Stand by Calvert, it has begun (speed cams)

[glhs837]

http://www.thebaynet.com/articles/0715/boardapprovesspeedcamerasnearschools.html

Yep, won't anyone think of the children? Can anyone tell me what the number of students (or anyone else for that matter) hit by speeders in school zones in Calvert? Wonder how the contract reads, since the bounty system, where the contractor (note that the presser makes not one mention that the program is run by a contractor for profit) is paid per citation, thereby giving the contractor a motive to ensure maximum citations. State law was recently changed to supposedly preclude such schemes, but that change was a paper tiger.


And before anyone makes the same old tired arguments that I must love running kids down because I oppose these things, please, my objections are based on a lot of things, but not because I see these things as inhibiting my ability to go 90mph through a playground. It's a moneymaking scheme pure and simple.

 

[tblwdc]

http://www.thebaynet.com/articles/0715/boardapprovesspeedcamerasnearschools.html

Yep, won't anyone think of the children? Can anyone tell me what the number of students (or anyone else for that matter) hit by speeders in school zones in Calvert? Wonder how the contract reads, since the bounty system, where the contractor (note that the presser makes not one mention that the program is run by a contractor for profit) is paid per citation, thereby giving the contractor a motive to ensure maximum citations. State law was recently changed to supposedly preclude such schemes, but that change was a paper tiger.


And before anyone makes the same old tired arguments that I must love running kids down because I oppose these things, please, my objections are based on a lot of things, but not because I see these things as inhibiting my ability to go 90mph through a playground. It's a moneymaking scheme pure and simple.

It's about time!

 

[glhs837]

For what? To raise money through enforcement for profit? Why is now a good time for that? don't be fooled by the "save the kids" rhetoric, how does this make anyone safer? If the "before" stats have nobody being hurt, and no crashes due to speeding, how can adding the machines make any difference? If deterrence is really the point, why is it a no points $40 fine? I'll tell you why, it's about making money. and the school zone thing is just so the proponents have a club to beat you with if you object.

Really, think about it, don't knee jerk your reaction. What is the safety benefit if this condition hasn't caused any injuries in the history of Calvert?

 

[Hijinx]

Mainly the only time there is any danger in a school zone in our rural counties is when the buses are going in and out.

I cannot remember during school hours when I saw kids in the street.

 

[Chris0nllyn]

For what? To raise money through enforcement for profit? Why is now a good time for that? don't be fooled by the "save the kids" rhetoric, how does this make anyone safer? If the "before" stats have nobody being hurt, and no crashes due to speeding, how can adding the machines make any difference? If deterrence is really the point, why is it a no points $40 fine? I'll tell you why, it's about making money. and the school zone thing is just so the proponents have a club to beat you with if you object.

Really, think about it, don't knee jerk your reaction. What is the safety benefit if this condition hasn't caused any injuries in the history of Calvert?

But that can't be true.

Commissioner Tom Hejl [R - At Large] dismissed the notion that the speed cameras were simple, money-making operation.” He pointed out the cameras would only be positioned on county roads. Hejl indicated that while the speed camera installations were a good start to improving safety for Calvert’s school system, a goal of assigning a law enforcement officer for every school seems like a good long-range goal.

“Too many people are driving too fast,” Commissioner Evan K. Slaughenhoupt Jr. [R - District 3] stated. “If people are going to choose to be dangerous it’s going to cost them.”

"...and if we get a kick back from it, so be it".

 

[tblwdc]

For what? To raise money through enforcement for profit? Why is now a good time for that? don't be fooled by the "save the kids" rhetoric, how does this make anyone safer? If the "before" stats have nobody being hurt, and no crashes due to speeding, how can adding the machines make any difference? If deterrence is really the point, why is it a no points $40 fine? I'll tell you why, it's about making money. and the school zone thing is just so the proponents have a club to beat you with if you object.

Really, think about it, don't knee jerk your reaction. What is the safety benefit if this condition hasn't caused any injuries in the history of Calvert?

I don't give a rat's f*^( about the safety aspect. I like the fact that they are going to be collecting more revenue from people who are speeding.

 

[glhs837]

I don't give a rat's f*^( about the safety aspect. I like the fact that they are going to be collecting more revenue from people who are speeding.

Well, at least you get points for honesty. So, jaywalking cams next? How about cams for right on red? How about when they make special school zones just for making more money like some counties have done? And you are fine with the fact that it looks like they might have violated the state law in making a contract where the vendor gets paid per ticket or whats called a bounty system? Where do you draw the line on enfoceing the law not for the public good, but just to make money?

Here. do some reading. Keeping in mind, every point made there has citations and facts to back them up.

http://www.mddriversalliance.org/p/arguments-against-speed-cameras.html

 

[tblwdc]

Well, at least you get points for honesty. So, jaywalking cams next? How about cams for right on red? How about when they make special school zones just for making more money like some counties have done? And you are fine with the fact that it looks like they might have violated the state law in making a contract where the vendor gets paid per ticket or whats called a bounty system? Where do you draw the line on enfoceing the law not for the public good, but just to make money?

