New York's largest health provider fires 1,400 employees who refuse vaccine

[PJay]

And yet...

• ALL of Congress and congressional staff - EXEMPT
• 6,000 White House employees - EXEMPT
• 120,000 Johnson&Johnson employees - EXEMPT
• 2,500 Pfizer employees - EXEMPT
• 1,500 Moderna employees- EXEMPT
• 15,000 CDC employees - EXEMPT
• 14,000 FDA employees- EXEMPT
• 8 MILLION+ CHINESE STUDENTS (85% PLA) - EXEMPT
• 2 MILLION+ ILLEGAL IMMIGRANTS - EXEMPT
• 500,000+ HOMELESS PEOPLE - EXEMPT

 

[PJay]

Makes a lot of sense firing people during a "pandemic".

 

[HemiHauler]

If your employer said, "Do this thing you really don't want to do or we'll fire you," how easy would it be for you to be unemployed overnight? Could you pack up and move at a moment's notice? Find a comparable job within a short timeframe? Or would you just do what they say?

Well I'm retired from active work now, working for my wife's small import company just for fun, but I never held a job that wasn't at-will employment (i.e., no government job EVER, no union job EVER). So of course, I understood I could be fired at any time, for any reason, including no reason at all. I never was fired for any reason, but I left several jobs voluntarily for something else, sometimes without anything lined up. Some when I was single, some when I was married with kids. Sometimes it took six months or more to find something. This is the draw of our capitalist system - it can be incredibly rewarding, but it's also risky. But at the end of the day, if you can't make it here, you are doing something very, very WRONG. When I lived in New York City, my friends and I would often joke that NYC is the most lucrative place to be unemployed and/or homeless because if you can't figure out a way to hustle there, you are doing it wrong. I guarantee you I could go to NYC today, no wallet, no credit/bank cards, no pre-paid/pre-arranged housing and I'd sleep in a warm bed every night and have at least one nutritious meal per day.

Our ancestors took a wagon and a few household goods, threw the kids in the back and took off for Injun country to make a life for themselves. They crossed the plains, and the Black Hills, and the Rockies, and forded rivers in hopes of bettering their lot in life. The very least these people can do is get their lazy asses off the couch and move!

With the kind of money health care folks make, surely moving won't be a problem. Unlike our ancestors, they will at least have a comfortable ride in a sweet "soccer mom" SUV.

 

[vraiblonde]

Well I'm retired from active work now, working for my wife's small import company just for fun

I feel like you're willfully ignoring my point, but I'm willing to give you the benefit of the doubt. So let's try this:

You're retired. What if they said "Do this thing you really don't want to do, or we'll stop your retirement money, put a lien on your house or raise your rent, and shut down your wife's company. Oh, and we'll confiscate your bank account, too"? Think of something you really don't want to do - cut off your grandchild's arm, eat worms, give BJs to all the guys in the nursing home, whatever. Now what if your government or IRA manager or licensing bureau or bank told you to do that thing or they would punish you hard?

Because here's the thing:

If a hospital can do this, anyone can. Your retirement plan manager. Your bank. Your grocery store. They can ALL tell you "No vax, no service". The hospital can not only fire people, it can also say "no vax, no service". And it's easy to say "Oh, well, I'll just go somewhere else," but what happens when there's nowhere else to go?

You're not seeing the big picture here.

 

[vraiblonde]

Our ancestors took a wagon and a few household goods, threw the kids in the back and took off for Injun country to make a life for themselves. They crossed the plains, and the Black Hills, and the Rockies, and forded rivers in hopes of bettering their lot in life. The very least these people can do is get their lazy asses off the couch and move!

Another thing:

I've said that very thing right on here many times (in fact that looks like a quote of me)....about people in ghettos who are getting shot at every day and no grocery store will come near that place so they have to buy food at the Popeye's or corner bodega.

But those are people who have nothing, never had anything, and are never going to get anything as long as they stay in that environment. They literally have nothing to lose.

