DC air crash: the Dembot narrative takes shape

vraiblonde

Board Mommy
PREMO Member
Patron
  • Trump dismantled an aviation advisory committee, which made ATCs instantly incompetent.
  • Hegseth becomes SecDef and all helicopter pilots immediately become incompetent.
  • The helicopter deliberately flew into the plane because Pete Hegseth....hates figure skaters or something.
  • Hegseth was drunk, which made the helicopter pilot....drunk by association? Something like that.

There's a lot of crazy on Twitter today, but the top two ^^ are what the Dembots in the media will run with. "OMG Hegseth was SecDef for 5 minutes and military helicopters are already running into things!" "Trump fired everyone in the FAA and planes started crashing!" "We are less safe because of TRUUUUUUMP!"
 

GregV814

Well-Known Member
  • Trump dismantled an aviation advisory committee, which made ATCs instantly incompetent.
  • Hegseth becomes SecDef and all helicopter pilots immediately become incompetent.
  • The helicopter deliberately flew into the plane because Pete Hegseth....hates figure skaters or something.
  • Hegseth was drunk, which made the helicopter pilot....drunk by association? Something like that.

There's a lot of crazy on Twitter today, but the top two ^^ are what the Dembots in the media will run with. "OMG Hegseth was SecDef for 5 minutes and military helicopters are already running into things!" "Trump fired everyone in the FAA and planes started crashing!" "We are less safe because of TRUUUUUUMP!"
If Pistol Pete was still a secretary titsack feeding his baby this wouldnt have happened.
 

SamSpade

Well-Known Member
PREMO Member
Without conspiracy theory crap ---

From what I have read, this kind of flying done domestically is usually a training flight, although from what I can tell, the pilot himself was experienced. Actual Blackhawk pilots have on X mentioned, they have found themselves in similar situations, because of the limitations of both kinds of craft - one mentioned a near head on collision miss that they avoided by mere seconds - that he was on.

What I DON'T get is - I've seen the flight paths of both aircraft - and the chopper was flying more or less down the Potomac, mostly following its path. ANYONE who's ever flown into Reagan knows, that whole area is full of planes arriving and taking off. I can't imagine in a million years, wanting to fly a chopper - at night - in that area around Washington.

It just seems crazy. I don't imagine that once they were on a collision path there was much chance to avoid it. It's not like playing chicken on the roadway. And I don't fly - I just trust the testimony of other pilots who have discussed the limitations of the aircraft =

Lifted from a Twitter post --

I spent some time as a Blackhawk crew chief here in the Wisconsin Guard and I was on a flight once with 5 crew on board and no one saw a GA aircraft headed right for us until probably 5 seconds before impact. The pilot noticed just in time to bank hard left and avoid the aircraft. One pilot was reviewing an emergency checklist for a simulated mechanical failure, while the the other was checking our destination on the GPS. All three crew members in the back had no line of sight directly in front of the aircraft. The GA aircraft had no transponder on, so the pilots did not see him on the map. And this was at probably 1000 ft altitude in the Wisconsin countryside. We were the only two aircraft in a 10 mile radius and almost hit eachother head on. Conclusion: most blackhawk flights stateside are training missions, and the crew can very easily become task saturated. Combine this with the SIGNIFICANTLY reduced field of view under night vision goggles, which the crew would have had to be using per SOP for night flights. For the landing passenger aircraft, they have basically 0 view beneath them. They would be relying almost 100% on ATC and their instruments. Although rare, this terrible coincidence is very possible. The potential savior here would have been ATC recognizing that not everyone was completely aware of eachother whereabouts, and telling the passenger aircraft to do a "go around", which means to cancel landing procedures and punch full throttle and climb in altitude to avoid potential dangers. I will likely get a safety briefing in coming days from the Army on what happened in the blackhawk, but regardless of that, ATC should have called a go around. Just my two cents.
 

