Speed Cameras Ready To Take Your Money?

[RPMDAD]

ETC no disagreemant here just pointing out sometimes the cameras and radar traps have nothing to do at all with Public Safety, just use the fines as revenue generators. Just imaging 95 s bound blanketed in these speed cameras, you can get multiple tickets in one state and pay fines to multiple jurisdictions.

 

[glhs837]

In that case it's not the speed that's wrong but the delta that is displayed. That number should NOT be a constant. Either that or the delta isn't.what we think it is.

Now, given available data, I don't think you can state that. We have no real data to back up the validity of the speed either. And a few points that might lead to doubt about that. Such as measured speeds of vehicles that it is very unlikely they could have achieved in the distance the driver says they were going.

Md. company investigates speed cameras | Hayley Peterson | Local | Washington Examiner

.tbd.com/articles/2010/09/drivers-outraged-over-forest-heights-speed-cameras-miscalculations-8785.html

whenever challenged, both the company and any municipality obfuscate, refusing FOIA requests, or foisting off complaints with "Its calibrated", of course, no real information about that calibration. Does it have "truth" data of any kind? I'll be it doesnt.

 

[glhs837]

Nice thing about being in a state where these things are deploying, you get to see the whole process. Well, not all, the lobbying of individual politicians by the camera companies reps, that's usually done out of sight. Barring the 600K camera companies spent lobbying Annapolis pols to get the law passed.

So, heres how its playing out in Howard county. Pay close attention to who's driving this bus and ask yourself a few questions.

Maryland Speed Cameras: Howard County

1. If larger schools zones were a good idea, why only put them in with the cams? This could have been done years ago.

2. If lower speeds in school zones were so needed, why wait til the cams come around?

3. You would thing the Police Chief would be the one pushing expanded school zones and rigged, I mean "adjusted" speed limits, but not its the politicians.

you watch, it will fall out just like I have predicted here. They will expand the zones and drop the limits. Supposedly in the name of safety, but really in the name of revenue. If you look it up, they have found a patsy, a nice couple whose daughter was seriously by a speeding truck about 20 years ago. If accidents like that are so rare you need to reach back 20 years, dont we have better things to worry about? This sort of cold blooded use of personal tragedy in the name of making revenue and profits really pisses me off. I wonder who contacted them and got them involved?

WBFF FOX45 - Top Stories - Howard County Speed Cameras - Janice Park

They passed a minimal bill early on, and now are amending it to allow 4 times as many cameras, vendor operated cams vice county owned ones, and have shot down amendments that would have required more accountability in the system.

 

[nhboy]

Md. Attorney Beats Speed Camera Citation

LINK

"Bowie attorney James Liskow says he always fights his speeding tickets. and this one was a no-brainer.

He was snapped going 45mph in a 30mph zone on Georgia Avenue just south of Viers Mill Road in Montgomery County last December.

Liskow's challenge was based on the part of the speed camera law in Montgomery County that deals with evidence at trial.

Liskow's arguement was based on the fact that what he received in the mail dealt with a wrong section of the law. The citation he received in the mail was supposed to include the offending photo, vehicle registration number, and date and time of the violation which it did.

But it also referred to a section of the law that states that the citation is to include the county plan describing the proposed location of the speed monitoring system, published notice of the speed camera's location and a signed certificate attesting the camera passed its annual calibration check. None of that information appeared on the citation Liskow received in the mail. "

 

[glhs837]

Wrote a letter to the Commissioners. Got back an auto out of office from John Savich, a thank you from Jack Russel, and a response from Sarah Cavanno telling me she would pass it on to the Director of Public Works for info. Nice of her to do that, shows she actually read it and took the time to act on it.

 

[EmptyTimCup]

ETC no disagreemant here just pointing out sometimes the cameras and radar traps have nothing to do at all with Public Safety, just use the fines as revenue generators.

never is ......... if they were trying to encourage safety the fines would be x10 what they are and people would lose their driving privileges much quicker .....


if one earned a $ 5000 dollar fine going 20 over the speed limit people would slow down ..... of course they would have to apply this to the protected working class that enforces speed limits normally ....


I got passed on 214 this morning (its raining today) by a S Trooper ... I was doing 52 / 53 ... the trooper passed me on the right doing at least 58 ...

although this is rare ... usually it is a PG roller doing 65-70

 

[glhs837]

Back when this law first went up for vote, an amendment was proposed to ensure state owned vehicles would not be protected. Shockingly, that was shot down. Not just officers, but any state vehicle.

