Bullying

[Sweet 16]

My kids are being raised to defend themselves, and others. That's how I grew up. You didn't run from bullies, you knocked 'em on their ass. You never started trouble, but you damn sure didn't run from it or turn a blind eye either. I think that is a good way to live. And if the schools today don't like it, they can kiss my ass. I'll home school before I groom my children into habitual victims.

Maybe the problem is to stop encouraging kids to allow themselves to be victimized... for that is what we are really doing. Grooming our kids to be sheep.

AMEN! This says it all. We're grooming our kids to be sheep because that is how the government wants them -- future generations of docile, compliant victims for the government to take care of and rule over. And that is precisely why the government is intruding so deeply into our kids' lives. Yes there have been extreme cases where the kids committed suicide and that is truly tragic, but it is a tiny number compared to the number of past and present generations of kids who have been bullied (to varying degrees), and came out relatively unscathed.

I have taught my son not to start trouble, but he knows if he is physically attacked, he darn well has a right to defend himself and I will back him up all the way.

 

[TurboK9]

AMEN! This says it all. We're grooming our kids to be sheep because that is how the government wants them -- future generations of docile, compliant victims for the government to take care of and rule over. And that is precisely why the government is intruding so deeply into our kids' lives. Yes there have been extreme cases where the kids committed suicide and that is truly tragic, but it is a tiny number compared to the number of past and present generations of kids who have been bullied (to varying degrees), and came out relatively unscathed.

I have taught my son not to start trouble, but he knows if he is physically attacked, he darn well has a right to defend himself and I will back him up all the way.

Hehe. The only other time Connor was in a physical incident at school, was in FL, when he was in Kindergarten. A fifth grader was making fun of him, and shoved him. He gave the kid a black eye. When the school called and told me he hit the kid, I asserted that the problem was not my child, it was the fact that somehow he, while on the walk outside the school waiting for his bus, was left apparently unsupervised for long enough to get mixed up with a fifth grader, get in a verbal altercatioon, then a physical, all the while not being noticed by a teacher? Why?

They dropped it.

I told the teacher "You'll have to excuse me for being proud of my son for standing up to someone twice his size."

I knew the gym teacher personally, and apparently the next day he asked the older boy who hit him. "Connor." "Connor Byrne? The Kindergartner?" "Yeah. I didn't think he'd hit me!"

LOL. RESPECT. This kid actually befriended Connor after that, and stopped picking on the little kids.

Expecting our children to 'tell a teacher' is like expecting us to 'call the police'. Although I respect both, reality is they can't do anything until AFTER the incident. Damage done. Both are reavctive. Only the kids (or us, as they case may be) can be proactive, and actually STOP it. Research has shown that emotion pain is felt just the same way as physical pain, indeed, sometimes it can be worse. Doesn't matter if it's a push, punch, or mean words. It HURTS. I say, let our kids fight back. Dammit.

 

[Pete]

Hehe. The only other time Connor was in a physical incident at school, was in FL, when he was in Kindergarten. A fifth grader was making fun of him, and shoved him. He gave the kid a black eye. When the school called and told me he hit the kid, I asserted that the problem was not my child, it was the fact that somehow he, while on the walk outside the school waiting for his bus, was left apparently unsupervised for long enough to get mixed up with a fifth grader, get in a verbal altercatioon, then a physical, all the while not being noticed by a teacher? Why?

To me this is the crux of the problem. Yea yea we all know our kids, at least we think we do but when I get a call I never automatically dismiss it as "not the boy's fault" off hand. I will certainly inquire and withhold judgement until I know the story and he has completed interrogation to my satisfaction, but I am not going to dismiss some teacher or principal as wrong.

 

[vraiblonde]

To me this is the crux of the problem. Yea yea we all know our kids, at least we think we do but when I get a call I never automatically dismiss it as "not the boy's fault" off hand. I will certainly inquire and withhold judgement until I know the story and he has completed interrogation to my satisfaction, but I am not going to dismiss some teacher or principal as wrong.

