Bias-free education

[kwillia]

Decades ago my class had to write an English class paper on a controversial subject. We had to take a side and explain why we felt the way we did. I did mine on hunting. I took a pro stance. Many classmates chose abortion. I did not get a grade that I felt the paper deserved. Most of the comments the teacher wrote on the paper were things that she disagreed with in my argument. She never commented on my sentences nor paragraphs. I didn't realize that we were going to be graded on how she felt about the subject. I figured that she was looking to see if we used techniques we learned in her class. As I sit here typing this today it really doesn't matter what grade on got on that paper. I did an assignment to the best of my abilities as I understood the task at hand.

That still happens today as well. There is no recourse for teachers who chose to grade on opinion rather than technique and structure. When it is a mandatory credit class, students really are forced to write to what the teacher wants to read or else their grades will suffer for it.

 

[Hodr]

Tailoring your speech is not the same as espousing things you don't believe in. Would you like the C I got on a paper in Soc, where I talked about how the judicial system reduces a fathers rights to almost nil? Or should I have lied and praised a system that gives kids back to drug addicted mothers rather than fathers who care?

I think the option most would have went with was to avoid topics that you know may be landmines for the professor, especially if you believe the professor to be of the type that would down-grade your work because they disagree with it. In my experience difference of opinion was more often met with open discussion rather than spiteful attacks on your work.

Also, unless you attended a small school there is a very good chance your work was graded by a TA, not the professor. I once received a D on a paper (the only D I ever received in my life), and I took it to the professor to ask how I could have misinterpreted the point of the exercise so entirely. He took 5 minutes to look it over, told me his TA must have been drunk and gave me an A.

 

[Hodr]

Decades ago my class had to write an English class paper on a controversial subject. We had to take a side and explain why we felt the way we did. I did mine on hunting. I took a pro stance. Many classmates chose abortion. I did not get a grade that I felt the paper deserved. Most of the comments the teacher wrote on the paper were things that she disagreed with in my argument. She never commented on my sentences nor paragraphs. I didn't realize that we were going to be graded on how she felt about the subject. I figured that she was looking to see if we used techniques we learned in her class. As I sit here typing this today it really doesn't matter what grade on got on that paper. I did an assignment to the best of my abilities as I understood the task at hand.

For the teacher not to provide feedback for why you received a poor grade is bad form. But without actual review none of us can know what you truly "deserved" to be graded. I am reminded of school children who think they know more than their teachers, and believe their work to be superior because mommy/daddy liked it, when clearly they are full of beans. Not saying that is the case with your work, it probably isn't. But when I consider the average teenager and the average teacher, I am more likely to believe the teacher's interpretation of the work.

 

[musiclady]

so instead of writing a paper on extolling how you really felt, you censored yourself to get a passing grade


and this benefited you how ?

This was more a spin to the way the teacher wanted, not an outright lie. I got pretty good at it. I did not do this if I felt strongly about it, and I did just not bring up an idea if it would only cause me grief. Most of these were for classes that were merely required, not in my chosen major. This is what the teacher would believe was the right answer. I also limited my answers to exactly what was presented in class. I wanted to save my arguments for times they would matter or do some good. Some of these professors wouldn't ever understand someone else's view anyway. I just decided they weren't worth the cost. This didn't happen often - but sometimes you get stuck in a class and this was easier than dropping it and finding time to work another class in.

Have you never censored yourself at work to avoid a useless confrontation? You have to do this frequently in life just to get along with others. Not every encounter has to match my own views, or even be a threat to my views.

 

[musiclady]

Decades ago my class had to write an English class paper on a controversial subject. We had to take a side and explain why we felt the way we did. I did mine on hunting. I took a pro stance. Many classmates chose abortion. I did not get a grade that I felt the paper deserved. Most of the comments the teacher wrote on the paper were things that she disagreed with in my argument. She never commented on my sentences nor paragraphs. I didn't realize that we were going to be graded on how she felt about the subject. I figured that she was looking to see if we used techniques we learned in her class. As I sit here typing this today it really doesn't matter what grade on got on that paper. I did an assignment to the best of my abilities as I understood the task at hand.