 

[glhs837]

So, heres a funny, pay attention, you folks who think these things are accurate. Seems Forest Heights was not happy with the publicity, and so did up a press release discussing the issue of accuracy, and the steps they took to make sure the system was accurate.......

The funny part is, they not only didnt make any real effort, they couldnt even write their own press release, they plagiarized one done a month ago by the town of Cheverly. Including numbers like speed limits and camera differential timing that dont even apply to the Forest Heights cameras.

Maryland Speed Cameras: Forest Heights Answers Charges of Camera Inaccuracy… with Plagiarism

Now, give me two hours, one police car, two officers, and two video cameras, and I could make this all go away for them. Very simple to publicly demostrate the cameras accuracy. But they wont, and I hope you all both know why, and why you are fools if you allow the St Marys County Commissioners to let these camera companies in here.

 

[royhobie]

Bob, you are making the assumption that the radar is right. Thats the problem. If you set for 12 over and your revenue is not enough, why not set for 9 or 10? Revenues suddenly are fantastic, and you are still getting speeders, right? Only folks doing bad stuff, right? You are violating the law, but really, since you are still getting folks going 9 over, who cares. Oh, and for Optotraffic, its lasers.


Accuracy has to assured through testing. Who does that testing? Here, Bob, you are much more conversant with this sort of thing than I am, see what you think of this. The logic of it hangs together for me, but maybe I am missing something.

Maryland Speed Cameras: Forest Heights Speed Camera Investigation Part I: Indian Head Highway Robbery

I had to chuckle when you talk about testing. Many current lights in Lexington Park have been reporting for their failure to be timed correctly. State does nothing about it. Sheriff's Office has reported some faulty lights as well. They are slow to respond, if at all. So, as for testing, they can't seem to test the equipment they have. I can't wait until the issue comes up for their red light and speed cameras. Actually, I probably can wait.

 

[glhs837]

Well, Bob, if you are still reading, check the latest out of Forest Heights......the shenaningans continue.

Maryland Speed Cameras

Cliff notes.

1. Even though the company's own literature for the system claims the photos are accurate enough to act as a secondary means of proving the violation, they now claim, since folks have used that to successfully challenge them in court, that the photos are NOT an means of doing so.

2. So they did a video to show how accurate it is, showing a police car passing at 60, and the citation generated.

3. Two big problems. One is that the police car going 60 travels much farther between pictures than civilian vehicles that were supposed to be going 60 or faster. the other is that, for some reason, the three decimal place timing between photos, that made it possible to calculate speed? Oddly enough, its not only one place. Hmmm, how did that happen?

4. Also, the unit tested wasnt even the same unit. And, of course this test was babysat, that van you see, its a company van with gear and all.

independent testing my ass, lying bastards. Again, you all want these lying, cheating buggers deciding if YOU get a ticket? Go right ahead. They wont get me, I will know where they are.

 

[letmetellyou]

I'm in favor of the cop with the mirrored glasses and stetson coming up to my window!

 

[glhs837]

I'm in favor of the cop coming up to your window too

 

[itsbob]

Well, Bob, if you are still reading, check the latest out of Forest Heights......the shenaningans continue.

Maryland Speed Cameras

Cliff notes.

1. Even though the company's own literature for the system claims the photos are accurate enough to act as a secondary means of proving the violation, they now claim, since folks have used that to successfully challenge them in court, that the photos are NOT an means of doing so.

2. So they did a video to show how accurate it is, showing a police car passing at 60, and the citation generated.

3. Two big problems. One is that the police car going 60 travels much farther between pictures than civilian vehicles that were supposed to be going 60 or faster. the other is that, for some reason, the three decimal place timing between photos, that made it possible to calculate speed? Oddly enough, its not only one place. Hmmm, how did that happen?

4. Also, the unit tested wasnt even the same unit. And, of course this test was babysat, that van you see, its a company van with gear and all.

independent testing my ass, lying bastards. Again, you all want these lying, cheating buggers deciding if YOU get a ticket? Go right ahead. They wont get me, I will know where they are.

So what you are saying, in contradiction, is not the accuracy of the system capturing the speed.. or that the speed is inaccurate. (the accuracy of Radar/LIDAR have been proven again and again) but the picture taking is flawed?

So yes, they caught me speeding, I KNOW I was speeding, and the Radar was correct, but the camera didn't take a good picture of me so I'm not going to pay the fine.

Is this a good summation?