LtownTaxpayer

Well-Known Member
Without conspiracy theory crap ---

From what I have read, this kind of flying done domestically is usually a training flight, although from what I can tell, the pilot himself was experienced. Actual Blackhawk pilots have on X mentioned, they have found themselves in similar situations, because of the limitations of both kinds of craft - one mentioned a near head on collision miss that they avoided by mere seconds - that he was on.

What I DON'T get is - I've seen the flight paths of both aircraft - and the chopper was flying more or less down the Potomac, mostly following its path. ANYONE who's ever flown into Reagan knows, that whole area is full of planes arriving and taking off. I can't imagine in a million years, wanting to fly a chopper - at night - in that area around Washington.

It just seems crazy. I don't imagine that once they were on a collision path there was much chance to avoid it. It's not like playing chicken on the roadway. And I don't fly - I just trust the testimony of other pilots who have discussed the limitations of the aircraft =

Lifted from a Twitter post --

I spent some time as a Blackhawk crew chief here in the Wisconsin Guard and I was on a flight once with 5 crew on board and no one saw a GA aircraft headed right for us until probably 5 seconds before impact. The pilot noticed just in time to bank hard left and avoid the aircraft. One pilot was reviewing an emergency checklist for a simulated mechanical failure, while the the other was checking our destination on the GPS. All three crew members in the back had no line of sight directly in front of the aircraft. The GA aircraft had no transponder on, so the pilots did not see him on the map. And this was at probably 1000 ft altitude in the Wisconsin countryside. We were the only two aircraft in a 10 mile radius and almost hit eachother head on. Conclusion: most blackhawk flights stateside are training missions, and the crew can very easily become task saturated. Combine this with the SIGNIFICANTLY reduced field of view under night vision goggles, which the crew would have had to be using per SOP for night flights. For the landing passenger aircraft, they have basically 0 view beneath them. They would be relying almost 100% on ATC and their instruments. Although rare, this terrible coincidence is very possible. The potential savior here would have been ATC recognizing that not everyone was completely aware of eachother whereabouts, and telling the passenger aircraft to do a "go around", which means to cancel landing procedures and punch full throttle and climb in altitude to avoid potential dangers. I will likely get a safety briefing in coming days from the Army on what happened in the blackhawk, but regardless of that, ATC should have called a go around. Just my two cents.
I watched a gentleman interviewed who participates in these investigations and has been a pilot for many years. He said that the commercial plane was directed to a different runway from the one that is "normally" used. He said of the thousands of flights that he has flown at national he had only been on that runway less than a dozen times.

My own national flights as a passenger were always on the runway parallel to the river. The other runway requires a cross river approach. I still remember the Air Florida crash oh so many years ago. This is awful for everyone.
 
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SamSpade

Well-Known Member
PREMO Member
All the keyboard warriors saying Pete was drunk last night piss me off.
They're along the same lines as the ones screeching that egg prices haven't changed -

IN HIS FIRST WEEK ON THE JOB.

I'll grant you - Trump has a longstanding habit of claiming he can solve major problems in mere minutes. I'm still wondering about the Ukraine war he was going to fix the first day. But geez, inflation numbers come out once a month for a reason.
 

Hijinx

Well-Known Member
The airplane was obviously doing what it was told to do by the air flight technician.
WTH the helicopter was doing I have no idea, but it seems crazy that helicopters are allowed to cross over the landing patterns of incoming aircraft.

On the ground no pick-up truck or emergency vehicle or anything else is allowed to get in the way of landing aircraft. All have to get permission to cross the runway, yet helicopters are allowed to cross over the flight paths of airplanes in the air?
I don't know anything about this, but it seems crazy to me that helicopters are allowed to run up and down the river where airplanes are landing.
As soon as I heard this I told my wife the helicopter was at fault. I still feel that way. I am sure investigations will determine what happened and make some new rules, but the new rules will not help those killed last night. May they Rest in Peace.
 

vraiblonde

Board Mommy
PREMO Member
Patron
All the keyboard warriors saying Pete was drunk last night piss me off.

