Weight Issues..

[chicamuxen]

You say your TB is on a good deworming program, but is it really? No one program fits all horses all the time. For instance, how often is a Tape Worm dewormer given? Did you know that there is evidence of resistance to ivermectin now? Fecal tests taken at some large farms are showing that the levels of parasite eggs are rebounding faster than in the past. Using double doses of ivermectin has helped many horses with parasite problems.

Several years ago I bought a TB rescue and took her thru a careful deworming program suggested by my vet. She also stayed underweight and didn't get that glowing coat that my other horses have had. The vet recommended putting the "hard keeper" on daily dewormer. I was very skeptical but I tried it. What a difference! It finally cleaned out the parasites in her, she gained weight and her coat just gleamed.

There is a lot of discussion on the Chronicle of the Horse "horse care" forum about deworming. Lot's of interesting reading.

If you want to increase her feed another option is soaked beet pulp. It has roughly twice the calories of grain but is utilized like a high calorie forage by the body not like a grain. It has added calcium which can help prevent ulcers and calcium is typically deficient in grass/grain based diets.

chicamuxen

 

[CountryLady]

You say your TB is on a good deworming program, but is it really? No one program fits all horses all the time. For instance, how often is a Tape Worm dewormer given? Did you know that there is evidence of resistance to ivermectin now? Fecal tests taken at some large farms are showing that the levels of parasite eggs are rebounding faster than in the past. Using double doses of ivermectin has helped many horses with parasite problems.

Several years ago I bought a TB rescue and took her thru a careful deworming program suggested by my vet. She also stayed underweight and didn't get that glowing coat that my other horses have had. The vet recommended putting the "hard keeper" on daily dewormer. I was very skeptical but I tried it. What a difference! It finally cleaned out the parasites in her, she gained weight and her coat just gleamed.

There is a lot of discussion on the Chronicle of the Horse "horse care" forum about deworming. Lot's of interesting reading.

If you want to increase her feed another option is soaked beet pulp. It has roughly twice the calories of grain but is utilized like a high calorie forage by the body not like a grain. It has added calcium which can help prevent ulcers and calcium is typically deficient in grass/grain based diets.

chicamuxen

I agree, I have seen remarkable results in horses put on daily dewormer.

 

[CountryLady]

I need some advice. I have an 11yr TB mare that I have been having a really hard time gaining weight. I have had her fully vetted and she is healthy. Her teeth were floated and is not dropping grain. I feed her 2x a day. Currently she is on Legends Performance. Protein 11% Fat 10%. And a scoop of Legends Rice Bran. (1/2 scoop with each feeding) She is on free choice hay while in dry lot and otherwise turned out on grass at least couple hours a day. She is kept on a regular deworming schedule. I feed her by herself, so i know she is getting ALL her food. Does anyone have suggestions that would help her gain? or when I should start seeing results? I have tried endless things and nothing seems to be making a huge improvement.. She is gaining but it is s-l-o-w. Is that typical in trying to get horses to gain weight? I have run out of ideas.. any advice would be greatly appreciated. Thanks

There is a chart that lists all of the southern states feeds, including "Legends," which gives the ratio of weight per quart. Sadly it is not available online. But you can email them and they will gladly send it to you.

Corn Oil is ok, but I am not a huge fan of corn oil. In small amounts yes, but I think some people get carried away glugging it into their feed.

Worming - alternating worming schedule. Daily worming if you don’t see results after a few cycles.

Proper amount of feed per normal weight of horse and tuned to their individual work.

Gradual weight gain is much better than over doing it.
Too many supplements tend to cause other problems (they tend to blow all that nutrition out their feet) so be careful.

Be consistent.
When changing their diet to more or less feed, do it over a period of a week or so before another change.

Monitor the weight gain with weight tape (I also like to take photos).
When you see them every day, sometimes it is hard to notice the changes.

 

[Robin]

There is a chart that lists all of the southern states feeds, including "Legends," which gives the ratio of weight per quart. Sadly it is not available online. But you can email them and they will gladly send it to you.

