Pope: Church Must Not Obsess About Abortion, etc.

[b23hqb]

Yeah, and you dispute that? I don't know what your religious affiliation is, but I am a Catholic Christian, and there is no sin that the God I worship will not forgive.

I do dispute you, Lib. You are a catholic. I am a Christian. A Biblical Christian.

You said it. Show me anywhere in the scripture where it says the sin of unbelief will be discarded.

Pretty simple.

 

[b23hqb]

Keep looking. You won't find it.

Jesus died for A reason.One reason only. For those who believe IN Him. Simple faith in Him.

Those that die without Him are lost forever. Please do not be one of those that perish for eternity just because of what you have been taught , programmed with and rammed into your conscientious - the catholic dogma that everyone is saved no matter what.

Your choice.

 

[onel0126]

Keep looking. You won't find it.

Still waiting for you to complete the research assignment I gave you last month. Also still waiting for a link to the web page of the church you attend. Man up and post it.

 

[b23hqb]

Still waiting for you to complete the research assignment I gave you last month. Also still waiting for a link to the web page of the church you attend. Man up and post it.

You are a hoot, onel. I suggest you read the Bible. If you have one. A good research Bible like Scofield or Ryrie will enlighten you, providing you want to learn, that is.

Enjoy eternity as I wait for lib's reply. Or do you speak for her/him/it?

 

[onel0126]

You are a hoot, onel. I suggest you read the Bible. If you have one. A good research Bible like Scofield or Ryrie will enlighten you, providing you want to learn, that is. Enjoy eternity as I wait for lib's reply. Or do you speak for her/him/it?

Still waiting for the name/website of your church. Your silence speaks volumes....

 

[hotcoffee]

How about the part that "He is there to forgive us of anything?"

He will forgive anything.... if we ask Him in a state of repentance.

You have to believe in the Lord Jesus Christ. Once you believe, all things are possible.

I believe that the Lord Jesus Christ shed His blood for everyone. It's up to each of us to believe and repent.

After all.... remember Nineveh?

 

[b23hqb]

Still waiting for the name/website of your church. Your silence speaks volumes....

Silence? The Bible needs a name?

Brethern. Tampa, Fl. Need a doctrine as well, 0126?

CentralBibleChapel > Home

What catholic parrish/church do you attend on a regular basis?

Just challenge what I posted, previously, biblicaly, but I believe you will not/cannot, 0126.

Because you can't.

I will be there tomorrow. Sure hope it is not fire bombed.

 

[b23hqb]

He will forgive anything.... if we ask Him in a state of repentance.

You have to believe in the Lord Jesus Christ. Once you believe, all things are possible.

I believe that the Lord Jesus Christ shed His blood for everyone. It's up to each of us to believe and repent.

After all.... remember Nineveh?

Sorry, coffee. I don't buy your "after all". Believing about Christ is not the same as believing 'In" Him. Believing about something, as taught in history and such, is nowhere the same as believing "in" something.

That is why I disregard Mormon teachings as well.

One can believe about Jesus dying on the cross - that is history.

Believing about what He died for is a different story. Believing that He died for you, personally, is an individual act and acceptance on your part.

He died for everybody, but only for those, ultimately, who confess Him as God. Not just because they believed the history, but because they believed "in" Him, not about Him.

That's huge. Your eternity depends on it, on Him only. Not what different churches doctrine or preaching teaches. In Him. What the BIBLE preaches.

 

[Radiant1]

Sorry, coffee. I don't buy your "after all". Believing about Christ is not the same as believing 'In" Him. Believing about something, as taught in history and such, is nowhere the same as believing "in" something.

That is why I disregard Mormon teachings as well.

One can believe about Jesus dying on the cross - that is history.

Believing about what He died for is a different story. Believing that He died for you, personally, is an individual act and acceptance on your part.

He died for everybody, but only for those, ultimately, who confess Him as God. Not just because they believed the history, but because they believed "in" Him, not about Him.

That's huge. Your eternity depends on it, on Him only. Not what different churches doctrine or preaching teaches. In Him. What the BIBLE preaches.

I think we all agree that God will forgive us anything if we ask for it and to ask for it means we believe "IN" Him and His power to forgive and why. The exception of course being that one unforgivable sin. By the way, I've always read that unforgivable sin as "blasphemy against the Holy Spirit" in scripture, which you happen to interpret as unbelief and I interpret as final impenitence, but we pretty much mean the same thing here for to be impenitent to the end is to mean that you don't believe, right?

