Number of atheists & agnostics grows

[This_person]

Proof goes both ways. People always want you to prove the bible wrong. How come these same people never try and prove the bible write.

For example what proof is there that the earth and all life was created in 6 days? Is there any evidence to suport this?

I don't seek to prove it to you, personally. I've noticed that whenever someone asks for proof of science (which I always do whenever someone tells me about the "facts" that are "well documented" and "proven") they can't do it, so they say "well religion can't be proved". Religion is being proved slowly through the sciences, IMO. From ALL sides, we only have faith - the difference between a religious person and a science-follower is that we understand it's faith, science followers think they know "the truth". Only, they have no more proof than I do about the vast majority of important issues - where did life come from, what is the meaning of it all, where did the universe come from, what happens when we die? None of these things are even close to a working hypothesis in science. I just put my faith in something with more meaning than sh!t happens (science), that's all.

 

[2ndAmendment]

Carbon dating does not support this. The oldest human skeletal remains do not date back as far as the skeletal remains of dinosaurs.

What about evolution. If Adam and eve where the first two people evolution could not be possible. There is a lot of scientific evidence that backs up the theory of evolution.

The bible was written by people who where far less knowledgeable than people today. Technology has given people a far better understanding of the universe than the people had in the time of Christ.



We can see many millions of light years into the past through advanced radio telescopes. Through this processes scientists have seen how stars are created over a period of millions of years. The formation of distant stars predates the first evidence of life on earth.

Religion is constantly changing to explain what the current level of science has not been able to prove.

Carbon dating is not reliable. Don't bet your eternal life on it.

Evolution does happen on small scale but not on the grand scale needed for the species on the earth. Don't bet your eternal life on it.

The Bible was written by God moving men to put down the actual words to paper. Most of the Bible predates Jesus. You are relying on science which changes constantly with every new theory. Don't bet your eternal life o it.

God transcends time and space. We are limited. God is not. He created light before He created the sun or the stars. Then He created the stars. It only makes sense that we see the light of the stars; God created the universe that way. You are betting your eternal life on man's wisdom.

Glad I'm not you. You are betting your eternal future on the wisdom of men.

 

[2ndAmendment]

According to the bible the heavens (space) was created on the first day. Then the stars were placed into the heavens an another day.

Science shows the formation of stars to take millions of years. Some of the stars in space predate evidence of life on earth.

Based on theories of men. You keep betting your life on other men.

 

[Solja_Boy]

Based on theories of men. You keep betting your life on other men.

What about non Christian religions. Are billions of non Christians throughout the world throwing away their eternal life? What if a someone is raised in seclusion and doesn't even know what the bible or god is? What happens to their eternal life? Are they doomed based on the actions of others even though they did nothing wrong.

What about people that were around before the bible? How can they be expect to fallow the word of the lord if it had not yet been written?

 

[This_person]

What about non Christian religions. Are billions of non Christians throughout the world throwing away their eternal life? What if a someone is raised in seclusion and doesn't even know what the bible or god is? What happens to their eternal life? Are they doomed based on the actions of others even though they did nothing wrong.

What about people that were around before the bible? How can they be expect to fallow the word of the lord if it had not yet been written?

You forgot to ask about the babies! And the mentally infirmed! What about them!?!


























God protects them, as it is through no fault of their own.

 

[2ndAmendment]

What about non Christian religions. Are billions of non Christians throughout the world throwing away their eternal life? What if a someone is raised in seclusion and doesn't even know what the bible or god is? What happens to their eternal life? Are they doomed based on the actions of others even though they did nothing wrong.

What about people that were around before the bible? How can they be expect to fallow the word of the lord if it had not yet been written?

This has all been discussed right here on this forum. If you are interested, you can find the answers. Short version: God does not condemn those that do not know of Him. Bible says so. Matter of fact God condemns no one. Those that know of Him are responsible for their own condemnation if they know and reject.

 

[PsyOps]

According to the bible the heavens (space) was created on the first day. Then the stars were placed into the heavens an another day.

Science shows the formation of stars to take millions of years. Some of the stars in space predate evidence of life on earth.

Only through math that can be applied by what we understand on this earth do scientists calculate that it took billions of years for the universe to form. Your belief that their calculations are infallible is equally arguable as the belief that God could do it in one day. And you worded your statement somewhat correctly “science shows”, not “science proves”. You can’t really prove, scientifically, how long it took the universe to form. And it always begs the questions: How did it all get here? How did it all just materialize out of nothing? Can stuff just be there? Can our universe just pop up from out of nothing?

But just give this some consideration, just for the sake of discussion… God is eternal. What does that mean? He always has been; forever. Considering that, what is a billion years to God? A blink of an eye. So now, considering this, what is a day in terms of the eternal existence of God? Is it possible, when you put things into the perspective of the eternity of God and God trying to explain his creation that a day (a day in the life of God) is billions and billions of years to us?

 

[PsyOps]

What about non Christian religions. Are billions of non Christians throughout the world throwing away their eternal life? What if a someone is raised in seclusion and doesn't even know what the bible or god is? What happens to their eternal life? Are they doomed based on the actions of others even though they did nothing wrong.

What about people that were around before the bible? How can they be expect to fallow the word of the lord if it had not yet been written?