Here. do some reading. Keeping in mind, every point made there has citations and facts to back them up.

http://www.mddriversalliance.org/p/arguments-against-speed-cameras.html

I don't need to do any further reading. Your bullsh*t about jaywalking is just that. You lose all credibility when you start throwing in scenarios which nobody is proposing to try to scare the populous.

I don't care how they awarded the contract. I am glad they will be getting revenue from people who break the law. If I get caught in one of those special speed zones, shame on me for not paying attention.

 

[Vince]

For what? To raise money through enforcement for profit? Why is now a good time for that? don't be fooled by the "save the kids" rhetoric, how does this make anyone safer? If the "before" stats have nobody being hurt, and no crashes due to speeding, how can adding the machines make any difference? If deterrence is really the point, why is it a no points $40 fine? I'll tell you why, it's about making money. and the school zone thing is just so the proponents have a club to beat you with if you object.

Really, think about it, don't knee jerk your reaction. What is the safety benefit if this condition hasn't caused any injuries in the history of Calvert?

Patuxent High School is the perfect example. The school is way back off the road, fenced in and the kids are in no danger what so ever, and the road that runs by it is a 35mph zone from the traffic circle out to Rt 4. So if I go 40 mph on that road the speed camera will give me a ticket. This is BS. The worst hazard on that road are the kids that drive to school or the idiots that don't yield in the traffic circle. This is nothing more than a money making scheme.

 

[tblwdc]

Patuxent High School is the perfect example. The school is way back off the road, fenced in and the kids are in no danger what so ever, and the road that runs by it is a 35mph zone from the traffic circle out to Rt 4. So if I go 40 mph on that road the speed camera will give me a ticket. This is BS. The worst hazard on that road are the kids that drive to school or the idiots that don't yield in the traffic circle. This is nothing more than a money making scheme.

Who is forcing you to speed?

 

[glhs837]

I don't need to do any further reading. Your bullsh*t about jaywalking is just that. You lose all credibility when you start throwing in scenarios which nobody is proposing to try to scare the populous.

I don't care how they awarded the contract. I am glad they will be getting revenue from people who break the law. If I get caught in one of those special speed zones, shame on me for not paying attention.

Okay, ignore that, which was really a rhetorical statement. The red light cams are not, nor a changeover to right turn on red, which a lot of Maryland system operators have done. So, you are on record that enforcement just for profit is fine. Just so long as you realize there is no other benefit, and the downside that you are entrenching the idea that traffic enforcement is a great place to ignore results as long as you are making money....

 

[glhs837]

Patuxent High School is the perfect example. The school is way back off the road, fenced in and the kids are in no danger what so ever, and the road that runs by it is a 35mph zone from the traffic circle out to Rt 4. So if I go 40 mph on that road the speed camera will give me a ticket. This is BS. The worst hazard on that road are the kids that drive to school or the idiots that don't yield in the traffic circle. This is nothing more than a money making scheme.

Actually, no it wont, 40 in a 35 will not get you a ticket. Systems by law are only allowed to ticket someone going 12mph over the set limit. Now, what a lot of places have done is dropped the limits right before setting up cameras. In which case 42 d get you a ticket.

 

[Chris0nllyn]

Wait a sec.

How can there be a camera in front of Huntingtown High, but not Calvert?

Hejl said it'd only be County roads, but Rt.4 is a State Highway, no?
http://www.fhwa.dot.gov/planning/national_highway_system/nhs_maps/maryland/md_maryland.pdf

 

[glhs837]

Was not Huntington High. but Huntington Elementary.

"Calvert County Sheriff Mike Evans [R] (pictured) announced the primary locations for the cameras would be in front of Huntingtown and Mount Harmony elementary schools, Mill Creek Middle School, Patuxent High School, the campus of Northern High and Northern Middle schools; and the campus of Windy Hill Middle and Elementary schools. "

and it's county roads because otherwise you have to go to the State for permission. Anyone in Calvert wanna go survey currently existing speed limits in front of these schools? A lot of places have dropped limits in preparation for the cameras.

 

[Chris0nllyn]

Was not Huntington High. but Huntington Elementary.

"Calvert County Sheriff Mike Evans [R] (pictured) announced the primary locations for the cameras would be in front of Huntingtown and Mount Harmony elementary schools, Mill Creek Middle School, Patuxent High School, the campus of Northern High and Northern Middle schools; and the campus of Windy Hill Middle and Elementary schools. "

and it's county roads because otherwise you have to go to the State for permission. Anyone in Calvert wanna go survey currently existing speed limits in front of these schools? A lot of places have dropped limits in preparation for the cameras.

Ah, gotcha.