Because even if he was what on earth would that have to do with the crash? :lol:

The media sets up these narratives and they take on a life of their own. Every crazy out there thinks Trump is a rapist and Hegseth is a drunk. Oh, and Tulsi is a Russian spy.

:crazy:

I'm not a huge fan of "anonymous rando on the internet says blah blah blah and they really sounded like they knew what they were talking about 🤪" They have all the credibility of MSNBC "experts". I'd like to know facts and so far all we *know* is that a Black Hawk collided with a commercial plane. It *sounds like* the heli was at fault, but we don't know that yet. It wouldn't surprise me and it shouldn't surprise anyone living even remotely close to Pax. Accidents happen and it doesn't have to be this big conspiracy. It can simply be an unfortunate training accident.
 

thurley42

HY;FR
The airplane was obviously doing what it was told to do by the air flight technician.
WTH the helicopter was doing I have no idea, but it seems crazy that helicopters are allowed to cross over the landing patterns of incoming aircraft.

On the ground no pick-up truck or emergency vehicle or anything else is allowed to get in the way of landing aircraft. All have to get permission to cross the runway, yet helicopters are allowed to cross over the flight paths of airplanes in the air?
I don't know anything about this, but it seems crazy to me that helicopters are allowed to run up and down the river where airplanes are landing.
As soon as I heard this I told my wife the helicopter was at fault. I still feel that way. I am sure investigations will determine what happened and make some new rules, but the new rules will not help those killed last night. May they Rest in Peace.
It's a normal travel way for the helos coming in and out....but they have to get cleared through, and everything I'm hearing was the Blackhawk was unresponsive to calls...

Lost my BIL and a friend that were coming home.....still in shock

These Dems are absolute trash.....
 

Hijinx

Well-Known Member
It's a normal travel way for the helos coming in and out....but they have to get cleared through, and everything I'm hearing was the Blackhawk was unresponsive to calls...

Lost my BIL and a friend that were coming home.....still in shock

These Dems are absolute trash.....
My condolences . Wish I could offer more.
 

LtownTaxpayer

Well-Known Member
It's a normal travel way for the helos coming in and out....but they have to get cleared through, and everything I'm hearing was the Blackhawk was unresponsive to calls...

Lost my BIL and a friend that were coming home.....still in shock

These Dems are absolute trash.....
My condolences as well - to you and the rest of their family members.
 

Czar

Well-Known Member
Never let a tragedy go to waste. Never mind all the near misses that Biden did nothing about, nerver mind that Trump's been in office like a day, this crash was caused by Republicans! They want you dead!
 

Ken King

A little rusty but not crusty
PREMO Member
It's a normal travel way for the helos coming in and out....but they have to get cleared through, and everything I'm hearing was the Blackhawk was unresponsive to calls...

Lost my BIL and a friend that were coming home.....still in shock

These Dems are absolute trash.....
Sorry for your loss, may they rest in peace.

If the helo was transiting the area they should have been in contact with Departure Control, while the plane would have been with Approach Control or switched to Tower. As I understand it both craft were in radio contact, but more than likely with different controllers. The recorded audio will be critical to figuring out what actually went wrong.
 

Kyle

Beloved Misanthrope
PREMO Member
It's a normal travel way for the helos coming in and out....but they have to get cleared through, and everything I'm hearing was the Blackhawk was unresponsive to calls...

Lost my BIL and a friend that were coming home.....still in shock

These Dems are absolute trash.....
Sincere condolences to your family.
 

Gilligan

#*! boat!
PREMO Member
Sorry for your loss, may they rest in peace.

If the helo was transiting the area they should have been in contact with Departure Control, while the plane would have been with Approach Control or switched to Tower. As I understand it both craft were in radio contact, but more than likely with different controllers. The recorded audio will be critical to figuring out what actually went wrong.
I heard the copy that NBC posted up. Helo pilot and ATC had what appeared to be a standard/normal exchange regarding clearance for the passenger jet. Then silence....of course.
 
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