What about worms and dogs, and armadillos? Do they all go to hell? Or is there a special place kept for them by God? This question can be asked of just about anything. what about trees?

I just assume let God take care of whom he saves that died before a certain time or hadn't heard the Word. All I know is I have heard the Word of God and now am accountable to my decisions to that effect. And so are you. I happen to think God has things figured out and for me to question that puts a little more responsibility into my hands than I want to handle.

 

[Solja_Boy]

Only through math that can be applied by what we understand on this earth do scientists calculate that it took billions of years for the universe to form. Your belief that their calculations are infallible is equally arguable as the belief that God could do it in one day. And you worded your statement somewhat correctly “science shows”, not “science proves”. You can’t really prove, scientifically, how long it took the universe to form. And it always begs the questions: How did it all get here? How did it all just materialize out of nothing? Can stuff just be there? Can our universe just pop up from out of nothing?

But just give this some consideration, just for the sake of discussion… God is eternal. What does that mean? He always has been; forever. Considering that, what is a billion years to God? A blink of an eye. So now, considering this, what is a day in terms of the eternal existence of God? Is it possible, when you put things into the perspective of the eternity of God and God
trying to explain his creation that a day (a day in the life of God) is billions and billions of years to us?

I believe that the universe was created by some sort of a higher power. What is that higher power? I don't know. I could be an alien race that is so advanced that they have the ability to create entire galaxies or universes. No body knows how big the universe is. For all we know there could be millions of universes.

Then that brings the questions what created the aliens that made people. This cycle can go on for ever. Eventually it all had to start somewhere. Where things originally started is just something that people do not yet understand.

I just do not believe in God as it is thought by the bible. I believe things were created by something people do not yet understand. As big as the entire universe is. There has to be other life out there. Some of which is probably much more advanced than us and some which is much less. If there is life in other Galaxies that is not carbon or water based. How would this effect what is thought by the bible.

 

[PsyOps]

I believe that the universe was created by some sort of a higher power. What is that higher power? I don't know. I could be an alien race that is so advanced that they have the ability to create entire galaxies or universes. No body knows how big the universe is. For all we know there could be millions of universes.

Then that brings the questions what created the aliens that made people. This cycle can go on for ever. Eventually it all had to start somewhere. Where things originally started is just something that people do not yet understand.

I just do not believe in God as it is thought by the bible. I believe things were created by something people do not yet understand. As big as the entire universe is. There has to be other life out there. Some of which is probably much more advanced than us and some which is much less. If there is life in other Galaxies that is not carbon or water based. How would this effect what is thought by the bible.

Can there really be a point in time where things “originally started”? I mean think about it, if that’s the case something had to have come before that, and before that… One has to come to a conclusion of the concept of eternity. Is there an eternity?

When it comes to the Bible explaining our existence and the events of creation I am not a literalist. I think the process was either far too complicated for God to give us all the details or he wanted to leave some of the mystery for us to figure out. I happen to believe the latter. God gave us intuitive minds for that very reason. Otherwise we’d be pretty bored if we had all the answers.

But you said we were created by something we don’t understand. That is God. If anyone tries to tell you they understand God, they are lying to you. How could anyone understand God? He left too many details out for us to understand Him. And I agree there is probably life out there elsewhere. To believe otherwise; to believe we are it is kind of arrogant really. But, just as God is dealing with us He is dealing with life elsewhere in the universe. I’m too busy trying to figure us out than to worry about what God is doing about other life out there.

But you have admitted something pretty huge to me; that there is a creator. Correct me if I’m wrong, but believing that it is this God we have been talking about has more to do with having to follow the rules than it does believing that our creator is actually the God in the Bible?

 

[2ndAmendment]

I believe that the universe was created by some sort of a higher power. What is that higher power? I don't know. I could be an alien race that is so advanced that they have the ability to create entire galaxies or universes. No body knows how big the universe is. For all we know there could be millions of universes.

Then that brings the questions what created the aliens that made people. This cycle can go on for ever. Eventually it all had to start somewhere. Where things originally started is just something that people do not yet understand.

I just do not believe in God as it is thought by the bible. I believe things were created by something people do not yet understand. As big as the entire universe is. There has to be other life out there. Some of which is probably much more advanced than us and some which is much less. If there is life in other Galaxies that is not carbon or water based. How would this effect what is thought by the bible.

And what make you think the Bible is the end of the knowledge of God? The Bible even says it is not. It sates that we perceive like in a dark mirror, imperfectly. We have what is revealed, but after this like we will know the perfect.

1 Corinthians 13:8-13

8Love never fails; but if there are gifts of prophecy, they will be done away; if there are tongues, they will cease; if there is knowledge, it will be done away.

9For we know in part and we prophesy in part;

10but when the perfect comes, the partial will be done away.

11When I was a child, I used to speak like a child, think like a child, reason like a child; when I became a man, I did away with childish things.

12For now we see in a mirror dimly, but then face to face; now I know in part, but then I will know fully just as I also have been fully known.

13But now faith, hope, love, abide these three; but the greatest of these is love.

You acknowledge that the universe was made by a higher power. That higher power is YHWH, the God of Abraham, Issac, and Jacob, and me, and a whole bunch of other people. He gave us the Bible to teach us what He wants us to know NOW. In time, He will reveal perfectly.