What we're talking about in this thread are professionals who have homes, jobs, and lives in the city. Everything was fine....until the government decided to **** it up and make these absurd demands. And don't say "Oh, it's a private business" because they are doing their thing based on CDC guidance, and the CDC is in fact an arm of the government. The Mayor and Governor have a lot to do with it as well. So it's not just this hospital making an independent decision.

And again, I don't necessarily disagree with your sentiments, I'm just irritated by your flippant attitude.

 

[GregV814]

(psst): I think I've been insulted by an urban dictionary word, I mean letters, REKT....should I feel bad?
I don't speak ghetto urban.

 

[Gilligan]

(psst): I think I've been insulted by an urban dictionary word, I mean letters, REKT....should I feel bad?
I don't speak ghetto urban.

That arseclown puts a lot of effort in to being what he thinks is being "edgy".

 

[ontheriver]

(in fact that looks like a quote of me)

Imagine that.

 

[black dog]

The problem, of course, is that people typically can't just pack up and leave. They have to sell their house, find another job, if they have kids that adds a big layer.

Most people put their lives together with intention of keeping it that way. They buy a home. They make friends. They put down roots. Then along comes the government to bust that whole thing up, and while one can start over it's not just a walk in the park.

If your employer said, "Do this thing you really don't want to do or we'll fire you," how easy would it be for you to be unemployed overnight? Could you pack up and move at a moment's notice? Find a comparable job within a short timeframe? Or would you just do what they say?

So while I still think this could be a blessing in disguise for many of them who are in a position to leave that shithole, they are going through real trauma right now and I think a little compassion is in order.

Folks do it everyday, if they didn't Ryder, UHaul, Penske and all the moving companies would be out of business.

 

[GregV814]

all I could come up with was this. Years ago, I came upon a car crash. Nobody was seriously hurt but the "at fault" driver, an elderly Asian woman, who spoke little English said repeatedly, " I rekka my cah I rekka my cah".

 

[ontheriver]

Well I'm retired from active work now, working for my wife's small import company just for fun, but I never held a job that wasn't at-will employment (i.e., no government job EVER, no union job EVER). So of course, I understood I could be fired at any time, for any reason, including no reason at all. I never was fired for any reason, but I left several jobs voluntarily for something else, sometimes without anything lined up. Some when I was single, some when I was married with kids. Sometimes it took six months or more to find something. This is the draw of our capitalist system - it can be incredibly rewarding, but it's also risky. But at the end of the day, if you can't make it here, you are doing something very, very WRONG. When I lived in New York City, my friends and I would often joke that NYC is the most lucrative place to be unemployed and/or homeless because if you can't figure out a way to hustle there, you are doing it wrong. I guarantee you I could go to NYC today, no wallet, no credit/bank cards, no pre-paid/pre-arranged housing and I'd sleep in a warm bed every night and have at least one nutritious meal per day.

Our ancestors took a wagon and a few household goods, threw the kids in the back and took off for Injun country to make a life for themselves. They crossed the plains, and the Black Hills, and the Rockies, and forded rivers in hopes of bettering their lot in life. The very least these people can do is get their lazy asses off the couch and move!

With the kind of money health care folks make, surely moving won't be a problem. Unlike our ancestors, they will at least have a comfortable ride in a sweet "soccer mom" SUV.

With all due respect (not really), you are full of it. I do not believe one.word.you.type. That said, your point may be valid. But since you are a liar, well, you know.

 

[RoseRed]

 

[ontheriver]

View attachment 159726

Can't wait.

 

[RoseRed]

Can't wait.

Me too.

 

[HemiHauler]

I feel like you're willfully ignoring my point, but I'm willing to give you the benefit of the doubt. So let's try this:

You're retired. What if they said "Do this thing you really don't want to do, or we'll stop your retirement money, put a lien on your house or raise your rent, and shut down your wife's company. Oh, and we'll confiscate your bank account, too"? Think of something you really don't want to do - cut off your grandchild's arm, eat worms, give BJs to all the guys in the nursing home, whatever. Now what if your government or IRA manager or licensing bureau or bank told you to do that thing or they would punish you hard?

