Supreme Court Puts New Limits on Vehicle Searches

[Larry Gude]

Larry i am summarizing, what i think your opinion is. Please correct it.

1-People should not be arrested for arrestable traffic violations.

2-If someone was arrested for an arrestable traffic violation their vehicle should not be searched.

That was not the law yesterday. Yesterday searching the car was allowed primarily BECAUSE it was considered a mobile conveyance and because of various case law about searching vehicles when an arrest is made.

I have explained why searching a car was good IE.. johnny and his drugs. I don't care about u or grandpa with his suspended license. I want little johnny and his dope.

This is really quite simple. Whatever makes it easier to get in to johnny's car is good. This change in the law makes it harder and thus is bad in my opinion.

That is not liberal. Siding on the criminal side is USUALLY liberal. Not saying you are. This ruling helps criminals keep their guns and drugs.

This is what I said;

And on the other hand, if the officers suspected intoxication, saw powder on the guys nose, had a cops intuition, then, suspicion sounds appropriate to me.

How in the world is that not self explanatory? You've done nothing since but suggest I was all for ignoring peoples criminal records, obvious other violations, suspicious behavior, the smell of dope smoke etc and etc.

 

[foodcritic]

This is what I said;

How in the world is that not self explanatory? You've done nothing since but suggest I was all for ignoring peoples criminal records, obvious other violations, suspicious behavior, the smell of dope smoke etc and etc.

For you totalitarians, what is the justification for searching someones car when you just pulled them over for a tail light being out, find their license is suspended and properly arrest them?

Because the law allowd for it.

Reasonable suspicion? Tail light out, ergo, search the car ergo search the home ergo search the office?

Having a tail light out does not get your vehicle or home seached.

I am opposed to Miranda; murder suspects car is searched 'illegally', body is now inadmissible. Violator of life, liberty and pursuit of happiness is set free.

I don't know what this means....

I am also opposed to using minor civil offenses, jay walking, cutting in line, speeding tickets, being the pretext for assuming other guilt's. In this case searching someones car has NOTHING to do with why they drew police attention. Searching a murder suspects car or a robbery suspect or someone who ran from the police is quite another thing.

Larry here is wher you seem to be missing it.

And on the other hand, if the officers suspected intoxication, saw powder on the guys nose, had a cops intuition, then, suspicion sounds appropriate to me.

The police use the above powder, intuition/suspicion ...You don't want the pretexted stops YET YET you want them to use the "intuition" angle. Like i told you the police Can't stop people on intuition....ergo "MINOR CIVIL OFFENSES ETC ETC" to get the job done...this is not complicated.

We have a constitutional protection from unreasonable search and seizure. In this case, the search sounds unreasonable.

 

[RadioPatrol]

Quote:
Reasonable suspicion? Tail light out, ergo, search the car ergo search the home ergo search the office?

Having a tail light out does not get your vehicle or home searched.

Nope your Storm Trooper buddies execute a walk around with a dope dog for pulling in the wrong driveway of a $ 20 motel on Rt 1 @ 2300 hrs (this was back in 1997, but the dive is still $ 20 bucks a night .... and operantly has a rep I knew nothing about at the time )

under a pretext of acting suspicious .....


Claimed to have found POT Seeds .... but produced none

Found a loaded .44 Colt Navy, but were too stupid to disassemble the weapon to disable it .... (Colt Don't Leave Home Without It)


and found several Prescription Allergy Meds, in a zip lock baggie ...


and I skated on the entire stop and was told not to come back ....


still not sure about the last part ....

oh did I mention I was driving a 78 VW Camper with a cammo paint job ( no hippy flower job for me ) and had a 19 yr old girl in the car with me ... my GF at the time

 

[ylexot]

This is really quite simple. Whatever makes it easier to get in to johnny's car is good. This change in the law makes it harder and thus is bad in my opinion.

How about carte blanche to go search his vehicle whenever/wherever you want?

Sorry, but we have something called the Constitution.

 

[foodcritic]

How about carte blanche to go search his vehicle whenever/wherever you want?

Sorry, but we have something called the Constitution.

Thank you. You have provided me with the perfect example of what it means to take something COMPLETELY OUT OF CONTEXT......

 

[This_person]

My own practical experience with searches incident to the arrest of suspect for arrestable traffic violations. That was the way I and other police were trained. Our training was based on judicial law at the time.

But, those searches of which you speak would still be legal. They would merely require a warrent, which means you'd actually have to have a reason (vice Eater-Egg Hunting) to do the search.

 

[RadioPatrol]

Out of that entire post, which may or maynot have been informative, this is all i got out of it

 

[foodcritic]

Nope your Storm Trooper buddies execute a walk around with a dope dog for pulling in the wrong driveway of a $ 20 motel on Rt 1 @ 2300 hrs (this was back in 1997, but the dive is still $ 20 bucks a night .... and operantly has a rep I knew nothing about at the time )

under a pretext of acting suspicious .....


Claimed to have found POT Seeds .... but produced none

Found a loaded .44 Colt Navy, but were too stupid to disassemble the weapon to disable it .... (Colt Don't Leave Home Without It)


and found several Prescription Allergy Meds, in a zip lock baggie ...


and I skated on the entire stop and was told not to come back ....


still not sure about the last part ....

oh did I mention I was driving a 78 VW Camper with a cammo paint job ( no hippy flower job for me ) and had a 19 yr old girl in the car with me ... my GF at the time

Scanning your car is perfecly acceptable during a traffic stop. As long as it is done with in the time frame of the stop and citiation being issued.