Yeah because, unfortunately, there were several times that I got a call from the school or bus driver, and it was indeed Young Douglas who instigated the altercation.

 

[RoseRed]

To me this is the crux of the problem. Yea yea we all know our kids, at least we think we do but when I get a call I never automatically dismiss it as "not the boy's fault" off hand. I will certainly inquire and withhold judgement until I know the story and he has completed interrogation to my satisfaction, but I am not going to dismiss some teacher or principal as wrong.

Yeah because, unfortunately, there were several times that I got a call from the school or bus driver, and it was indeed Young Douglas who instigated the altercation.

Pete was a bully the other night.

 

[vraiblonde]

Pete was a bully the other night.

Pfft. It almost took that guy too long to figure out when to quit - that's not Pete's fault.

 

[TurboK9]

To me this is the crux of the problem. Yea yea we all know our kids, at least we think we do but when I get a call I never automatically dismiss it as "not the boy's fault" off hand. I will certainly inquire and withhold judgement until I know the story and he has completed interrogation to my satisfaction, but I am not going to dismiss some teacher or principal as wrong.

No, the problem is, you assume it was, apparently. Or, the other persons kid, in this instance. You ASSUME I dismissed it out of hand, as 'not my kids fault'.

This is a forum. Not every detail is written into a post, you know. Instead of assuming, perhaps you should ask for additional information? Before I made my 'assertion' I was informed that my KINDERGARTEN aged son and one of his classmates had managed to walk away from their group, down the length of the school (about 300'), outside, on a narrow walk, with schoolbuses driving by... to the far end, where a couple older kids where clustered away from their groups. There was NO reason why my son should have been able to traverse that distance unnoticed... with schoolbuses driving by feet away.

At that point, the older kids started to harass the two, and shove them around. Other kids witnessed this and tried to get a teacher, but by the time a teacher intervened it was done.

The conversation went like this- "Your son punched another child while waiting for his bus." "What? Who? Why?" "The other boy is a fifth grader. Apparently he was picking on your son and another boy." "Well what was a fifth grader doing in the kindergarten group?" "He wasn't. Your son was at the wrong end of the school." "What? How did he get down by the older kids?" "Sir, that isn't really the point... He struck another child."

Um, yeah, it sort of is the point, dontcha think?

So yeah. The school effed up. My child did not simply walk up and punch some kid. The incident developed over a course of several minutes, and I knew that before making judgement. Of course, Pete, you assumed I did not... but then, you never asked. When my kids have a problem, I always get the available facts first. Each class and grade waits outside, in a line, for their buses to pull up... and each is with assigned teachers. Where was the supervision? They were worried about my son hitting an older kid. I was worried about him getting hit by a friggin' bus, and being left to his own devices where he easily could have been victimized... It is the SCHOOLS responsibilty to keep him safe, not sit and jabber amongst themselves and text their hubbies about their day, etc. It isn't hard to LOOK ROUND now and then. A 5 YO among 11 YO's is a wee obvious? Hello? What part of 'kidergartner' are we not getting here? I think we all know you don't trust the judgement of ANY 5 YO.

My son was told to stay where he belonged, and given punshment at home befitting the fact that he wandered off. But punish him for standing up to a much bigger kid? I think not.

 

[Pete]

No, the problem is, you assume it was, apparently. Or, the other persons kid, in this instance. You ASSUME I dismissed it out of hand, as 'not my kids fault'.

This is a forum. Not every detail is written into a post, you know. Instead of assuming, perhaps you should ask for additional information? Before I made my 'assertion' I was informed that my KINDERGARTEN aged son and one of his classmates had managed to walk away from their group, down the length of the school (about 300'), outside, on a narrow walk, with schoolbuses driving by... to the far end, where a couple older kids where clustered away from their groups. There was NO reason why my son should have been able to traverse that distance unnoticed... with schoolbuses driving by feet away.

