In lieu of gas prices - biodiesel?

SamSpade

Well-Known Member
PREMO Member
I guess I disagree. It's not so much the pollution factor - actually, with me, I couldn't care less - it IS the dependence factor. We use oil for EVERYTHING - not just gasoline. And it is SO woven into our economy that eventually, the high price of oil drives up the cost of EVERYTHING - especially since it drives up the costs of transportation.

It's an increasingly scarce resource. You can build houses out of wood and bricks - which you're NEVER going to run out of - but one day, oil is going to becoming much more scarce in comparison to demand, as nations as HUGE as China - AND *India* (which is expected to SURPASS China in population) - begin to demand more.

There's the distribution of oil, which is disturbing - the largest reserves are now in nations at least marginally hostile - or outright hostile to the United States. Oil is to the United States what water is to plants - we CANNOT survive without it - and we can't compete without it.

Where's the incentive for nations such as China, and Russia - who both have HUGE untapped reserves - and the nations of central Asia - to sell to us what they have, so we can kick their azzes in the global economy?

I hate the idea of depending on other countries to continue to survive - and I'd sure like our nation's foreign policy to be unhinged from oil. It'd be nice to tell the oil-producing nations that they can go f*** themselves, 'cause we don't NEED them. We HAVE to interfere with the Middle East, because our survival depends on it - we DON'T have to interfere in say, nations in West Africa, because frankly, we don't need them.
 

Larry Gude

Strung Out
Sam...

...try this on for perspective if you're worried about depedence:

In 1940 the largets exporter of steel and oil in the world, by far, was the US of A.

And we ended up in a war with Japan because WE cut them off from oil and steel.

My point is not to justify Japan attacking us. All they had to do was quit taking over other nations and butchering people and we would have been glad to keep doing buisness with them.

My point is that there is no such thing as 'non' dependence in the world we live in anymore, at least not from the standpoint of insulating ourselves from economic shock and/or blackmail.

If we, as a nation, start ramping up super beans for fuel oil it is going to cost X at the pump, ideally X being less than real diesel, right?

So, what happens to real diesel and those who produce it? Demand drops asa beaner mobiles take over the landscape because their fuel is cheaper AND safe from foreign dependence.

And then, the cost of diesel drops through the floor and the market runs after it. Thus a vicious, artificial cycle. The entire fossil fuel apparatus cannot just sit idle if it has product.

Now, ideally, we ramp up bean oil production in conjuction with dwindling fuel oil supply so that there is no boomerang effect back and forth as one or the other becomes cheaper due to slack demand.

And that IS what will happen WHEN fuel oil is truly running out which is nowhere in our immediate or mid future.

Did you know that US oil EXPORTS have been going up since the latest price surge? Yep. Prior, oil was too cheap on the global market to pump much from here.

Read this if you like:

The Bottomless Well

Peter Huber & Mark Mills

You'll feel better.
 
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