After finding this out, did you adjust your writing in your next paper for this teacher or continue to accept the lower grade because of her bias?

 

[Monello]

For the teacher not to provide feedback for why you received a poor grade is bad form. But without actual review none of us can know what you truly "deserved" to be graded. I am reminded of school children who think they know more than their teachers, and believe their work to be superior because mommy/daddy liked it, when clearly they are full of beans. Not saying that is the case with your work, it probably isn't. But when I consider the average teenager and the average teacher, I am more likely to believe the teacher's interpretation of the work.

I would have taken the grade better if the comments weren't all things like "I don't believe that", "They always say that", "How can that be?", and things similar to those comments. Now if the comments were "Run on sentence here", "2 ideas in 1 paragraph, break those 2 points up", etc. it would have been easier to understand the grade.

 

[Larry Gude]

This was more a spin to the way the teacher wanted, not an outright lie. I got pretty good at it. I did not do this if I felt strongly about it, and I did just not bring up an idea if it would only cause me grief. Most of these were for classes that were merely required, not in my chosen major. This is what the teacher would believe was the right answer. I also limited my answers to exactly what was presented in class. I wanted to save my arguments for times they would matter or do some good. Some of these professors wouldn't ever understand someone else's view anyway. I just decided they weren't worth the cost. This didn't happen often - but sometimes you get stuck in a class and this was easier than dropping it and finding time to work another class in.

Have you never censored yourself at work to avoid a useless confrontation? You have to do this frequently in life just to get along with others. Not every encounter has to match my own views, or even be a threat to my views.

You seem to be a pretty clear, rational thinker. That probably makes you a national threat of some kind!

 

[Monello]

After finding this out, did you adjust your writing in your next paper for this teacher or continue to accept the lower grade because of her bias?

I'm sure in the end I got the grade I deserved in that class. I don't remember making any effort to change my style for any future papers. The thing I remember after all these years was my reaction to reading her comments and how they had nothing to do with English but everything to do with the way she felt about the topic I chose to write about.

 

[molly_21]

Why is it news that student write papers to their professors views? This happens a lot, trust me. If people want to admit it or not, people (either yourself or parents) pay good money to go to school. Most students want to just get college/grad school over and done with. So if you pander to the professor to get that A or B. Then students do it. If the have to write about Dora the Explore to get a passing grade, guess what, I am writing the best paper about a kids show I don't like to get that A.

 

[Vince]

Background:










Now:

Why should students have to pay to take a class, only to find out that the professor is an ideologue who, PS, grades based on how well you subscribe to his political agenda? And why should you have to change schools until you finally find instructors who aren't zealots? That's ridiculous. Most young people can't afford to just change schools every semester.

Teachers and professors should teach their subject, not use their class like a bully pulpit to spout their nonsense. That goes for right AND left. Unless the school specifies that it takes an ideologically biased approach, they should be neutral. It's completely unfair and unAmerican that they have a hammer hold on our young people who are just trying to get some higher education.

I couldn't put up with some college professor giving me his leftist BS. They are there to teach a particular subject and not to impart their personal agenda. I would definitely speak my mind and probably get a failing grade or drop the class. Lucky I didn't have to take those type of classes in college.

 

[Larry Gude]

Why is it news that student write papers to their professors views? This happens a lot, trust me. If people want to admit it or not, people (either yourself or parents) pay good money to go to school. Most students want to just get college/grad school over and done with. So if you pander to the professor to get that A or B. Then students do it. If the have to write about Dora the Explore to get a passing grade, guess what, I am writing the best paper about a kids show I don't like to get that A.

Best friends mom told me a long time ago that the point of getting a degree is to show future employers you know how to over come obstacles and achieve goals. That passing, whatever the grade, is step one. Has nothing to do with the subjects and everything to do with figuring out how to get a passing grade.

 

[vraiblonde]

Has nothing to do with the subjects and everything to do with figuring out how to get a passing grade.

Which is why I decided to stop giving them money. I was there for the actual learning, not just passing the class. I could CLEP most of those classes on the cheap if all I wanted was a paper saying I's smort.

