States where you can drive fast

[High EGT]

The big point between the US and Europe is a matter of driver judgment when it comes to speed and fatalities. Europeans typically display a respect for high performance and act accordingly on the road by staying to the right if slower (no rolling road blocks) and display better judgment to weather conditions.
Also, I’m of the opinion that many accidents in the US occur as the result of overly conservative driver’s impeding traffic flow and thus creates a very dangerous situation that results in risk taking by drivers attempting to get around the road block.

But some researchers are skeptical about the link between accidents and high speeds on rural highways, if not on city streets and rural two-lanes. They point to the lower fatality rates on European highways, even though the speeds are generally higher.

The results were clear: "By and large, across the 50 states, there was no discernible effect from the higher limits," Yowell said. "Two or three states actually had a decrease in fatalities."

States where you can drive fast - CNN.com

 

[Agee]

Also, I’m of the opinion that many accidents in the US occur as the result of overly conservative driver’s impeding traffic flow and thus creates a very dangerous situation that results in risk taking by drivers attempting to get around the road block.

States where you can drive fast - CNN.com

Agree!
We've become impatient drivers. Impatience leads to carelessness, which in turn leads to either causing or getting caught-up in an accident. I'll admit my patience envelope gets pushed and I have to remind myself, it's not worth the risks to arrive a few minutes earlier to the destination.

I also believe todays' drivers skill sets are lacking, especially in younger drivers.

 

[AndyMarquisLIVE]

I also believe todays' drivers skill sets are lacking, especially in younger drivers.

Well, thanks to mandatory privatized drivers education, those young drivers you speak of also get like 6 hours of driving time with a skilled, certified professional.

My parents always told me they had half of a school semester in driving school at their high school and lots of seat time with an experienced driver.

That doesn't happen anymore.

And, if you think Maryland State's learned anything from the rash of deadly accidents down here and is willing to flip the bill for better education, well, think again.

 

[PsyOps]

The big point between the US and Europe is a matter of driver judgment when it comes to speed and fatalities. Europeans typically display a respect for high performance and act accordingly on the road by staying to the right if slower (no rolling road blocks) and display better judgment to weather conditions.

I haven't checked the stats lately but Germany used to have the highest auto accident fatality rate in the world. This was back in the early 90s when I lived there. And it was attributed to high speeds. Because of this they have started instituting speed limits where they didn't exist. If the stats have dropped then I would have to say it's because of this. On the other end of the spectrum I would guess there are increasing road fatailities in the US because we have become faster drivers.

Also, I’m of the opinion that many accidents in the US occur as the result of overly conservative driver’s impeding traffic flow and thus creates a very dangerous situation that results in risk taking by drivers attempting to get around the road block.

Can you define more clearly what you mean by "overly conservative" driver? Are you suggesting there shouldn't be speed limits? Are you suggesting people should decide for themselves what speed is okay for them?

 

[Agee]

Well, thanks to mandatory privatized drivers education, those young drivers you speak of also get like 6 hours of driving time with a skilled, certified professional.

My parents always told me they had half of a school semester in driving school at their high school and lots of seat time with an experienced driver.

That doesn't happen anymore.

And, if you think Maryland State's learned anything from the rash of deadly accidents down here and is willing to flip the bill for better education, well, think again.

Sounds like your parents had the same type of training as I did. Classroom, Simulator and on the road with the instructor. This was Virginia and all drivers Ed was taken care of by the state.

I've always maintained, that Maryland Drivers Education should be part of your school cirriculum. Marylands approach, through a boat-load of driving restrictions for younger drivers is like putting a band-aid on a gash. They are difficult to enforce and ignored by many a young driver.

The dynamics of driving on todays roads is a far cry more difficult than it was when I first started driving and personnally, many of todays youth at 16, aren't mature enough to get behind the wheel.

My .02 cents, and sorry to have drifted

 

[High EGT]

I haven't checked the stats lately but Germany used to have the highest auto accident fatality rate in the world. This was back in the early 90s when I lived there. And it was attributed to high speeds. Because of this they have started instituting speed limits where they didn't exist. If the stats have dropped then I would have to say it's because of this. On the other end of the spectrum I would guess there are increasing road fatailities in the US because we have become faster drivers.



Can you define more clearly what you mean by "overly conservative" driver? Are you suggesting there shouldn't be speed limits? Are you suggesting people should decide for themselves what speed is okay for them?