Because here's the thing:

If a hospital can do this, anyone can. Your retirement plan manager. Your bank. Your grocery store. They can ALL tell you "No vax, no service". The hospital can not only fire people, it can also say "no vax, no service". And it's easy to say "Oh, well, I'll just go somewhere else," but what happens when there's nowhere else to go?

You're not seeing the big picture here.

I don't feel I am ignoring your point. But I could say the same about you, that you're willfully ignoring my point. And now I think you're introducing hyperbole to cause fear which you imagine will have the effect of seeing things your way. My point, my sole point is voluntary arrangements. That's it. I am not arguing in favor of mandatory jabs. I am arguing against people who sign up for a job, knowing the terms and the control the employer may have over you due to that employment arrangement. And then bitch and complain when the employer makes good on it. But then again, I'm the type of person who has had a lawyer look over an employment contract before and am aware of the vagaries which are routinely inserted. I've also been an employer, so I know the challenges from both sides. I favor fully voluntary, "at-will" employment, always. Because by definition, both parties win.

Having never seen an employment contact for this hospital system or any hospital system for that matter, I think I can safely say that hospital lawyers wouldn't allow anything that would create such a huge potential liability if this were prima facie illegal. I don't think your point is that this is illegal, I think your point is that it's heavy-handed. OK, so it's heavy-handed. Lots of employment contracts are, if you take the time to read and understand the implications of the small print.

Your comment:

And it's easy to say "Oh, well, I'll just go somewhere else," but what happens when there's nowhere else to go?

just isn't reasonable, as it ignores basic capitalism: someone will fill in the gaps where a profit potential exists. When smoking in bars in restaurants was outlawed around these parts, enterprising folks figured out a way around it (make it a private membership club) and boom, you can go there to smoke. I was in Boston just this past weekend, and while I wore a mask on the airplane (their rules, my trip is voluntary), I don't like wearing the damn things as many folks don't. Some restaurants were clear: they had a sign up indicating "masks required to enter and when not actively eating or drinking". That's code for me to go find another restaurant. Lo and behold, it didn't take more than passing a few storefronts when I'd come upon another restaurant with no such sign. Not a problem, no rights violated, no harm done. It was an offer of a voluntary transaction, with certain terms attached, which I declined.

It's OK not to like my flippant attitude. But please consider my points in good faith.

 

[HemiHauler]

With all due respect (not really), you are full of it. I do not believe one.word.you.type. That said, your point may be valid. But since you are a liar, well, you know.

So you're another one: "I don't like your flippant attitude, though you raise a valid point." LOL

As to the rest of your post ... who are you? And more importantly, why should I care what you think? Of anything?

 

[PeoplesElbow]

OR they can be a health care professional somewhere that isn't a dystopian nightmare. This may be a blessing in disguise for a lot of them. Get them the hell out of NYC, maybe go to Texas or Wyoming or Nebraska or Florida where your dollar goes further and your quality of life exponentially improves.

Unfortunately NYC affects the rest of the state, which is quite nice.

 

[vraiblonde]

And it's easy to say "Oh, well, I'll just go somewhere else," but what happens when there's nowhere else to go?

just isn't reasonable, as it ignores basic capitalism: someone will fill in the gaps where a profit potential exists.

So you don't see the big picture and don't understand how Socialism works.

And, lucky you, I'm not going to school you because I know you won't read it anyway. If you want information, you can look it up on this here interwebs thing.

 

[HemiHauler]

So you don't see the big picture and don't understand how Socialism works.

And, lucky you, I'm not going to school you because I know you won't read it anyway. If you want information, you can look it up on this here interwebs thing.

Ah, I knew you weren't capable of getting into anything beneath the surface.

PS, I understand socialism, and this isn't it. Don't make your boogieman my boogieman.

 

[ontheriver]

So you're another one: "I don't like your flippant attitude, though you raise a valid point." LOL

As to the rest of your post ... who are you? And more importantly, why should I care what you think? Of anything?

One thing I am not, is a liar. You are.

Why don't you just "place me on ignore"?