DC Gun Ban just got ruled unconstitutional by DC Circuit

Thor

Active Member
Majority opinion:


To summarize, we conclude that the Second Amendment protects an individual right to keep and bear arms. That right existed prior to the formation of the new government under the Constitution and was premised on the private use of arms for activities such as hunting and self-defense, the latter being understood as resistance to either private lawlessness or the depredations of a tyrannical government (or a threat from abroad). In addition, the right to keep and bear arms had the important and salutary civic purpose of helping to preserve the citizen militia. The civic purpose was also a political expedient for the Federalists in the First Congress as it served, in part, to placate their Antifederalist opponents. The individual right facilitated militia service by ensuring that citizens would not be barred from keeping the arms they would need when called forth for militia duty. Despite the importance of the Second Amendment's civic purpose, however, the activities it protects are not limited to militia service, nor is an individual's enjoyment of the right contingent upon his or her continued or intermittent enrollment in the militia.

So, they ruled
1)Just because DC isn't a State doesn't mean the Constitution doesn't apply
2)2nd Amendment is an individual right
3)2nd Amendment isn't limited to militia related activities.

Here's another gem:


"Section 7-2507.02, like the bar on carrying a pistol within the home, amounts to a complete prohibition on the lawful use of handguns for self-defense. As such, we hold it unconstitutional."


The 1 judge that dissented apparently said "DC isn't a state, so the 2nd doesn't apply." Of coruse, if that's true, the entire Constitution wouldn't apply to DC, which is nonsense. Glen at Instapundit (a lawyer) said that the dissenting opinion looks like crap.

Here's the whole opinion: pacer.cadc.uscourts.gov/docs/common/opinions/200703/04-7041a.pdf
 
R

RadioPatrol

Guest
I t will be interesting to see how this plays out ...........
 

protectmd

New Member
This would conclude in THEORY that....

If DC's gun laws were ruled unconstitutional... Does this mean that none of the current gun laws no longer apply in DC? (If this were the case then open carry would be legal because open carry is legal due to the fact that the law defines what you MAY NOT do).

Does this mean that they will allow residents to protect themselves against criminals with firearms once again?

Will DC be giving out concealed carry permits?

Will all criminals be moving to Maryland due to our restrictive gun laws, and the fact that citizens cannot legally defend themselves, not to mention the criminals can sue their victims?
 

awpitt

Main Streeter
Thor said:
Majority opinion:


To summarize, we conclude that the Second Amendment protects an individual right to keep and bear arms. That right existed prior to the formation of the new government under the Constitution and was premised on the private use of arms for activities such as hunting and self-defense, the latter being understood as resistance to either private lawlessness or the depredations of a tyrannical government (or a threat from abroad). In addition, the right to keep and bear arms had the important and salutary civic purpose of helping to preserve the citizen militia. The civic purpose was also a political expedient for the Federalists in the First Congress as it served, in part, to placate their Antifederalist opponents. The individual right facilitated militia service by ensuring that citizens would not be barred from keeping the arms they would need when called forth for militia duty. Despite the importance of the Second Amendment's civic purpose, however, the activities it protects are not limited to militia service, nor is an individual's enjoyment of the right contingent upon his or her continued or intermittent enrollment in the militia.

So, they ruled
1)Just because DC isn't a State doesn't mean the Constitution doesn't apply
2)2nd Amendment is an individual right
3)2nd Amendment isn't limited to militia related activities.

Here's another gem:


"Section 7-2507.02, like the bar on carrying a pistol within the home, amounts to a complete prohibition on the lawful use of handguns for self-defense. As such, we hold it unconstitutional."


The 1 judge that dissented apparently said "DC isn't a state, so the 2nd doesn't apply." Of coruse, if that's true, the entire Constitution wouldn't apply to DC, which is nonsense. Glen at Instapundit (a lawyer) said that the dissenting opinion looks like crap.

Here's the whole opinion: pacer.cadc.uscourts.gov/docs/common/opinions/200703/04-7041a.pdf


Wow! I never thought I’d see the day when the courts finally release that the 2nd amendment protects both the states’ right to organize militias AND individuals’ right to keep and bear arms. I can’t think of another case were they’ve gone this far. I hope this court’s decision ends up in the Supreme Court and is upheld so this can be settle once and for all.
 

ItalianScallion

Harley Rider
:banghead: What is the political problem? It seems that the gov't doesn't want us law abiding citizens to protect ourselves!
A few facts here:
1) Anyone who is afraid of a gun WON'T carry one.
2) Just as with fireworks, driving, voting, etc., someone will ALWAYS screw
things up. Why should EVERYONE be punished for the faults of others?
3) A brief mandatory gun carry class can be used to educate everyone on
the safe use of them.
I've fought for this for years but it's SOOOOOO political.
What's the gov't afraid of, that we might take work from the cops?
Is it a crime if we all have a part in reducing crime?
Wouldn't it be nice to read a headline that says; a citizen holds a criminal at bay with his gun until police arrive and arrest him? (The bad guy)
Every state that has "right to carry" laws have low crime rates.
Kill unborn babies, give rights to illegals & criminals, but don't let a Christian pray in school, a gov't office or carry a gun! :doh:
Come on Maryland, if you are such a liberal state, let us arm & protect ourselves! :thewave:
 

bcp

In My Opinion
I think that their hands were forced.
since the time that they made handguns illegal in DC, the gun crime rate has risen.
The only acceptable answer to this is that when only the criminals have guns, (and they know it) they are free to do whatever they please.

