Did Judas Believe That Jesus Was The Christ?

[Penn]

Judas had to have the blessing of Jesus, otherwise how would he (Jesus) die for our sins? Judas was only following the plan set out, he was even told to hurry and commit his act. He was chosen to betray Jesus, in order to have Him crucified, to take away the sins of the world.

Number 1: Are you now admitting to Old Testament prophesy being upheld here?

If thats betrayal, then Judas wasnt alone. Peter, the spiritual leader of the early Christian movement, is portrayed as a coward with two failed opportunities to save himself after his initial self-incriminating betrayal. When asked if he was associated with Jesus, we are told that three times he said, "No!" And, then, rather than speak on Jesus' behalf, help him bare the burden of his cross, or even to witness his crucifixion, he chose to hide.

Didn't Jesus tell Peter, "Verily I say unto you - before the sun rises, you will have three times denied me"?

But Peter wasnt alone, when Jesus was tried, and convicted, all of the disciples denied Him. Yes, Judus was given thirty pieces of silver for what he did. But when he was found hanging from a tree, where were the thirty pieces of silver??

Do you not recall where Judas threw those 30 pieces of silver on the ground, in front of those who had payed him for the deed?

You should be asking why God would set Judus up to fulfill what had to be done, then condemn him to die and be separated from God forever? Some think its for the betrayal, but what he did was no worse than all the other disciples, and they recieved forgiveness.

Again, I think Judas was part of, or shall I say the fulfillment, where Daniel and Isaiah spoke of the OT prophesy, gosh, some 450 prior to Jesus's arrival.

Makes sense, does it not?

 

[Nucklesack]

Again, I think Judas was part of, or shall I say the fulfillment, where Daniel and Isaiah spoke of the OT prophesy, gosh, some 450 prior to Jesus's arrival.

Makes sense, does it not?

damn i forgot to copy your post in...

I'm not laying claim one way or another on whether OT prophecy was fullfilled with Judas... though you could envision it was fullfilled if Judas was trying to stop the False Messiah from coming to power (Ha!)

Jesus comments to Peter - Does that excuse Peter for denying him? Or is Jesus fortelling Peter he will deny him, the same as he was proclaiming "One of you will betray me...(or somethign to that effect"

Judas Silver - Yeppers, that was the point, he threw away the money, that according to some was the sole reason for his treachery, just before he took the swing. If money was that important to him, so important that he was willing to betray the Messiah, why would he toss it?
Two possibilities - He felt guilty for his deed (but based on the current dogma he was incapable of this amount of introspection or guilt, remember the description of Judas as it stand today), He believed Jesus to be the Messiah and knew his role as the "Betrayer" necessary for Jesus to fullfill his destiny.

Did Daniel and Isaiah explain durign their prophecy discussion why only some of the prophecies would be fullfilled? Otherwise the Daniel and Isaiah discussion is a coincidence, any number of Jews that were betrayed would fit the bill.

 

[ItalianScallion]

Yes, Judus was given thirty pieces of silver for what he did. But when he was found hanging from a tree, where were the thirty pieces of silver?

Matthew 27 v 3

You should be asking why God would set Judus up to fulfill what had to be done, then condemn him to die and be separated from God forever? Some think its for the betrayal, but what he did was no worse than all the other disciples, and they recieved forgiveness.

Judas was destined to die in his sin. It's clear by Jesus' words that he was evil. God chose him because of that. God didn't choose a believer, allow him to do the evil deed and then condemn him to die.
Forgiveness comes through repentance. Peter, Paul and the others repented but Judas did not. He felt remorseful but he didn't repent, he hung himself.

 

[Penn]

Matthew 27 v 3

Judas was destined to die in his sin. It's clear by Jesus' words that he was evil. God chose him because of that. God didn't choose a believer, allow him to do the evil deed and then condemn him to die.
Forgiveness comes through repentance. Peter, Paul and the others repented but Judas did not. He felt remorseful but he didn't repent, he hung himself.

THIS was the ultimate betrayal. Judas knew what he had done, in the name of Satan. He knew the price, which he, and only he, could be held accountable for.

Maybe, Judas knew, what was in store for his action(s)? Who can say?

 

[ItalianScallion]

Gods ordaining the Antichrist and the end to come just as he said it will happen, so he could give Satan the power.
Scripture does say that it will be someone that was before and is to come.
Also with the satanic trinity with the beast and the false prophet being like a copy cat of the real trinity.
Jesus is God incarnate (in Flesh) so I don't see it being a stretch for Satan. Also we see angels in the old testament that appear as men. The two witness are believed to have been here before.
Actually they both say incarnate, not Reincarnate so that was a slip on my part. I understand the concern of the poor choice of words.

Rev 13 v 3 says: "One of the heads of the beast SEEMED to have a fatal wound, but the fatal wound had been healed." He wasn't dead, he seemed to be. Maybe Pelosi (all that botox makes her look like she was dead....j/k).
And he was "given power". Someone like Obama who was given power by the idiots following his every word??
I think that the beast who "once was, now is not, and yet will come" (Rev 17v8) is not a former living human but the devil himself. The verse says that he will come up out of the Abyss. Remember, he was thrown there for a thousand years and then released (Rev 20 v3).

 

[ItalianScallion]

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THIS was the ultimate betrayal. Judas knew what he had done, in the name of Satan. He knew the price, which he, and only he, could be held accountable for.

Maybe, Judas knew, what was in store for his action(s)? Who can say?

Maybe not at first, but definitely right after he betrayed Jesus.
Jesus made it perfectly clear that Judas was a devil (John 6 v 70).
Not only did He call him that but He said it would be better if he wasn't born (Matt 26 v 24).
Jesus prayed for all the disciples; all except for "the one doomed to destruction so that the Scriptures would be fullfilled" (John 17 v 12).
Doesn't sound like Judas made the cut does it?

 

[Star_Rider]

You should be asking why God would set Judas up to fulfill what had to be done, then condemn him to die and be separated from God forever? Some think its for the betrayal, but what he did was no worse than all the other disciples, and they received forgiveness.

There is a HUGE difference between betrayal and denial. Judas went to the Chief Priests to turn Jesus over for a price. The other Disciples simply ran away because they were afraid of death.

Mark 14:10 "And Judas Iscariot, one of the Twelve, went to the chief priests in order to betray Him to them."​

As for Judas' ultimate judgment Mark 14:21 says it all:

"The Son of Man indeed goes, as it has been written of Him, but woe to that man by whom the Son of Man is betrayed! It were good for that man if he had never been born."​