I drive by these schools (most of them) all the time, but I won't be recording the limits in the area.


Just look at the BayNet's facebook post on this subject. It's everything ranging from surveillance state to 'It's for the CHILDREN!".

 

[glhs837]

So, how do you choose where to place them? Who did the surveys? Since there's most likely no accident data, and no injury data, it's all about the speeds. Who decided these were the places? Wanna bet the vendor (again, no mention made of it not being a govt run program) was the one, who made the recommendations? As for recording the limits, just simply noting them will do. A lot of places have been caught lowering limits already. "for the kids", of course, but if it were for the kids, why didn't you do it years ago? Also, I'm pretty sure the speed limits on county roads are a lot easier to change than State roads. And if anyone complains, they hate kids and most likely are planning to Film DeathRace 3000 with a dashcam.

 

[LibertyBeacon]

Don't speed and there won't be a problem.

:shrug:

 

[tblwdc]

Okay, ignore that, which was really a rhetorical statement. The red light cams are not, nor a changeover to right turn on red, which a lot of Maryland system operators have done. So, you are on record that enforcement just for profit is fine. Just so long as you realize there is no other benefit, and the downside that you are entrenching the idea that traffic enforcement is a great place to ignore results as long as you are making money....

I am fine with making money on those who break the law. You're full of sh*t when you say it has NO other benefit. You don't know that. You don't know how many people decide to stop at a red light because it has a camera or decide to slow down because of a school zone with a camera. You don't know if it has saved a life or not because you can't know what you don't know. You are just one of those whiny little creeps who can't do what they do so you want to spend your days on the internet complaining about what they do.

 

[Rommey]

Don't speed and there won't be a problem.

:shrug:

Assuming the cameras are operating properly...

I am fine with making money on those who break the law. You're full of sh*t when you say it has NO other benefit. You don't know that. You don't know how many people decide to stop at a red light because it has a camera or decide to slow down because of a school zone with a camera. You don't know if it has saved a life or not because you can't know what you don't know. You are just one of those whiny little creeps who can't do what they do so you want to spend your days on the internet complaining about what they do.

I think that there should be some data to suggest that cameras are warranted and for the most part there is not sufficient data to suggest that cameras would remedy a problem. There's too much leeway for "rigging" the system to increase the number of tickets issued (such as short-timing yellow lights, or changing the speed limits to an unreasonably slow speed for the type of road, to designating school zones where no schools are near, etc.). You have no problem with people that are caught by cameras having to pay up, but people are getting caught when they were operating within the law...and there is little recourse. There are plenty of jurisdictions that have removed their cameras because of unreliable operation.

There could be some benefit to cameras, but they also cause problems. Case in point...many drivers know there is a camera at a particular location, let's say set for 30MPH. A lot of drivers will be going 30-35MPH prior to this location and then slam on the brakes down to 20-25MPH. In their effort to avoid a speeding ticket, they nearly cause other drivers to crash into them.

 

[LightRoasted]

If I may ...

I conducted, what I believe to be, a thorough search of all matters, (ie. news accounts, public meeting records), related to the dangers of school zone traffic. (For Calvert County) And I found nothing. Nowhere was a traffic safety study released on the number of daily speeders in front of schools. No statistics on the number of speeding tickets issued in school zones, for "any" given fiscal year from the beginning of time. No public comments at commissioner meetings where a parent stood and urged safeguards to be put in place to stop speeders in school zones. Nothing from the Sheriffs office, or news reports, about kids being run over by a speeder. No blotter reports of accidents in a school zone caused by speeding, during schools hours, or not. Absolutely nothing to support this great big push from our "elected leaders". The Sheriff and Commissioners are nothing but followers, with leadership absent.

And of course a camera will be installed in one of the busiest areas in Lusby, near the roundabout to one of the largest communities in Calvert, with only three ways in. Never read or heard of speeders menacing the area, nor seen any obvious police presence ticketing traffic offenders to address a problem. As a matter of fact, I've never seen, or read, of any police focus in any school zone targeting speeders. Route 4, sure, never a school zone.

So, to recap... We have a Sheriff who receives millions of dollars, (not personally), from corporations to provide an above and beyond public service to those corporations, which the Commissioners allow. To having "special deputies" being paid by corporations while retaining their police powers. And now on top of that, to be the beneficiaries of the revenue generated by a passive, non-enforcement, mechanism. I also went to the Sheriff's Department website to look for the "à la carte services menu" and could not locate one. Because I really want to pay for some extra security for myself, with of course the possibility of having some minor infractions overlooked should I make a mistake somewhere along the line.

We have a lazy Sheriff. I wonder what he is going to do with all the time freed up that his deputies supposedly used prior to this? Reduce staff? (Joking, that'll never happen.) Focus on gangs, the heroin trade, or purchase more chairs so those deputies can sit on their asses surfing the internet trolling for, and enticing, Johns looking for some short term love?