Staying on topic basically conservative would mean violaters of Baxters rules

Baxter's rule of thumb for computing the right speed limit is the traffic engineering standard known as the 85th percentile speed. That's the speed that 85 percent of motorists drive at or below. But it tends to be well above the speed limits that most jurisdictions set.

With the speed limit set at that level, traffic tends to move smoothly, reducing the risk of accidents, Baxter said. If you put the limit below that speed, some vehicles are traveling far more slowly than the fastest drivers, creating the most dangerous conditions of all.

 

[aps45819]

I would guess there are increasing road fatailities in the US because we have become faster drivers.

Can you define more clearly what you mean by "overly conservative" driver? Are you suggesting there shouldn't be speed limits? Are you suggesting people should decide for themselves what speed is okay for them?

I would say we have an increased number of accidents because we have an increased number of drivers. The death rate has actually dropped.

FYI: people do decide for themselves what speed is OK.

 

[aps45819]

And, if you think Maryland State's learned anything from the rash of deadly accidents down here and is willing to flip the bill for better education, well, think again.

Maryland is willing to force you to pay for a generic driving school, and charge the school a large fee.

Your legislators are only concerned with being re-elected and how to spend the money you earn.

 

[High EGT]

I would say we have an increased number of accidents because we have an increased number of drivers. The death rate has actually dropped.

FYI: people do decide for themselves what speed is OK.

Today’s cars are engineered so well that posted speed limits often are below what the car can safely perform at. Where we go wrong in this country is often (because of car performance) the driver (often teenagers) cannot make the distinction between safely and recklessness. And that’s the crux of where we fail in driver education.

 

[PsyOps]

Staying on topic basically conservative would mean violaters of Baxters rules

Baxter's rule of thumb for computing the right speed limit is the traffic engineering standard known as the 85th percentile speed. That's the speed that 85 percent of motorists drive at or below. But it tends to be well above the speed limits that most jurisdictions set.

With the speed limit set at that level, traffic tends to move smoothly, reducing the risk of accidents, Baxter said. If you put the limit below that speed, some vehicles are traveling far more slowly than the fastest drivers, creating the most dangerous conditions of all.

It's my thinking that, until you can change the law (the posted speed limits) you obey the law. Personally I don't feel comfortable driving much over 62 on rt 4. I would rather do closer to the speed limit, but it's just no safe with all the lead-foots. But there are too many that demand I go faster for their convenience. I'm pretty fed up with folks just taking it upon themselves to make their own rules. You can call me overly conservative if you want, but I will do what I feel is safe for me and those around me. Going faster does not equal safer. You have less time to respond to something unexpected (like a deer darting out in the road). You can't tell me you will be able to stop your vehicle more reasonably going at 75 than I will going 60.

And the other side of this is, I'm not going to get a ticket just to satisfy your impatient demand for me to comply to your rules of the road.

 

[PsyOps]

Today’s cars are engineered so well that posted speed limits often are below what the car can safely perform at. Where we go wrong in this country is often (because of car performance) the driver (often teenagers) cannot make the distinction between safely and recklessness. And that’s the crux of where we fail in driver education.

So you're saying driver education should be geared towards teaching someone how to drive these high-performance cars like the NASCAR circuit?

 

[LordStanley]

The problem lies now that people take car accidents for granited. Cars have become so safe that people feel that they dont need to learn how to drive properly, because their care will take care of them.

Hell now you dont even learn how to parralell park. Your car (expensive) does it for you. 20 years ago, when you got in an accident

Look how much society has changed over the last 20 years. Kids were taught to look both ways before they cross the street. Parents knew it was better to make the kids responsible for their actions, and you couldnt trust the life of your child to a stranger.

Now because of frivolous law suits and nanny governments, kids are being taught that they dont have to look after themselves, because other people will. How they drive is a direct result of that.

 

[aps45819]

So you're saying driver education should be geared towards teaching someone how to drive these high-performance cars like the NASCAR circuit?

YES!!!
Any goober can learn to make the number on the sign and the pointer on the speedometer correspond
I think that if you want to teach someone to drive, you should teach them the dynamics of driving.. What do you do if you car skids.? All the MD book says is to turn your wheels in the direction of the skid. Fine, what's next?
What's the difference between driving a front/rear/all wheel drive car?
Here's one - what do you do if you're in a pickup and when you pull into traffic your wheels start to spin.
We had a 20 year old get that one wrong last Friday

 

[theArtistFormerlyKnownAs]

YES!!!
Any goober can learn to make the number on the sign and the pointer on the speedometer correspond
I think that if you want to teach someone to drive, you should teach them the dynamics of driving.. What do you do if you car skids.? All the MD book says is to turn your wheels in the direction of the skid. Fine, what's next?
What's the difference between driving a front/rear/all wheel drive car?
Here's one - what do you do if you're in a pickup and when you pull into traffic your wheels start to spin.
We had a 20 year old get that one wrong last Friday

now i'm curious, I know what I personally do when my tires spin in the truck (ha, forget rain traction from a dead stop), but is there a SPECIFIC thing that you are "supposed" to do??