I expect that after a short and rise in gun crimes, the count will start to drop rapidly.

the proof as they say, is in the pudding.

once DC actually allows law abiding citizens to possess guns again and the numbers start to drop, other states will have no choice but to revisit their theory of more guns = more gun crimes.

the hard thing to swallow here is that, Maryland is now way more liberal than the District of Columbia.
 

vraiblonde

Board Mommy
PREMO Member
Patron
Curious what happens next. But it is nice to finally have a court say that banning guns is unconstitutional.
 

Thor

Active Member
bcp said:
I think that their hands were forced.
since the time that they made handguns illegal in DC, the gun crime rate has risen.
The only acceptable answer to this is that when only the criminals have guns, (and they know it) they are free to do whatever they please.

I expect that after a short and rise in gun crimes, the count will start to drop rapidly.

the proof as they say, is in the pudding.

once DC actually allows law abiding citizens to possess guns again and the numbers start to drop, other states will have no choice but to revisit their theory of more guns = more gun crimes.

the hard thing to swallow here is that, Maryland is now way more liberal than the District of Columbia.

Actually I think this is going to be the most interesting part. In every state where there is a "shall issue" law violent crime has gone down. What ever will people say when that happens in DC?
 

vraiblonde

Board Mommy
PREMO Member
Patron
Thor said:
Actually I think this is going to be the most interesting part. In every state where there is a "shall issue" law violent crime has gone down. What ever will people say when that happens in DC?
Simple. They'll say it's because of Adrian Fenty's "tough on crime" policy.
 

chernmax

NOT Politically Correct!!
Yes freakin Yes, if DC folds I pray MD will follow suit or someone will sue MD because of there dumb ass restrictive laws... :wench:


It doesn't take a rocket scientist to know gun laws don't mean sh!t to the lawless... :coffee:
 

2ndAmendment

Just a forgiven sinner
PREMO Member
This is going to be very interesting. Good timing to use in the hearings in Maryland, too. :yay:
 

edinsomd

New Member
I’m all for responsible citizens defending themselves. But think this through, folks. If DC comes to its senses and returns 2nd Amendment rights to its citizens, where are all the gang bangers, car jackers, crack heads, and street thugs going to go to make a living? Virginia and Pennsyl-tucky won’t be very attractive to them. One could hope they migrate to New Jersey or New York City, but that would require some small effort on their part, so that’s not likely.
Ever been to Suitland?
Ed
 

Ponytail

New Member
edinsomd said:
I’m all for responsible citizens defending themselves. But think this through, folks. If DC comes to its senses and returns 2nd Amendment rights to its citizens, where are all the gang bangers, car jackers, crack heads, and street thugs going to go to make a living? Virginia and Pennsyl-tucky won’t be very attractive to them. One could hope they migrate to New Jersey or New York City, but that would require some small effort on their part, so that’s not likely.
Ever been to Suitland?
Ed

They'll see the err of their ways and enroll in college, I'm sure. :shrug: Where did they go when Florida allowed it's citizens to carry? Where did the big city thugs in TX go?

I'll tell ya. No where. Because there is still a HUGE majority of folks out there that still will NOT carry and it's easy to cull the herd. Who looks confident, and who doesn't? Little old ladies live everywhere, and will always be easy targets, as are empty houses, cars and businesses.
 

bcp

In My Opinion
Crime does not go down because people are carrying a gun.

crime goes down because they might be carrying a gun.
 

protectmd

New Member
I dunno. Alot of people have been fighting for years here in Maryland to change the laws. Things will get worse before they get better. The politicians will be forced to change or when the elections come things will change them. Has anyone realized that every single year the Assault weapons ban is put up in Annapolis and every year it fails? The citizens push for the castle doctrine and CCW reform in Maryland but nobody listens. I for 1 am angry about this....

You elect republicans in because you believe that they can get the job done as far as fixing the problem with the laws and the 2nd amendment. Then they get in office and nothing is done about it all... In fact in a state where the majority of the law makers are democratic not republican we are finding that its other democrats keeping their own in check with their far leftist agenda's.

I agree with the one guy. Its not the fact that someone is carrying a gun that brings down crime, but the fact that they might be.

For those of you who think it wouldn't have an effect on the crime rate your wrong. Look at those states in which there is SHALL ISSUE carry permits or even open carry. US Department of Justice statistics show that gun control only brings up crime.

Maryland will be forced into change at some point. Whether the crime rate skyrockets, or the good citizens move to other states where the state government doesn't restrict their constitutional freedoms and basic freedoms, like the freedom to defend ones self from forcible felonies through the use of not dialing 911 but using a firearm to either detain the knuckleheads or shoot them. But by the time that the state legislature gets its act together will it be too late? Will that be the point in which all the good citizens are gone, adn you have a state of convicted felons and police? Ask yourself that.
 
R

RadioPatrol

Guest
vraiblonde said:
Curious what happens next. But it is nice to finally have a court say that banning guns is unconstitutional.


Wild Thought ....... Case law / precedent, to get other gun bans over turned ?


:cartwheel

( I know put the crack pipe down, and take 12 steps back, as if, there ever would be a repeal of all GGA since 1934 as Un-Constitutional ) :faint:
 

ylexot

Super Genius
Kerad said:
:confused:

Where is all the usual outrage over activist judges?
Ruling that a law goes against the known intent of the Constitution is not judicial activism :shrug:
 
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