Seperaqtion of Chirch and State huh ?

[FredFlash]

Mr. KUSTERMANN: Instead of having that motto on the coins, let the people show through their acts that deeply embedded in their hearts can be found that beautiful motto "In God we trust." [Great applause.]

Mr. MOORE of Pennsylvania: I did not introduce my bill for the purpose of currying favor with any religious sect, but because in my community there was a desire that it should be made known to the world generally that in this country we do trust in God.... I feel it is time to rise and declare, even by law, that this is a God-fearing nation, and that Congress can do no harm in making that declaration emphatic...what harm can we possibly do by acknowledging to the world that God has a place in our institutions?

 

[FredFlash]

Mr. MOORE of Pennsylvania: I did not introduce my bill for the purpose of currying favor with any religious sect, but because in my community there was a desire that it should be made known to the world generally that in this country we do trust in God.... I feel it is time to rise and declare, even by law, that this is a God-fearing nation, and that Congress can do no harm in making that declaration emphatic...what harm can we possibly do by acknowledging to the world that God has a place in our institutions?

Mr. EDWARDS of Georgia: ...Mr. Speaker, it will not be amiss for me to refer briefly to the circumstances under which the motto was first inscribed upon our coinage. In November, 1861, when one great section of this country was bitterly arrayed against another in war, a minister of Pennsylvania suggested to the Secretary of the Treasury that if the nation should perish no evidence of the religious faith of its inhabitants would be preserved upon its coins. This Impressed the Secretary of the Treasury, Hon. Salmon P. Chase, and believing that no nation is strong, except in the strength of God, or safe except in His defense, and that the trust of the American people in God should be declared on the national coin, he requested the Director of the Mint to prepare a device with a motto, tersely expressing, in the fewest words possible, this national recognition. Legislation was necessary, as the mottoes and devices of our coins had been prescribed by the act of January, 1837, so in April, 1864, March, 1865, and February, 1873, Congress enacted laws providing in substance that " In God we trust " might be inscribed upon such coins as would admit of it. The motto thus had its origin and thus came to us upon our coins.

Thus the sentiment was born when we were a divided people. To-day, thank God ! we are a reunited people forever. We are but one people, with but one country and one God, with an undying patriotism for our country and a steadfast faith in God. The American people are glad to honor themselves and their country by having God's name upon their coins. "We are fundamentally a religious people. We are distinguished by our devotion to religious and civil freedom." I dare say that every form of religious thought is represented in America, and yet we are one in the recognition of a supreme and all wise God.

 

[FredFlash]

Mr. EDWARDS of Georgia: Mr. Speaker, it is with pleasure that I rise to express my approval of the work of the Committee on Coinage, Weights, and Measures in unanimously reporting the following bill:

[H. R. 17296, 60th Congress, 1st session.]

Report No. 1106. In the House of Representatives, February 17, 1908. Mr. McKINLEY of Illinois, introduced the following bill, which wan referred to the Committee on Coinage, Weights, and Measures, and ordered to be printed. February 26, 1908. Referred to the House Calendar and ordered to be printed.
A bill providing for the restoration of the motto "In God we trust" on certain denominations of the gold and silver coins of the United states.

Be it enacted, etc., That the motto " In God we trust," heretofore Inscribed on certain denominations of the gold and silver coins of the United States of America, shall hereafter be Inscribed upon all such gold and silver coins of said denominations as heretofore.

SEC.. 2. That this act shall take effect thirty days after its approval by the President.

​

The committee in this instance is to be congratulated upon its -good work ; and the whole country is to be congratulated upon the fact that the motto, " In God we trust," which was recently removed from certain of our gold coins, is so soon to be restored. I am glad that this motto, which has graced our coins for so long, Is again to have its place upon the nation's money, for I am confident that this bill will pass the House by an almost unanimous vote. [Applause.)

This is no party measure. We may differ among ourselves upon party issues; there may be division of opinion among us as to great governmental questions; but there Is no division here today upon this bill. We are united as one party, all favoring the return of this lofty sentiment to our coins. [Applause.]