 

[letmetellyou]

So what you are saying, in contradiction, is not the accuracy of the system capturing the speed.. or that the speed is inaccurate. (the accuracy of Radar/LIDAR have been proven again and again) but the picture taking is flawed?

So yes, they caught me speeding, I KNOW I was speeding, and the Radar was correct, but the camera didn't take a good picture of me so I'm not going to pay the fine.

Is this a good summation?

You got beat up a lot as a kid didn't you?

 

[letmetellyou]

So what you are saying, in contradiction, is not the accuracy of the system capturing the speed.. or that the speed is inaccurate. (the accuracy of Radar/LIDAR have been proven again and again) but the picture taking is flawed?

So yes, they caught me speeding, I KNOW I was speeding, and the Radar was correct, but the camera didn't take a good picture of me so I'm not going to pay the fine.

Is this a good summation?

Don't in America, we have a right to face our accuser? How do you cross examine a computer generated photo?

 

[itsbob]

Don't in America, we have a right to face our accuser? How do you cross examine a computer generated photo?

But if the accuser is right, the data is right, and you WERE speeding, why would you?

NONE of the arguments or cases above questioned the accuracy of the tool actually used to capture the speed, and none of the accused came out and said "I wasn't SPEEDING". ALL of the cases are trying to get out of paying for something they know they did based on a technicality.. The picture taking is flawed.

Take away the dramatics, take away.. "They're robbing us", and filter out the facts.

They record your speed using a proven accurate device. They take your picture to show it was you they caught..

That's the bottom line. The rest is just smoke and mirrors so somebody doesn't have to take responsibility for their actions (speeding).

 

[itsbob]

You got beat up a lot as a kid didn't you?

Actually, no.

 

[glhs837]

Nope.

I am saying that

A) I wasn't speeding.

B) They say their system proves I was, both the LIDAR and the photos.

C) The photos they, in their own literature, say are accurate enough to act as secondary proof in addition to the LIDAR.

https://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&...gzNGQtOTZlYmYzM2JiYTM4&hl=en&authkey=CM_r6okB

Page 2, last para. " a photographic method also determines speed, guaranteeing fairness"

D) Once they were shown in court that the photo method shows a lower speed, instead of explaining it, they just change the story about the purpose of the cameras

So, yes, LIDAR and Radar are, as a class of device, accurate, nobody is disputing that. They are disputing that this particular device has been set up so as to NOT trigger when it supposed to, but artificially low. Its not inaccuracy, it blatant cheating, Bob. It is somehow set to show a higher speed than the vehicles are actually going.

Otherwise, why is the cop car going 60 traveling so much farther between pictures than a car going 65? Could be that suddenly they changed up the time between photos, but if that were the case, why not leave the three decimal place timing on the pictures? If they have nothing to hide, why remove data? We both know why folks remove data

Come'on Bob, I know you are a master of critical thinking, look over the evidence presented from an unbiased viewpoint. Study the times on the pics, look at the distances, do your own analysis. I did. The numbers match. It holds water.

 

[glhs837]

But if the accuser is right, the data is right, and you WERE speeding, why would you?

NONE of the arguments or cases above questioned the accuracy of the tool actually used to capture the speed, and none of the accused came out and said "I wasn't SPEEDING". ALL of the cases are trying to get out of paying for something they know they did based on a technicality.. The picture taking is flawed.

Take away the dramatics, take away.. "They're robbing us", and filter out the facts.

They record your speed using a proven accurate device. They take your picture to show it was you they caught..

That's the bottom line. The rest is just smoke and mirrors so somebody doesn't have to take responsibility for their actions (speeding).

Thats the rub, what says that device is accurate, wheres my "truth" data? bob, the company owner is saying his guys said they knew where the cameras were, and stopped speeding. So are others.

 

[DEEKAYPEE8569]

When Red Light Cams Get HERE

Red light cameras will be in St. Mary's eventually. I have no doubt about it. However, the County Commissioners have to approve it. If you don't like these type of cameras, you better make sure your Commissoners know it. All they are going to see is the dollar signs it brings in. But, if enough of our citizens stop it before it gets started, we have a chance.

Just be ready for A LOT MORE rear-end collisions. The way folks 'round here tail-gate; and dart in front of you if you don't tail-gate; when/if we get red light cams down here; I can see it now; people are gonna SLAM on brakes when the light turns red; so the one "drafting" you is gonna be in your back seat.

Yesterday on the way home; I saw three cars run the same red light northbound at 235/4. They had time to stop, just didn't.