You should be happy the popo are doing their job.....watching known drug dens for users and dealers....

Anyone is a VW camper is suspicious in my mind.

 

[RadioPatrol]

Scanning your car is perfecly acceptable during a traffic stop. As long as it is done with in the time frame of the stop and citiation being issued.

You should be happy the popo are doing their job.....watching known drug dens for users and dealers....

Anyone is a VW camper is suspicious in my mind.

even with cammo not flowers .......

 

[somdrenter]

I gave you real world examples of what goes on every day. Pre-text stops on people you know have criminal history.

Well sh*@, forget the pretext; just start pulling people over and searching based on criminal history.. Remove “just cause” and “reasonable” altogether. How novel.

 

[foodcritic]

Well sh*@, forget the pretext; just start pulling people over and searching based on criminal history.. Remove “just cause” and “reasonable” altogether. How novel.

Ok...u search grandma at the airport because she is suspicious.

It would be wrong to just pull people over with out a lawful reason to stop them, silly.

"hey look at that nice young lady stopping cars at the intersection and talking to the driver....hhmmmm she must be lost and asking for directions...maybe she was asking if they have seen her lost puppy.....hhmmm this is not strange to me at 2am.. hhhmmmm I will go on with my head in the sand....nope nothing wrong.. why are the police always harassing this poor lady? I wish they would go find some REAL criminals..."

 

[somdrenter]

It would be wrong to just pull people over with out a lawful reason to stop them, silly.

And equally wrong to perform a search for a traffic violation…..

Silly.

 

[foodcritic]

And equally wrong to perform a search for a traffic violation…..

Silly.

OK so when you arrest a drunk or "high" for a "traffic offense" you don't search the car? You don't know what you are talking about!!. Could there be alcohol in the car? DO YOU THINK THAT MAY BE RELEVANT to the case??

It was not "silly" just a few days ago.. It was the lawful end result of a traffic arrest.

These searches will still go on it will just require more articulation....

 

[eddy1]

OK so when you arrest a drunk or "high" for a "traffic offense" you don't search the car? You don't know what you are talking about!!. Could there be alcohol in the car? DO YOU THINK THAT MAY BE RELEVANT to the case??

It was not "silly" just a few days ago.. It was the lawful end result of a traffic arrest.

These searches will still go on it will just require more articulation....

Exactly!

 

[somdrenter]

OK so when you arrest a drunk or "high" for a "traffic offense" you don't search the car? You don't know what you are talking about!!. Could there be alcohol in the car? DO YOU THINK THAT MAY BE RELEVANT to the case??

It was not "silly" just a few days ago.. It was the lawful end result of a traffic arrest.

These searches will still go on it will just require more articulation....

OK so when you arrest a drunk or "high" for a "traffic offense" you don't search the car? You don't know what you are talking about!!. Could there be alcohol in the car? DO YOU THINK THAT MAY BE RELEVANT to the case??

It was not "silly" just a few days ago.. It was the lawful end result of a traffic arrest.

These searches will still go on it will just require more articulation....

Tough one there FC.

But the case is not referring to DUI/DWI is it?

Fourth Amendment…Read it sometime.

 

[This_person]

OK so when you arrest a drunk or "high" for a "traffic offense" you don't search the car? You don't know what you are talking about!!. Could there be alcohol in the car? DO YOU THINK THAT MAY BE RELEVANT to the case??

It was not "silly" just a few days ago.. It was the lawful end result of a traffic arrest.

These searches will still go on it will just require more articulation....

Again, how is this decision bad, since the searches can still happen, they just require someone to agree that there is reasonable cause to search?

 

[foodcritic]

Tough one there FC.

But the case is not referring to DUI/DWI is it?

Fourth Amendment…Read it sometime.

The USSC decision does not mention DUI, his issue is a suspended license. But the end result is the same. BOTH offenses are arrestable. And so they both have the same result.

I guess the USSC, and just about every other court, was not reading the constitution when it came to the authority of search incident to arrest from traffic stops. JMHO

 

[eddy1]

The USSC decision does not mention DUI, his issue is a suspended license. But the end result is the same. BOTH offenses are arrestable. And so they both have the same result.

I guess the USSC, and just about every other court, was not reading the constitution when it came to the authority of search incident to arrest from traffic stops. JMHO

Does the constitution address that?

 

[foodcritic]

Again, how is this decision bad, since the searches can still happen, they just require someone to agree that there is reasonable cause to search?

Right, the searches will still happen. It won't require someone to agree to probable cause. It will now require the police to have to articulate more when contraband is found. Now maybe to some that is not a bad thing. I think it is because it will put, in my opinion, more burden on the police for something that they were have been trained to do and have been doing for a long time.

 

[eddy1]

I don't really see this opinion as a detriment to good police work. If you are arresting a person, and they have no i.d, then you can search the vehicle. If you are arresting them up for dui, then you can search for miniature bottles of alcohol. If you are arresting them because their license is suspended and they have their license on them, then why search the vehicle in the first place? If you feel you have probable cause to search the vehicle, then tow it and get a warrant.