At that point, the older kids started to harass the two, and shove them around. Other kids witnessed this and tried to get a teacher, but by the time a teacher intervened it was done.

The conversation went like this- "Your son punched another child while waiting for his bus." "What? Who? Why?" "The other boy is a fifth grader. Apparently he was picking on your son and another boy." "Well what was a fifth grader doing in the kindergarten group?" "He wasn't. Your son was at the wrong end of the school." "What? How did he get down by the older kids?" "Sir, that isn't really the point... He struck another child."

Um, yeah, it sort of is the point, dontcha think?

So yeah. The school effed up. My child did not simply walk up and punch some kid. The incident developed over a course of several minutes, and I knew that before making judgement. Of course, Pete, you assumed I did not... but then, you never asked. When my kids have a problem, I always get the available facts first. Each class and grade waits outside, in a line, for their buses to pull up... and each is with assigned teachers. Where was the supervision? They were worried about my son hitting an older kid. I was worried about him getting hit by a friggin' bus, and being left to his own devices where he easily could have been victimized... It is the SCHOOLS responsibilty to keep him safe, not sit and jabber amongst themselves and text their hubbies about their day, etc. It isn't hard to LOOK ROUND now and then. A 5 YO among 11 YO's is a wee obvious? Hello? What part of 'kidergartner' are we not getting here? I think we all know you don't trust the judgement of ANY 5 YO.

My son was told to stay where he belonged, and given punshment at home befitting the fact that he wandered off. But punish him for standing up to a much bigger kid? I think not.

Evidently I was wrong to think you are instantly defensive.....oh wait

 

[RoseRed]

Pfft. It almost took that guy too long to figure out when to quit - that's not Pete's fault.

Maybe I started it. I was wrong to put my hands on the drunk chick. I should have let her fall all over me, three times.

 

[TurboK9]

Evidently I was wrong to think you are instantly defensive.....oh wait

Evidently you think there is a reason why nobody should be defensive when you make an assumption and judgement about how they parent? And this is your response?

Gee sorry if it pisses me off that you tried to call out my judgement as a parent based on an assumption and inadequate information... I'm just saying that perhaps such kneejerk reactions as yours toward other parents is part of the problem. So yeah, thanks for your well thought out response there...

:shrug:

 

[Pete]

Evidently you think there is a reason why nobody should be defensive when you make an assumption and judgement about how they parent? And this is your response?

Gee sorry if it pisses me off that you tried to call out my judgement as a parent based on an assumption and inadequate information... I'm just saying that perhaps such kneejerk reactions as yours toward other parents is part of the problem. So yeah, thanks for your well thought out response there...

:shrug:

Good job trying to show you are not one of those instantly defensive parents that go high and right.

As you pointed out this is a forum and one can only go by what you write and I did. If it chaps your ass that I read what you yourself wrote and commented on it and you don't like it then that is your friggin problem.

 

[TurboK9]

Good job trying to show you are not one of those instantly defensive parents that go high and right.

As you pointed out this is a forum and one can only go by what you write and I did. If it chaps your ass that I read what you yourself wrote and commented on it and you don't like it then that is your friggin problem.

Nice to know you don't get instantly defensive. Pot, kettle a little?

Oh, and ditto. Difference of course being that I can come out and say "yep I'm defensive and this is why", rather than simply "that's your friggin' problem".

I really don't care what you post or why. But if it is directed at me, and based on assumption, I see no reason why I should not be entitled to respond. :shrug: Or why that would bother you.

Have a nice day, and if you don't, that's your friggin' problem.

 

[Pete]

Nice to know you don't get instantly defensive. Pot, kettle a little?

Oh, and ditto. Difference of course being that I can come out and say "yep I'm defensive and this is why", rather than simply "that's your friggin' problem".