You know b23, I think you're taking umbrage just because that's what you do and not because there's any true basis for it (just like you did regarding the pope's statement). And now you're disputing something that we actually agree on. Please, in the name of God and all that is holy, stop being an asshat.

 

[Zguy28]

I think the context of what the monk was trying to say was that God is so Infinite and Almighty, that in order for us to "offend" Him, He must condescend, which He does, out of Infinite Love.
Just thinking about mankind, does a great man on earth (by earthly standards), let's say Obama, or Putin or Caesar, etc., actually get "offended" by what some insignificant Joe on the street says, or thinks or does against him? How insignificant are we to God? Yet we can hurt Him, but He is there to forgive us anything.

Offended in that context is not what I think of as offense. God does not get bruised feelings as we do (although He also is not devoid of emotion). I think though that the danger in that can be to think of God in a deist sense.

What I think of regarding "offense" is sin.

Baptist catechism
14. Q. What is sin?
A. Sin is any want of conformity to, or transgression of the law of God (1 Jn. 3:4).

But as I write this I also think of your context. What about when Israel grumbled and complained in the Exodus? Was God offended or insulted? He certainly became angry, and quickly too!

Or Ezekiel 25. I think God was offended by Edom.

Or Herod in Acts 12

21 On an appointed day Herod put on his royal robes, took his seat upon the throne, and delivered an oration to them.
22 And the people were shouting, "The voice of a god, and not of a man!"
23 Immediately an angel of the Lord struck him down, because he did not give God the glory, and he was eaten by worms and breathed his last.

Or Ananias and Sapphira in Acts 5, struck down for telling a lie to God.

Not to belabor the point, but be careful there Libby, because that road can easily lead to the compromise of doctrine of the atonement.

 

[Radiant1]

I'm not sure I get the whole question here. The pope said, "hey, we're not one-trick ponies here. There's more to the Church than a couple of issues."

He did NOT say doctrine changed. He did NOT say the Bible is wrong. He said, "let's focus on more than a few things."

Exactly.

Why is this such an issue for people?

For no reason but because it's Catholic and it's the pope. Some people see one or the other (or both) and feel as if they have to get their hackles up even when there's no reason to.

 

[kom526]

I'm not sure I get the whole question here. The pope said, "hey, we're not one-trick ponies here. There's more to the Church than a couple of issues."

He did NOT say doctrine changed. He did NOT say the Bible is wrong. He said, "let's focus on more than a few things."

Why is this such an issue for people?

And how did this de evolve into a "my church is better than your church" argument? Or is it a "My god loves me more than your god." argument?

A 12,000 word interview that was conducted over a 3 day period gets watered down to what the MSM has "interpreted" and spoon fed us.

 

[Zguy28]

Exactly.



For no reason but because it's Catholic and it's the pope. Some people see one or the other (or both) and feel as if they have to get their hackles up even when there's no reason to.

I have no problem with what he said when its taken in context.

 

[b23hqb]

And how did this de evolve into a "my church is better than your church" argument? Or is it a "My god loves me more than your god." argument?

A 12,000 word interview that was conducted over a 3 day period gets watered down to what the MSM has "interpreted" and spoon fed us.

Has nothing to do with ms whatever.

It evolved into peeps who believe in catholicism getting bent out of shape by a simple question: "What do you think about this?"

As soon as a differing opinion of what was said, we are where we are.

 

[Radiant1]

I have no problem with what he said when its taken in context.

Well then, you're not "some people" are ya?

Has nothing to do with ms whatever.

It evolved into peeps who believe in catholicism getting bent out of shape by a simple question: "What do you think about this?"

As soon as a differing opinion of what was said, we are where we are.

Who do you think you're kidding? It has everything to do with you. You started the thread (!) and said such things as, "Nothing like giving it up" (post #1), "What's the sense in using a bible if one does not believe it, for PC purposes?" (post #2), " no one can pick and choose what is a sin or not" and "Sugar coating topics" (post #12), and "I do dispute you, Lib. You are a catholic. I am a Christian. A Biblical Christian." (post #41).

Everyone else seemed to understand what the pope was saying...except you. Why do you suppose that is?

 

[onel0126]

The Bible needs a name? Brethern. Tampa, Fl. CentralBibleChapel > Home

Interesting items under the Lords Supper tab on your churches web page. Will make comments tomorrow.

 

[Zguy28]

Interesting items under the Lords Supper tab on your churches web page. Will make comments tomorrow.

