He send Judas out to tell people about the kingdom and who did He tell?

So now that we have established who Judas was and that Judas could have asked for forgiveness [as Peter did].... could we get back to the question I asked.... I came up with my answer but I would like to know....

Look to John 13:18 for the answer. It doesn't really have anything to do with the actual work of his ministry, just that it had to be somebody from his disciples.

 

[hotcoffee]

Look to John 13:18 for the answer. It doesn't really have anything to do with the actual work of his ministry, just that it had to be somebody from his disciples.

Ok... I'll wait.... I'm going to finish Luke and then go on to the man Jesus thought the most of..... This should be very interesting....

 

[countrygirl12]

Yes it part of was a plan, but if it wasn't Judas it would have been someone else to betray Christ. The Lord tries to give us as many chances as possible to "not" make the choices that will lead us to darkness, he was giving Judas another opportunity to become the true disciple he was capable of becoming.

I believe we are each born with a spirit with varying degrees of obedience or rebellion, some are more valiant than others. Yes we have free will/ free agency to make our choices; we all given the light of Christ to guide us and draw us to Him, but there are also opposing forces that will influence us to sin and pull further away from God.

The ultimate choice is ours, it was Judas' choice to do what he did.

 

[inkah]

I am unfamiliar with the passage you reference. The closest with Jesus I could find was the false prophets and knowing a bad tree by it rotten fruit.

Now, from Paul their is a closer passage to what you are saying.

Philippians 1
12 I want you to know, brothers, that what has happened to me has really served to advance the gospel, 13 so that it has become known throughout the whole imperial guard and to all the rest that my imprisonment is for Christ. 14 And most of the brothers, having become confident in the Lord by my imprisonment, are much more bold to speak the word without fear.

15 Some indeed preach Christ from envy and rivalry, but others from good will. 16 The latter do it out of love, knowing that I am put here for the defense of the gospel. 17 The former proclaim Christ out of selfish ambition, not sincerely but thinking to afflict me in my imprisonment. 18 What then? Only that in every way, whether in pretense or in truth, Christ is proclaimed, and in that I rejoice.

yup. that is the one I was thinking about.

 

[Dondi]

Since Jesus knew that Judas was going to betray Him... why did He send Judas out to tell people about the kingdom and who did He tell?

Judas, like all the other disciples, went out to preach the gospel and heal the sick and cast out demons under the authority of the Lord Jesus Christ. Judas had the message and given the power to heal only under that authority. God can use anyone to bring the message, even from the enemy. He did so numerous times in the Old Testament.

For example, in I Samuel 19, when King Saul was out to kill David, it says in verse 19 that an evil spirit from the Lord was upon Saul, when he threw the javelin at David (and missed). Yet later on in the chapter, Saul was prophesying as the Spirit of God was upon him.

The condition of Judas heart was irrevelant to his ability to preach the good news and heal the sick. It was all God's doing.

I've heard several testimonies from people from our church who have gone out witnessing to people, even seen them get saved, only to discover that they themsleves were not saved yet.