The President made a great mistake In ordering the words stricken from our money. I do not charge, as some do, that the President Is an Infidel. Such charges are wrong and without foundation. I simply say that our President erred, as all men are likely to do. He has seen his mistake and like a fearless and courageous man, he has virtually admitted his mistake, and says if this bill is passed, he will not veto It. I think the President is a God-fearing man. I think in this matter he made a mistake and is now willing to help undo what he has done.

This is no sectarian question. The Methodist, the Baptist, the Presbyterian, the Catholic, the Hebrews, the Episcopal, in fact all churches, all creeds, who have a belief in God, are as one in the opinion that it was a great mistake to ever have removed this motto from our coins, and they are one in the sentiment that this motto shall be restored. [Applause.]

When it was announced, through the newspapers a few months ago, that this motto had been left off of our coins, I wrote an article criticising it that appeared in many of the papers of my State. I spoke my honest convictions then, and I speak them now. I am not ashamed to proclaim my faith in God. We need God-fearing men in all public positions. A man who is not sound in his belief In God has no right in high office, which is the gift of a God-fearing people. We represent God-fearing people, and we, their representatives, should be God-fearing representatives.

There has gone up a demand from the people of this great country that this mistake of our President shall be corrected, and these simple words with lofty meaning and sentiment shall be restored to our coins.

There is no reason why the Iate Augustus St. Gaudens should have stricken this strinking sentence, so expressive of American reverence and faith, from the gold coins designed by him, and it In regrettable, indeed, that the President of this great God-fearing nation should have permitted it. There is, on the contrary, every reason why it should not have been stricken from our money. There Is certainly no harm In having the motto on our money. It is a sentiment that the people love. It Is a declaration not only to our people at home, but to all peoples, and to all nations, all over the world, that ours is a nation with a firm and steadfast faith In God. [Applause.]

That Infidels all over the country openly rejoiced In the fact that the word "God" watt stricken from our money Is now a well-known fact. Certain societies, known to be infidels, have been protesting by mail to Congressmen and Senators against the restoration of this sentence. The removal of this sentence from our coin did not depreciate its monetary value, but it depreciated its sentimental value. The removal of these words was a victory for infidelity. The restoration of them to our coin will be a blow to Infidelity and a victory for the God-tearing people of this great nation. [Applause.]

Mr. Speaker, it will not be amiss for me to refer briefly to the circumstances under which the motto was first inscribed upon our coinage. In November, 1861, when one great section of this country was bitterly arrayed against another in war, a minister of Pennsylvania suggested to the Secretary of the Treasury that if the nation should perish no evidence of the religious faith of its inhabitants would be preserved upon its coins. This Impressed the Secretary of the Treasury, Hon. Salmon P. Chase, and believing that no nation is strong, except in the strength of God, or safe except in His defense, and that the trust of the American people in God should be declared on the national coin, he requested the Director of the Mint to prepare a device with a motto, tersely expressing, in the fewest words possible, this national recognition. Legislation was necessary, as the mottoes and devices of our coins had been prescribed by the act of January, 1837, so in April, 1864, March, 1865, and February, 1873, Congress enacted laws providing in substance that " In God we trust " might be inscribed upon such coins as would admit of it. The motto thus had its origin and thus came to us upon our coins.

Thus the sentiment was born when we were a divided people. To-day, thank God ! we are a reunited people forever. We are but one people, with but one country and one God, with an undying patriotism for our country and a steadfast faith in God. The American people are glad to honor themselves and their country by having God's name upon their coins. "We are fundamentally a religious people. We are distinguished by our devotion to religious and civil freedom." I dare say that every form of religious thought is represented in America, and yet we are one in the recognition of a supreme and all wise God.
Early in January of this year I listened to an eloquent and impressive speech delivered by my friend from Texas. He so beautifully and ably said then just what I feel now and what I would like to say, had I the gift and ability to put it as he did; I am therefore going to quote from his words.