Corn Oil is ok, but I am not a huge fan of corn oil. In small amounts yes, but I think some people get carried away glugging it into their feed.

Worming - alternating worming schedule. Daily worming if you don’t see results after a few cycles.

Proper amount of feed per normal weight of horse and tuned to their individual work.
Gradual weight gain is much better than over doing it.
Too many supplements tend to cause other problems (they tend to blow all that nutrition out their feet in abscesses) so be careful.

Where did you hear this? I have never heard that before

Be consistent.
When changing their diet to more or less feed, do it over a period of a week or so before another change.

Monitor the weight gain with weight tape (I also like to take photos).
When you see them every day, sometimes it is hard to notice the changes.

I am just asking because abcesses usually come from bacteria or trauma

 

[Robin]

This is more what I was saying about over supplementing your horse
alot of danger with adding extra mineral. and yes that can founder a horse

http://www.ker.com/library/Equinews/v11n1/v11n120.pdf

 

[covekat]

Just curious, but how much TC Complete were you feeding? I believe the minimum is 6lbs per day for a 1000 pound horse.

We have had great success with the TC Complete, pelleted rice bran and BOSS (Black Oil Sunflower Seeds). All of my TB's have a BS of at least 6-7 (even the 23 yr old mare). They are also given Electrolytes, Probious daily with turnout daily on good pasture and all the hay they can eat in the barn.

I would also do a fecal, and probably treat for ulcers too.

 

[Robin]

Just curious, but how much TC Complete were you feeding? I believe the minimum is 6lbs per day for a 1000 pound horse.

We have had great success with the TC Complete, pelleted rice bran and BOSS (Black Oil Sunflower Seeds). All of my TB's have a BS of at least 6-7 (even the 23 yr old mare). They are also given Electrolytes, Probious daily with turnout daily on good pasture and all the hay they can eat in the barn.

I would also do a fecal, and probably treat for ulcers too.

Great advice

 

[Phyxius]

There is a chart that lists all of the southern states feeds, including "Legends," which gives the ratio of weight per quart. Sadly it is not available online. But you can email them and they will gladly send it to you.

Corn Oil is ok, but I am not a huge fan of corn oil. In small amounts yes, but I think some people get carried away glugging it into their feed.

Worming - alternating worming schedule. Daily worming if you don’t see results after a few cycles.

Proper amount of feed per normal weight of horse and tuned to their individual work.

Gradual weight gain is much better than over doing it.
Too many supplements tend to cause other problems (they tend to blow all that nutrition out their feet in abscesses) so be careful.

Be consistent.
When changing their diet to more or less feed, do it over a period of a week or so before another change.

Monitor the weight gain with weight tape (I also like to take photos).
When you see them every day, sometimes it is hard to notice the changes.

Where are you getting your information? I've never heard of "nutrition" causing abscesses.

And, what is your problem with oil? A small amount of oil will have little to no effect on any horse. Horses can process a huge amount of fat in their diets. In fact horses with conditions like EPSM NEED extra fat in their diets. Fat provides more than twice the calories per volume compared to carbohydrates. For example, 2 cups of oil (approximately one pound) provide about 4,000 calories, whereas one pound of corn, oats, sweet feed, or other commercial feed provides only 1,200 to 1,400 calories.

 

[fredsaid2]

Where are you getting your information? I've never heard of "nutrition" causing abscesses.

An 'alternative' Internet ??

 

[CountryLady]

Where are you getting your information? I've never heard of "nutrition" causing abscesses.

And, what is your problem with oil? A small amount of oil will have little to no effect on any horse. Horses can process a huge amount of fat in their diets. In fact horses with conditions like EPSM NEED extra fat in their diets. Fat provides more than twice the calories per volume compared to carbohydrates. For example, 2 cups of oil (approximately one pound) provide about 4,000 calories, whereas one pound of corn, oats, sweet feed, or other commercial feed provides only 1,200 to 1,400 calories.