I really don't care what you post or why. But if it is directed at me, and based on assumption, I see no reason why I should not be entitled to respond. :shrug: Or why that would bother you.

Have a nice day, and if you don't, that's your friggin' problem.

Now you are just being a stooge. You made an admittedly misleading post, I made a comment that you got butt hurt over, you come back and not only "clarify" your original story (Perry Mason would be proud) but you get your ass all up in the air and attempt to ASSAIL me for DARING to make an "assumption and judgement about how they parent" and you lecture me on what "I" should do instead of taking your written word as it is written.

None the less my point stands. If you are one of those who get all defensive for the first ring of the phone you should be butt hurt, if you aren't you should apologize for taking offense and getting all snippy because you jacked up your initial post.

 

[TurboK9]

Now you are just being a stooge. You made an admittedly misleading post, I made a comment that you got butt hurt over, you come back and not only "clarify" your original story (Perry Mason would be proud) but you get your ass all up in the air and attempt to ASSAIL me for DARING to make an "assumption and judgement about how they parent" and you lecture me on what "I" should do instead of taking your written word as it is written.

None the less my point stands. If you are one of those who get all defensive for the first ring of the phone you should be butt hurt, if you aren't you should apologize for taking offense and getting all snippy because you jacked up your initial post.

Funny... I don't see it that way. In fact, I see irony. I see you posting very judgementally, and emphatically so, without taking the time or having the courtesy or consideration to try to clarify anything before doing so... while posting that you don't make a decision without all the facts in place.

Then, when responded to, and feel free to show where I "ASSAIL" you?? you pop off with a simple wiseass remark, rather than any sort of actual intelligent reply. Way to further the conversation.

So I respond in kind. :shrug:

The irony is, this thread is about bullying... seems to me that is exactly what you are doing

You'll have to pardon me for not rolling over and taking it. :shrug:

You don't by any chance wear a pocket protecter and thick coke bottle glasses do you?

 

[vraiblonde]

Who freakin' cares? Go sword fight somewhere else

 

[TurboK9]

Who freakin' cares? Go sword fight somewhere else

Vrai's next!

 

[Pete]

Funny... I don't see it that way. In fact, I see irony. I see you posting very judgementally, and emphatically so, without taking the time or having the courtesy or consideration to try to clarify anything before doing so... while posting that you don't make a decision without all the facts in place.

Then, when responded to, and feel free to show where I "ASSAIL" you?? you pop off with a simple wiseass remark, rather than any sort of actual intelligent reply. Way to further the conversation.

So I respond in kind. :shrug:

The irony is, this thread is about bullying... seems to me that is exactly what you are doing

You'll have to pardon me for not rolling over and taking it. :shrug:

You don't by any chance wear a pocket protecter and thick coke bottle glasses do you?

I'll be your huckleberry If you are going to get bent I might as well go all out.

I bet you are one of those "My little angel couldn't have EVER done what you said, you are CLEARLY retarded and I am calling the school board IMMEDIATLY :SLAM:" types AND I think you are outright lying about your Kindergartener giving a black eye to a 5th grade kid.

 

[TurboK9]

I'll be your huckleberry If you are going to get bent I might as well go all out.

I bet you are one of those "My little angel couldn't have EVER done what you said, you are CLEARLY retarded and I am calling the school board IMMEDIATLY :SLAM:" types AND I think you are outright lying about your Kindergartener giving a black eye to a 5th grade kid.

'fraid I'm not the one that's 'bent' here... but OK! Whatever you say!

 

[MJ]

I'll be your huckleberry If you are going to get bent I might as well go all out.

I bet you are one of those "My little angel couldn't have EVER done what you said, you are CLEARLY retarded and I am calling the school board IMMEDIATLY :SLAM:" types AND I think you are outright lying about your Kindergartener giving a black eye to a 5th grade kid.

My fat cat can beat up your fat cat.

 

[BadGirl]

Can't ya'll just kiss and make up already? :shrug: