Holocaust Denial Undermines Islam

[nhboy]

"In the case of the Holocaust, the facts are clear and transmitted from multiple sources. Tens of thousands of Jewish and other individuals who survived the death camps and other horrors of Nazi Germany lived to tell of it. Nazis were brought to trial, evidence was presented in court, and they were convicted. Mass graves were found, and gas chambers were discovered, which were clearly not delicing rooms as some callously claimed. The ovens exist and cannot be reduced to an efficient way of preventing cholera outbreaks or disposing of victims of starvation. I have personally met many Holocaust survivors and their children. I have seen tattoos. I have also heard firsthand accounts of the horrific events. The numbers and details of such events may be legitimate areas of research and inquiry for scholars, but questioning whether the events took place at all undermines the epistemological basis of our collective knowledge. Muslims, of all people, should be conscious of this as their religion is predicated on the same epistemological premises as many major events in history, such as the Holocaust. To deny such things is to undermine Islam as an historical event. That a “conference” examining the historicity of the Holocaust should take place in a Muslim country hosted by a Muslim head of state is particularly tragic and, in my estimation, undermines the historicity of the faith of the people of that state."
LINK

 

[czygvtwkr]

They do this just to piss off the Jews, and they wish they had done it themselves.

 

[MMDad]

They do this just to piss off the Jews, and they are trying to do it themselves.

:fixed:

 

[JPC sr]

Batman

Muslims, of all people, should be conscious of this as their religion is predicated on the same epistemological premises as many major events in history, such as the Holocaust. To deny such things is to undermine Islam as an historical event. That a “conference” examining the historicity of the Holocaust should take place in a Muslim country hosted by a Muslim head of state is particularly tragic and, in my estimation, undermines the historicity of the faith of the people of that state."
LINK

That is a bunch of nonsense.

Claiming that the Holocaust most be true or else Islam must be false too is absurd.

The sad reality is that the world has much emotional rhetoric about the Holocaust but it is impossible to find even one authoritative account of the Nazi extermination efforts.

It is said that recently the archives in Germany have been opened now to scholar scrutiny but it is not out yet.

There are huge problems in the Holocaust reports and no verifiable authoritative sourse to back any of it up.

This is no denying that the Holocaust happened but we do not get relable facts.

There is no book sourse with verified facts, as all we get is unsupported "facts" wrapped in emotional rhetoric.

The worse disparity that I find is that the number "6 million" Jews exterminated is just plain wrong, the Holocaust could have had a million or two or whatever as we just do not know because no reseach is ever reported.

Having 2 million Jews exterminated is still a huge Holocaust but claiming the clearly wrong number of "6 million" makes that part of the Holocaust into a glaring untrue "fact" and that is a very troubling thing to have exposed.

I wait for the day that some hard scholar research to come out but there is none at present.

 

[Roughidle]

:
The worse disparity that I find is that the number "6 million" Jews exterminated is just plain wrong, the Holocaust could have had a million or two or whatever as we just do not know because no reseach is ever reported.

Then how do you know that the number is wrong?

 

[vegmom]

:
The sad reality is that the world has much emotional rhetoric about the Holocaust but it is impossible to find even one authoritative account of the Nazi extermination efforts.

OUT

OF

MY

POLITICAL

PARTY

NOW!!

 

[JPC sr]

Batman

Then how do you know that the number is wrong?

I found the info in a book about the last British emperor King George VI where it said that in the British controlled mandate over Palestine around the year 1923, there was a council meeting between the British and Jewish leaders that took a count of all Jews in Europe and the result was said there were "6 million" Jews living in Europe.

That is the first and foremost source of the "6 million" figure.

Then near the end of World War II the German authorities reported in a document to Hitler that the Nazis had exterminated the "6 million" Jews of Europe and that same document was given to Israel and used to convict in a war crimes trial the German Eichmann in 1961-62 link.

Now we do know that ALL the Jews of Europe were not exterminated and the German camps were not finshed in killing the prisoners and many Jews fled Europe so the six million number simply can not be correct.

And there are other accounts that just do not add up and there is no true scholar reseach available.

We need a book of facts and leave out the emotional rhetoric as is done in accounts of other historical events.

 

[nhboy]

I found the info in a book about the last British emperor King George VI where it said that in the British controlled mandate over Palestine around the year 1923, there was a council meeting between the British and Jewish leaders that took a count of all Jews in Europe and the result was said there were "6 million" Jews living in Europe.

I would be interested in knowing the title of the book mentioned above.

 

[JPC sr]

Batman

I would be interested in knowing the title of the book mentioned above.

I believe it is called "The Last Emperor" as in British Empire King Emperor George VI and I thought it was at the Leonardtown Library but I can not find it in my searches.

It was not listed as a Biography but as a historical account.

I am still looking for it and I hope to return later with the info or link.

Sorry,

 

[Roughidle]

After a little harried research, I found 1933 Jewish population in Europe to be approx. 9.5 million and 1950 Jewish population in Europe to be approx. 3.5 million, a difference of approx. 6 million. I will refine my research now that my interest has been whetted and will link my resources.

 

[nhboy]

I believe it is called "The Last Emperor" as in British Empire King Emperor George VI and I thought it was at the Leonardtown Library but I can not find it in my searches.

It was not listed as a Biography but as a historical account.

I am still looking for it and I hope to return later with the info or link.

Sorry,

Thanks, no hurry.....

 

[MMDad]

around the year 1923, ...there were "6 million" Jews living in Europe.


Then near the end of World War II the German authorities reported in a document to Hitler that the Nazis had exterminated the "6 million" Jews of Europe
Now we do know that ALL the Jews of Europe were not exterminated

So you are saying that if there were six million jews in Europe in 1923, there couldn't have been more than that 20 years later? Are you really that ignorant? Did you know that populations can grow in 20 years?

You also disbelieve the numbers provided by THE PEOPLE WHO DID THE KILLING. Why? Wouldn't they know better than anyone?

You are the lowest possible scum. You are trying to diminish the importance of the holocaust in order to advance your hatred of the jews. You and the rest of the holocaust deniers are disgusting.

 

[JPC sr]

Batman

I would be interested in knowing the title of the book mentioned above.

The book is:


The last emperor : an intimate account of George VI and the fall of his empire / Peter Townsend, print 1976, link HERE.

I am not saying that the Holocaust did not happen or exactly how they came up with the "6 million" ,

what I say is that the so called facts can not be found except in emotionally charged rhetoric and not by any profession scholarly account.

Therefore the facts are all subject to cross examination and all are questionable and have doubt.

 

[nhboy]

The book is:


The last emperor : an intimate account of George VI and the fall of his empire / Peter Townsend, print 1976, link HERE.

Thanks!

 

[This_person]

Claiming that the Holocaust most be true or else Islam must be false too is absurd.

Not what was claimed. I keep telling you, Reading Comprehension would be a great course for you.

The sad reality is that the world has much emotional rhetoric about the Holocaust but it is impossible to find even one authoritative account of the Nazi extermination efforts.

If there was ever a reason to put you on ignore, it's here. However, proving you wrong and a liar over and over and over again is the only real protection for others from your stupidity.

The goals of the International Military Tribunal (IMT) transcended verdict and punishment. The creators of the court were deliberately assembling a public record of the horrific crimes committed by Germans during World War II, including those of the Holocaust. American chief prosecutor Robert Jackson worried that "unless record was made … future generations would not believe how horrible the truth was."

In order to avoid any accusation of exclusive reliance on personal testimony, which later generations might perceive to be biased, prosecutors decided to base their case primarily on thousands of documents written by the Germans themselves.

 

[JPC sr]

Batman

Thanks!

That book only tells of the British / Jewish commission that estimated the number of European Jews at 6 million but it does not talk about the Holocaust or any other of my conclusions given here.

The fact that there is no authoritative book is why we have to get info from various sources and that book is only one of many.

 

[JPC sr]

Batman

So you are saying that if there were six million jews in Europe in 1923, there couldn't have been more than that 20 years later? Are you really that ignorant? Did you know that populations can grow in 20 years?

That makes sense but gov agencies (even those in Germany and Britain) only reference authority sources and it is just incredibly suspicious that the number given to Hitler was the same "6 million" and not 7,013,946 Jews exterminated as the Germans and as all gov's try to always be very precise.

If it said 9 million then the 20 years could be added on but the later 1944 German report to Hitler said 6 million.

This is according to the reports and I did not read the German document but that report is where the now popular "6 million" comes from.

You also disbelieve the numbers provided by THE PEOPLE WHO DID THE KILLING. Why? Wouldn't they know better than anyone?

Given the info was done around 1944 then there is one big logical reason for Eichmann or any Nazi officer to give that "6 million" number to Hitler because around 1944 it would have been a way to convince Hitler that all ALL the Jews were exterminated and that there was no more Jews to kill so then they could get Hitler to start letting them hide the evidence because the attacking armies were fast approaching.

Therefore, the evidence strongly implies that the German claim of killing "6 million" Jews was a lie told to Hitler to get Hitler to order a cover up of the atrocities before Germany lost the war.

That means the "6 million" number is probably very exagerated.

You are the lowest possible scum. You are trying to diminish the importance of the holocaust in order to advance your hatred of the jews. You and the rest of the holocaust deniers are disgusting.

I do not deny the holocaust, but I do say that there is a lot of unreliable info and no reliable authority source.

 

[Giantone]

That book only tells of the British / Jewish commission that estimated the number of European Jews at 6 million but it does not talk about the Holocaust or any other of my conclusions given here.

The fact that there is no authoritative book is why we have to get info from various sources and that book is only one of many.

Someone needs to shut you up................................now your talking out of your butt your ignorance is mind boggling.

 

[Bavarian]

A Holocaust Conference that Iranian President proposed would not be bad. It would show the facts and put an end to the skepticism.

 

[nhboy]

A Holocaust Conference that Iranian President proposed would not be bad. It would show the facts and put an end to the skepticism.

From the statement above it appears that you are not aware that the so called Iranian Holocaust Conference took place in December 2006. It didn't come up with any new "facts", indeed one loon thinks this;

Frederick Toben, an Australian who in 1999 served jail time in Germany for his Holocaust views, told the conference in no uncertain terms that the number of Jews killed in Nazi death camps — an estimated 6 million — is a myth.

''The number of victims at the Auschwitz concentration camp could be about 2,007,'' Toben said. ''The railroad to the camp did not have enough capacity to transfer large numbers of Jews."

LINK

I think its laughable that anyone would trust the Iranian President Ahmadinejad or David Duke to advise them regarding the holocaust.

BTW, the Germans had an extremely efficient rail system during the war. You may want to do some research on WWII, its quite interesting.