They are Plymouth Brethren. Plymouth Brethren - Non-denominational Christians

Ultimately they were responsible for bringing "Left Behind" theology into the mainstream. The founder John Nelson Darby, and CI Scofield's study bible made dispensationalism a popular theological system and it has made its way into many Baptist and Charismatic/Pentecostal churches today. Personally I don't buy it, the whole Left Behind thing. Bad exegesis in my opinion, when taking the entire body of scripture together. I much prefer Covenant Theology. But I know many godly men who hold to it.

 

[ZARA]

I do dispute you, Lib. You are a catholic. I am a Christian. A Biblical Christian.

You said it. Show me anywhere in the scripture where it says the sin of unbelief will be discarded.

Pretty simple.

Libby never once stated that "the sin of unbelief will be discarded." That is strictly your interpretation of her statements.

Libby is correct that in all scriptures, regardless of religious branch, God will forgive all that ask for forgiveness. Even someone that has lived and entire life as an Atheist, believing in nothing beyond the five sense, if with their dying thoughts, prayed to God and asked forgiveness, being full of faith in body, heart, mind and soul, God will grant forgiveness for all sins and welcome His Sheep home.

Now, the way I read what Libby wrote is that if someone (atheist) asked for forgiveness, God will lovingly grant it...but for anyone to be forgiven, they have to ask for forgiveness, hence, at the last minute they finally believe. That in and of itself voids your argument of an "unbeliever" being forgiven.

 

[libby]

I do dispute you, Lib. You are a catholic. I am a Christian. A Biblical Christian.

You said it. Show me anywhere in the scripture where it says the sin of unbelief will be discarded.

Pretty simple.

Zara has summed up pretty nicely the point I was trying to make. Your position that unbelief, in and of itself, is cause for damnation, doesn't fit with what I know about the God I worship, and I am only speaking of Him. A person with mental disabilities cannot "believe IN" Jesus Christ. An infant cannot "believe IN" Him, as you have defined it, as far as I can tell.
Then there are those who were never taught, etc.
Only God knows if we are willfully ignorant. Only God knows what has brought us to our dying breath without the "belief IN" that you demand. Therefore, only God can decide if that unbeliever is saved or not.

 

[b23hqb]

Zara has summed up pretty nicely the point I was trying to make. Your position that unbelief, in and of itself, is cause for damnation, doesn't fit with what I know about the God I worship, and I am only speaking of Him. A person with mental disabilities cannot "believe IN" Jesus Christ. An infant cannot "believe IN" Him, as you have defined it, as far as I can tell.
Then there are those who were never taught, etc.
Only God knows if we are willfully ignorant. Only God knows what has brought us to our dying breath without the "belief IN" that you demand. Therefore, only God can decide if that unbeliever is saved or not.

I actually agree with part of that post. Only God knows if one believes in their heart. He also knows, and many of us can see in peoples lives, i.e. the fruit they display, which will demonstrate pretty clearly to human observers, what their belief system is, or is not.

We should all agree that infants and young children that have not reached an age of understanding the simplicity of the Gospel of salvation, that they will not be condemned by God, but gathered at His bosom if they should be called unto Him.

Seeing that God knows us from eternity past, and knew us intimately in our mothers wombs, I firmly believe every aborted fetus is with Him as well, in whatever form God deems righteous.

In this day and age of mass electronic, instantaneous communications, it is getting very difficult to believe that almost all people have heard the gospel in their language. Of course, there will be some cultures that forbid the preaching of the Word, but even there, the Word has penetrated the minds of many there, and that is why those cultures so vehemently oppose it.

The unforgivable sin/act that God will judge is the act of unbelief in the hearts of those that have heard the Gospel. Doesn't matter if you know it in your mind, if you do not act upon that message in your heart, and mean it, you will stand before the Great White Throne for your final judgement. There will be no appeals or do overs.

“Assuredly, I say to you, all sins will be forgiven the sons of men, and whatever blasphemies they may utter; but he who blasphemes against the Holy Spirit never has forgiveness, but is subject to eternal condemnation” (Mark 3:28–29).

“Anyone who speaks a word against the Son of Man, it will be forgiven him; but to him who blasphemes against the Holy Spirit, it will not be forgiven” (Luke 12:10).

The Spirit is what indwells the believer's heart. By not allowing the Spirit in, and knowingly rejecting the Spirit, is the unforgivable.

Jesus said it. I'm just quoting scripture.

Jesus is amazingly forgiving. He can, and will forgive all sin and blasphemes against Him from those that know Him in their hearts. He can not, and will not, however forgive anyone who blasphemes him by not acknowledging him, believing in him, in their heart.

Truth.