My caution was in over doing it with supplements. Maybe abscesses is not the correct term. I realize that abscesses come from bacteria /trauma. But I have also seen cases where horses (barefoot) were getting a huge amounts of supplements and in addition grazing on nice pasture (high in nutrient) and NO trauma to the feet , blowing out the soles of their feet regularly until the diet was changed. The remedy is the same as abscesses.

Too often we look for a quick fix. MORE is sometimes LESS.

Like I said in reference to oil:
"In small amounts yes, but I think some people get carried away."

 

[Robin]

My caution was in over doing it with supplements. Maybe abscesses is not the correct term. I realize that abscesses come from bacteria /trauma. But I have also seen cases where horses (barefoot) were getting a huge amounts of supplements and in addition grazing on nice pasture (high in nutrient) and NO trauma to the feet , blowing out the soles of their feet regularly until the diet was changed. The remedy is the same as abscesses.

Too often we look for a quick fix. MORE is sometimes LESS.

Like I said in reference to oil:
"In small amounts yes, but I think some people get carried away."

your still a little confusing, on what you are saying. minerals and supplements or lush pasture do not cause abcesses. They can cause a horse to founder.

 

[CountryLady]

your still a little confusing, on what you are saying. minerals and supplements or lush pasture do not cause abcesses. They can cause a horse to founder.

But this is not the situation I was speaking of.

SO, let me add. NOT FOUNDERED!

 

[CountryLady]

This is more what I was saying about over supplementing your horse
alot of danger with adding extra mineral. and yes that can founder a horse

http://www.ker.com/library/Equinews/v11n1/v11n120.pdf

The article does say that over supplementing can backfire, but it doesn't mention founder. Did I miss it? :shrug:

 

[Robin]

The article does say that over supplementing can backfire, but it doesn't mention founder. Did it miss it? :shrug:

oversupplementing can cause other issues. No it did not miss it.

 

[Robin]

oversupplementing can cause other issues. No it did not miss it.

This is why you should always, always ask your animals vet before you put the horse on multiple supplements. Only so much nutrition can be safely absorbed.

 

[CountryLady]

oversupplementing can cause other issues. No it did not miss it.

Of course over supplementing can cause other issues......, excess selenium being one of the major ones. JMO

 

[CountryLady]

This is why you should always, always ask your animals vet before you put the horse on multiple supplements. Only so much nutrition can be safely absorbed.

VERY TRUE!

 

[Robin]

Too many supplements tend to cause other problems (they tend to blow all that nutrition out their feet in abscesses) so be careful.

I think this was the sentence that threw me for a loop. Never heard of nutrition blowing out the feet.

 

[CountryLady]

Density Measurements of Horse Feed

Horse Feed-Pounds per Quart
Legends Performance (Pelleted)-1.48
Legends Performance (Textured)-1.70
Legends Pelleted Rice Bran (Pelleted)-1.38
Triple Crown Complete (Textured)-1.01

To keep horses healthy it is important to feed them a balanced ration that meets THEIR nutritional needs.

Nutritional needs vary considerably among horses depending on age, weight, and level of activity.

There are no magic supplements, high performance feed secrets or short cuts that will transform any given horse overnight.

Horses naturally use forage as a primary component of their diets. Forages are a basic necessity of normal functioning digestive system and forage requirements are supplied most easily by pasture and hay.

Horse’s Basic Nutrition Needs - free choice:
*Forage (pasture or Hay)
*Clean Fresh Water
*Salt/Mineral Block

IMO: “More Hay - Less Grain”

If your horse is on a dry lot (or sparsely populated with forage), most of the time there is a higher increase of risk for internal parasites.

Horses do not digest low-quality forages effectively, so a premium should be placed on using high-quality forages in the horse’s diet. Poor digestion of Low quality forages can limit the amount of dry matter a horse can eat to the extent that daily nutrient requirements are not met. Most mature horses performing minimal or no work can be maintained on High-quality forages without supplementing their diet with grain.

Some hay suppliers will have their Hay tested thru the extension office for Nutritional Content.

 

[CountryLady]

Southern States Feed Density Chart

See attached