Rock is dead
- Thread starter Monello
- Start date
My point 
Larry Gude
Strung Out
That has stuck in my craw. You, of all people, can not say that and mean it.
Misfit
Lawful neutral
I just read Paul Stanley's book. I never was a big KISS fan but after reading it I started listing to them. They weren’t very good in my opinion but they found a niche and it was the visual that sold them not their musical prowess. The same can be said of the Misfits. I saw a Neil Young video where he explained it pretty well how the internet has killed the music industry because you can get everything for free. I guess live shows would be an artist’s gravy but that’s only an option for established artist with a fan base. Sadly Misfit's traveling karaoke jamboree will never have a chance.
Larry Gude
Strung Out
I just read Paul Stanley's book. I never was a big KISS fan but after reading it I started listing to them. They weren’t very good in my opinion but they found a niche and it was the visual that sold them not their musical prowess. The same can be said of the Misfits. I saw a Neil Young video where he explained it pretty well how the internet has killed the music industry because you can get everything for free. I guess live shows would be an artist’s gravy but that’s only an option for established artist with a fan base. Sadly Misfit's traveling karaoke jamboree will never have a chance.
Partially disagree. KISS wrote some GREAT songs early on. You HAVE to start with a great product.
From there, they went corporate; put less into the product and more into promoting it. Again, there is nothing 'wrong' with that. I just don't like it.
In the meant time, the music BIZ continues to evolve. Used to be you had to tour to sell records and then that got too expensive and people found you didn't have to tour as much to sell records (age of MTV). Now, that has changed. U2 is giving away the music and making it on touring and publishing rights.
Misfits Traveling Karaoke Jamboree will do fine IF you rawk AND work hard. Simmons is wrong. Rock is not dead. Heck, look at what they are doing; Vegas as the house band. There show is too expensive to make money touring because of the break down, move, put back up, break back down. So, set it up, leave it up, do a bunch of shows with $200 tickets in once place. No travel. No headaches. Play every other night.
Problem is, Gene can't help himself. Given that they will be in place, he'll come up with something like trying to sell people coming up to play along. Wait...they're already doing that....
Larry Gude
Strung Out
For what? In my view, she owes you an apology for exposing a minor in her care to that crap.
I was still a fan when that was coming up, barely hanging on. Then, I saw it and that was the last straw. "Hey, KISS fans! How low can we go and you still lap up our crap?"
But he's not going to make a pissload of money and bang Playboy centerfolds, which was Gene Simmons' state goal with KISS. You can't compare Gene with Dave Matthews - Gene isn't going, "Like, man, I totally want to share my art with the world and make it a better place, dude. :fffffttttttttthhhhhh: :snort:" He's going, "Hey Shannon, want a new mansion this year?"
And KISS fans replied, "Pretty low, what else ya got?"
Larry Gude
Strung Out
And, again, what was the point as per Mr. Simmons? "Rock is dead!".
Gene is going "Like, man, I totally want to share the cheapest crap I can come up with and get the most money I can get for it. It's like, totally, what I am about. I don't give a flying #### about the music just so long as people will pay me, dewd..."
I am NOT the one that said 'rock is dead'. He is and he is wrong.
Larry Gude
Strung Out
Exactly. And that is fine.
Yet it seems to offend you greatly, based on the number of times you and I have had this exact same argument. Do Madonna and her fans offend you this much? Because I think she is MUCH more idiotic in her pursuit of fortune and fame than Gene Simmons ever dreamed of being.
The whole point of being a commercial artist is to sell product. Gene knows how to do that, including his unfortunate foray into disco. I'm more offended by Dave Matthews than KISS - at least Gene is honest about his intentions and doesn't pretend to be a (duhn-duhn-DUHN!) "serious artist". Gene presents himself as what he is; Matthews is about as authentic as Chef Boyardee. He'll be doing Burger King commercials before too much longer. You should stop being a Dave Matthews fan about the time you stop going to keggers with your bros, i.e., the second you graduate from college. Dave Matthews is the Gwyneth Paltrow of music. He campaigned for Obama. Twice.
Yet he not only doesn't incite your scorn, but you actually...*gulp*...like him.
Help me here. Let's explore your Gene-hate and get to the root of your problem. Only then can the healing begin.
Larry Gude
Strung Out
And every time we have this exact same CONVERSATION, I use the same analogy; you go ballistic when someone does a half ass professional website and you do, or used to, because you are personally invested in it and it offends your sensibilities and pride in your profession.
I am NOT invested in Madonna. I am not invested in Country. I can enjoy them both for what they are, whatever they are; POP. Yet, they are commercial artists.
And I say this every time; rock and metal, I AM invested in. It is the stuff I love and care about, like you and your websites or whatever is going on with Kate and what's his face and their baby(s) or what have you. I LOVED KISS Alive! Detroit Rock City gives me goose bumps, RIGHT NOW, just thinking about it. Love Gun on was like finding out that your favorite artist who just totally kicked ass was actually no different than Donny Douche and was simply interested in your wallet; not your heart. Not your soul.
Like Dave or not, his music, so far, has his passions and energy in it. Will he do Burger King some day? Maybe. Megadeth went to crap when Marty left because that ####ing cheap ass Gene Simmons wanna be Mustaine refused to give anyone publishing rights to the music they were helping create.
And, worst of all, when it comes to KISS, they WERE on an upward trajectory writing and playing great music. You can do Rock and Roll All Night and be on the radio. They PROVED it. You can be on the radio with DRCity. They proved it. So, why then go to "I was made for loving you" and Christine Sixteen??????
I 'hate' (not hate, pisses me off) Gene for the same reason Dubbya pisses me off: I bought in. And I feel like I got stabbed in the back.
The whole point of COMMERCIAL is to make a buck.
The whole point of art is to make art.
The whole point of COMMERCIAL ARTIST is to balance the art with the bucks. KISS and Gene went off the rails, jumped the refrigerator. Nuked the shark. WAY too much $ and not enough art. AND could have easily kept the dough coming writing good songs.
Gene and Paul are free to, right now, this very day, dust off the ol' chops and write a brand new ass kicking rock song and sell the living hell out of it. And maybe that is the worst of it; the guys who wrote Strutter, Hotter than Hell (there is another chill!!!!) Rock Bottom, DRC, are freaking denying ROCK fans something they used to be so good at.
It's personal!
:
I see. So you're personalizing the business decisions - decisions that have been very successful for him - of a man you do not know and who does not know you, and this is what is causing your discomfort.
retendstoscribblenotes:Go on...
Larry Gude
Strung Out
I see. So you're personalizing the business decisions - decisions that have been very successful for him - of a man you do not know and who does not know you, and this is what is causing your discomfort.
Go on...
Good luck with that, Dr. Steinmetz! What is personal, doc, to me, is what his music meant to me. You've avoided, I see, your displeasure with the business decisions of crap web designers, yes? Crap producers, ostensibly, you did not know and do not know you?
Music is very personal to me. It brings me great joy, evokes great sorrow. I suppose it is at the root of my passions and intensity when I am not being a lazy bum? I mean, I am not trying to excuse or rationalize or even argue my feelings on this are sane or proper. Just that they are. The alternative, not caring, man, now we're getting in the deep end! If I don't care about quality, in my eyes, what's the point?
Why NOT have passions and enthusiasms?
Deflection. :scribblesmorenotes:
Do you feel that Gene betrayed you by changing KISS' genre?
Larry Gude
Strung Out
Larry Gude
Strung Out
Well, no. Not genre per se. My sister used to beat me up. And it was more a taste of flavor and style, kinda like a porter from an ale. I mean...why? Right?