The opportunity to worship the omnipotent Father according to the conscience of the Individual is the basis of American history, the corner stone of the American Commonwealth.​

The civil right, in the temporal sphere, of every man to discharge his duties to the Creator according to the dictates of his conscience, is the flip side of every man's sacred duty, in the eternal sphere, to do so. Only God, as legislator over the eternal sphere, has legitimate authority to impose the duty to trust in him, or the duty to declare such trust, on a man, or class of men. Thus, for the U. S. Government to make a law implying that it has authority, even if only recommendatory/advisory authority, to establish, or declare, that a man, or class of men, trust in God, or ought to trust in God, is a vile, evil, wicked, perverted and despicable usurpation of God's jurisdiction; and furnishes proof beyond a reasonable doubt, to my mind, that American's are not a Christian people, at least in the sense that most of the founders were Christians, most of whom, judging from the exemption of religion from the cognizance of civil authority placed into the U. S. Constitution, believed that, as the Protestant Episcopal Creed declared, "...the civil magistrate... hath no power over things purely sacred."

 

[FredFlash]

Mr. EDWARDS of Georgia: Let us therefore fight Infidelity until it is literally stamped out of our country. Let us not retrograde, but rather let us go forward. Let us do nothing that smacks of national infidelity. Let us not put an " Infidel money " out upon the world, but let us put out the coin that says to all the world "Americans are a God-fearing and God-loving people." I hope this bill will pass by a unanimous vote.
​

By Mr. Edward's logic, the U. S. Constitution is an Infidel document because it fails to mention God, proving that the founders were indeed Godless heathens?

 

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[Ender]

This entire thread has been going around in circles about religion and state, and the seperation of the two (or the lack thereof). There's nothing wrong with putting Islamic-based areas for the students who practice the particular religion in a public environment. It's just because some people have their head stuck up their bum thinking that Islam is some type of "terrorist religion" just because of the nonsense on 9/11 (and other similar actions). It's a joke really, people can't see beyond that and realise that Islam (muslim is a sect of it) is one of the largest religions in the world. You don't see the horde of Islamic people coming and blowing things up; there's just a small minority of people who believe that there should be a Jihad on non-believers. Ironically enough, in the Islam religion - there's the belief of a story that Mohammad went to a neighbouring area (I believe it to be Israel). His people/followers wanted to wage a Jihad against them, for they did not believe in Allah (the one True God). Mohammad instructed them that it is not up to them to decide the fate, and that all people should be allowed to believe in what they wish. So they dined with the Israelis that night, and left the following day. No wars, no problems.

I'm going off-topic slightly. The point is - you won't have cultural differences if you stray away from the nonsense. When I lived in Tennessee, they were trying to pass a legistration that stated that some states were allowed to merge Church and State (not sure what the status was there at the end though) - TN and VA were two of the ones on the list. Ultimately, US is a Catholic/Christian based country. It is in the majority in that particular area these days. However, that doesn't mean one should discriminate against other religions. Let people trend where they feel; and try to make all feel welcomed. US is probably one of the most diversed countries due to the whole 'American Dream' aspect. Why should people feel threatened by a buddhist? Or an islamic? How about a Wiccan (don't start, I grew up as a wiccan - which meant a lot of evil glares from those in St.Mary's who knew [which in that area, everyone knows everything])? How about someone who practices Hindu? You see, colleges and universities are almost forced to be more adaptive to other cultural influences as there are millions of international students going to US (just like there's a high amount from the US going to Europe or the UK). To go a bit looney over a religious foot bath is like moaning that there's any type of cathedral within 10 miles of a campus (and trust me, there's always a church or cathedral within 10 miles of a college/university).

 

[FredFlash]

Separation of Church and State is a myth. It's not found in the Constitution.

The proposed foot baths for Muslims do not established a national church, like the Church of England. Thus, there would be no violation of the Constitution. Besides, the First Amendment applies only against Congress.

 

[Xaquin44]

hahaha

I'm not going to read through all of this, but I had to say that the spelling in the title is the best lol

 

[This_person]

Separation of Church and State is a myth. It's not found in the Constitution.

The proposed foot baths for Muslims do not established a national church, like the Church of England. Thus, there would be no violation of the Constitution. Besides, the First Amendment applies only against Congress.

Good for you for figuring it out, Fred.