I loathed math until I took college algebra and statistics, then I couldn't get enough of those little number puzzles and formulas. I loved churning out papers for my English prof (once I dumped the first ahole's class). I was looking forward to my Sociology class until I realized it was a super easy A because the prof didn't use a book, you wrote down everything he said, then took your tests open note (this left more time for him to give his "hate America and white people" speeches). I hated it and didn't learn a thing, but not surprisingly he gets rave reviews on RateMyProfessor.

So, for my purposes, college wasn't for me. I decided to use that time and money for travel instead.

 

[kwillia]

Why is it news that student write papers to their professors views? This happens a lot, trust me. If people want to admit it or not, people (either yourself or parents) pay good money to go to school. Most students want to just get college/grad school over and done with. So if you pander to the professor to get that A or B. Then students do it. If the have to write about Dora the Explore to get a passing grade, guess what, I am writing the best paper about a kids show I don't like to get that A.

Exactly. My daughter learned in her first year of college that the tone of the paper had better match that of the beliefs of the professor or else grades would indeed suffer the consequence. She is extremely grateful that her degrees are math and chemistry and those classes don't leave grades open to interpretation.

 

[snake]

How about a bias-free education prior to college? Seems like so many educators have gotten agendas nowadays and will just threaten CPS or other things if they can't teach what they want. You are supposed to EDUCATE academics, not impose your subjective life-views upon impressionable children. Way too many bad stories out there, but hopefully we will get some good teachers along the way. They can't all be nuts.

Not looking forward to my children attending school.

 

[Larry Gude]

I was there for the actual learning, .

Commie

 

[bilbur]

Best friends mom told me a long time ago that the point of getting a degree is to show future employers you know how to over come obstacles and achieve goals. That passing, whatever the grade, is step one. Has nothing to do with the subjects and everything to do with figuring out how to get a passing grade.

My parents had a similar view, they told me it was so employers knew that you were able to suck it up for 4 or 5 years and you were trainable. I got my degree late in life, just 2 years ago, and I had one teacher that publicly ridiculed me for stating what he said was my opinion. I quietly showed him he was wrong and he acted like a baby criticizing me on the public forum (this was an online class). I only had 3 classes left so I went to my adviser and told him if he did not remove me from class I would transfer my credits and graduate from another school. After reading the transcript of our interactions, his public and mine in a private forum between myself and him, I was transferred to another instructor at no cost to me. I didn't have any problems prior to him and after him so all in all it was an OK experience not counting the late nights and no free time for 4 years.

 

[libertytyranny]

So you compromised your values and beliefs (lied) in order to get a good grade?

Sometimes, yes. Its called playing the game and sometime that's a more important lesson to learn than whatever ridiculous core course you're forced to take.

 

[libertytyranny]

Granted, I will say that I had my share of arguments with professors in school. I had one in particular that I just decimated in front of the class after he said some really stupid things. I spent all night researching and printing and gave him a real rebuttal live in class. He sharpened my argument skills and kept me on my toes. He was a big dummy, but always fair with grading. As most are. In general, you will not fail classes for having a different viewpoint if you present your argument in a clear academic way and you do the work. I've never had one dock my grade and I am quite argumentative

 

[bilbur]

Sometimes, yes. Its called playing the game and sometime that's a more important lesson to learn than whatever ridiculous core course you're forced to take.

This is the way it is in the work world too. We have probably all had to swallow our tong and pride when dealing with a boss, customer, or co-worker. You do what you have to do to keep a job and keep food on the table. Keeping it real might feel good in the short term but it is also a quick way to get fired.

 

[MMDad]

Why should students have to pay to take a class, only to find out that the professor is an ideologue who, PS, grades based on how well you subscribe to his political agenda?

You rarely see students who are actually paying for their own classes. Most are a combination of grants, loans, scholarships, parents, or employer paid. The only market forces are from keeping the grant and loan money rolling in. Those who drop a class due to bias are such a small, insignificant minority that the schools really do not care.

You are assuming that the "customer" of the school is the student, but it is not. That's the whole problem with the system.