 

[LordStanley]

now i'm curious, I know what I personally do when my tires spin in the truck (ha, forget rain traction from a dead stop), but is there a SPECIFIC thing that you are "supposed" to do??

Umm, maybe let off the gas

 

[theArtistFormerlyKnownAs]

Umm, maybe let off the gas

I thought that was too obvious. I mean, thats obviously what I do, but I thought maybe there was some secret method because of the way aps put it

 

[High EGT]

It's my thinking that, until you can change the law (the posted speed limits) you obey the law. Personally I don't feel comfortable driving much over 62 on rt 4. I would rather do closer to the speed limit, but it's just no safe with all the lead-foots. But there are too many that demand I go faster for their convenience. I'm pretty fed up with folks just taking it upon themselves to make their own rules. You can call me overly conservative if you want, but I will do what I feel is safe for me and those around me. Going faster does not equal safer. You have less time to respond to something unexpected (like a deer darting out in the road). You can't tell me you will be able to stop your vehicle more reasonably going at 75 than I will going 60.

And the other side of this is, I'm not going to get a ticket just to satisfy your impatient demand for me to comply to your rules of the road.

You can call me overly conservative if you want, but I will do what I feel is safe for me and those around me.

If that includes intentionally driving a slower pace on the left passing lane thus imposing your will upon drivers in what you believe is a safe speed then yes you are overly conservative.
Whether or not I am exceeding the posted limit I intentionally stay in the right lane unless passing and is this very action you see in Europe that makes driving less hazardous and frankly less stressful.
Its also drivers that continually have their fangs out that are bothersome. They never seem to change style or habits due to weather or road conditions.

 

[aps45819]

I thought that was too obvious. I mean, thats obviously what I do, but I thought maybe there was some secret method because of the way aps put it

I put it that way because a young man didn't do that and died last Friday

 

[PsyOps]

If that includes intentionally driving a slower pace on the left passing lane thus imposing your will upon drivers in what you believe is a safe speed then yes you are overly conservative.

It’s not intentional in the sense that when you get behind I’m thinking, “I’m just going to slow this impatient guy down”. It’s only intentional from the perspective that I intend to drive as close to the speed limit as I feel is safe. And I’m not going to speed up for you so I can get a ticket. I’m also not going to speed up for you because you don’t feel it’s your responsibility to obey the law. And that’s the part I don’t get about your charge that “over conservative” drivers cause accidents. These drivers are obeying the law. The speeder is not. How do you conclude that it the ones obeying the law causing accidents?

Whether or not I am exceeding the posted limit I intentionally stay in the right lane unless passing and is this very action you see in Europe that makes driving less hazardous and frankly less stressful.

I do the same. I only get in the fast lane(s) to pass, then I get back in the slower lanes.

I just have to know though, what is it that is so important in your life that requires you to drive so fast and demand others to do the same or get out of your way? What is so hard about getting out a little earlier, slow down a bit, put on some Doobie Brothers and actually enjoy your ride? Have a little patience?

 

[PsyOps]

YES!!!
Any goober can learn to make the number on the sign and the pointer on the speedometer correspond
I think that if you want to teach someone to drive, you should teach them the dynamics of driving.. What do you do if you car skids.? All the MD book says is to turn your wheels in the direction of the skid. Fine, what's next?
What's the difference between driving a front/rear/all wheel drive car?
Here's one - what do you do if you're in a pickup and when you pull into traffic your wheels start to spin.
We had a 20 year old get that one wrong last Friday

Okay, I’ll buy some of that. I’ll even admit when I learned how to drive back in the mid 70s (now I’m showing my age) they didn’t really teach how to drive when skidding or other out-of control scenarios. Of course that may have more to do with creating a safe training course to teach these sorts of things. Too much liability to put 16 year olds in this sort of training. But driver education does not include driving at excessive speeds. One thing any driving school will stress is not exceeding the speed limit. Again liability. And that is what this discussion is about, EGT’s (and others like him) desire to drive fast. You will find no driving school that will teach this.