Tom DeLay

[rraley]

I've been watching Crossfire today, and a major portion of it was dedicated to the issue of the ethics (lack of) by House of Representatives Majority Leader Tom DeLay. There are some serious allegations against Rep. DeLay, but what has he and his Republican surrogates done? Avoid, label this as yet another farce by the liberal media. Yet they do not recall that DeLay was admonished three times last year by a bipartisan Ethics Committee (each admonishment was unanimous). In fact, the committee was so harsh on DeLay, that the House of Representatives, dominated by Republicans, decided to restructure the rules and name a new chairman for the committee. This is ridiculous; DeLay is hiding something and running behind a liberal media smoke screen will not be sufficient.

Congressional ethics are abused by the majority party. They were under Democrats and Republicans. We don't need to reform ethics laws, we need to enforce them. We need leaders who are willing to hit on a suspected congressman, even if they are within their own party. What we do not need are leaders who decide to divert, distract, or avoid.

It's time for DeLay to go.

 

[vraiblonde]

What exactly did Tom Delay do, anyway? I googled him and found a bunch of stuff that insinuated everyone KNOWS what he did, but nothing that actually said what it was.

Wake me up when he commits perjury in front of a Grand Jury in order to avoid being held responsible for sexually harrassing a state employee, then orchestrates a character assassination on the guy HE appointed to investigate his money laundering and shady land deals.

Or when the intern he's having an affair with turns up dead in a DC park.

Or when he hires his gay Israeli lover as his Homeland Security advisor.

 

[rraley]

Vrai, this isn't about Clinton, McGreevey, or Condit...this is about Tom DeLay...

Here's some information, condensed style...

He offered a retiring Republican congressman his support for the congressman's son in the upcoming primary for the seat if he voted for the Prescription Drug Benefit

He called the Department of Homeland Security to track an airplane used by Texas Democrats who fled the state legislature to stall redistricting

He created an appearance of creating special access for donors to his campaign on pending energy legislation

Three DeLay associates and eight corporations have been indicted by a Texas grand jury for campaign fundraising problems involving the 2002 state legislature elections in Texas

Multiple, expensive foreign travel arrangements have been paid for DeLay and his aides by non-profit organizations that front for lobbyists

This is all developing and the media is covering it has new information is learned...I would keep up with it; this guy's been in power too long.

 

[vraiblonde]

Good heavens, Raley - you just named 99% of Congress!

Why is it so important now that it's Delay? I mean, I'm no big fan of the guy anyway, especially after the Terri Schiavo crap, but please. This stuff is so routine it's a cliche.

Oh...right...this isn't about Nancy Pelosi or Al Gore or Bill Clinton or Carol Mosely Braun or Robert Byrd or John Kerry or Harry Reid. It's about Tom Delay.

 

[rraley]

Vrai, the difference between that list of Democrats and Tom DeLay is that those Democrats (save Pelosi and Reid, of whom no credible allegations have been made) have all been investigated by the Congress. DeLay has not been put under the same scrutiny.

On edit: sorry, but neither Kerry nor Byrd was investigated either (once again no credible allegations; skeleton in Byrd's closet is that he was once a member of the KKK)

 

[Pete]

Vrai, this isn't about Clinton, McGreevey, or Condit...this is about Tom DeLay...

Here's some information, condensed style...

Good grief Trent Lott utters a praise of an old man and he is ridden out on a rail, Ted Kennedy kills someone and he is still sitting in the Senate sweating ready to croak, Barney Frank fingers some pages.....well we get the idea but deLay is a horrible monster?

He offered a retiring Republican congressman his support for the congressman's son in the upcoming primary for the seat if he voted for the Prescription Drug Benefit

Done all the time.

He called the Department of Homeland Security to track an airplane used by Texas Democrats who fled the state legislature to stall redistricting

That is slightly inappropriate but so is fleeing the state to avoid voting and getting beat by the majority.

He created an appearance of creating special access for donors to his campaign on pending energy legislation

Last time I saw an "appearance" was not against any law or the rules of the Senate.

Three DeLay associates and eight corporations have been indicted by a Texas grand jury for campaign fundraising problems involving the 2002 state legislature elections in Texas

But DeLay himself has not been indicted. Guilt by association works in Columbia, Cambodia and Cuba but not here.

Multiple, expensive foreign travel arrangements have been paid for DeLay and his aides by non-profit organizations that front for lobbyists

99% of congress does this. Braun went on a huge junket to Africa at taxpayer expense. I would rather lobbyists pay than us.

This is all developing and the media is covering it has new information is learned...I would keep up with it; this guy's been in power too long.

He is the target of the year. They pick out the weak one from the herd and run them down until they are exhausted.

I am reminded of a confirmation hearing for Sec. Def. the nominee was John Tower and I believe it was under Bush I. He was defeated in the Senate because he was a dirty low down scoundrel, drunk womanizing loser. Funny thing is he had just retired from the Senate and all those who voted against him were chasing women and drinking right along with him. Politics, he was fine when he was there, but was murdered in the press and the Sentate for political reasons. Asking these people to police themselves is a laugh. It is all about politics, Delay is just the target right now. The simple fact remains he was legaly elected and short of being convicted of a felony they can only smear the mans reputation in hopes they wil strike a nerve and force him to quit.

 

[Bruzilla]

There's nothing that DeLay has done that isn't done by every other member of Congress, and they are not against the laws (either real laws or Congressional laws.) The tracking of the airplane may have made folks mad, but there was nothing illegal about it.

How could DeLay have been admonished three times if there was no investigations???

Lastly, the rule changes that you talk about deal with new requirements to allow a Congressmen under investigation to choose his/her own lawyer; to be informed when there is an investigation underway; and allow an investigation to be stopped with a majority vote. I think that the first two changes are needed without discussion.

As for the last one, this change was brought about to put an end to needless investigations being initiated by one or two Congressmen/women for political purposes. Since there is a 50/50 mix of Republicans and Democrats all of the members of one party can't vote to stop an investigation. At least one member of the opposition party must also agree that the investigation is not warranted. This is by no means an effort to prevent DeLay getting investigated as there's little chance any Dem on the committee, but it will hopefully put an end to one or two people staging bogus investigations on other people.

 

[Toxick]

What exactly did Tom Delay do, anyway? I googled him and found a bunch of stuff that insinuated everyone KNOWS what he did, but nothing that actually said what it was.

Who cares what he did?

The guy has an {R} after his name, and that's good enough for me. You just KNOW he's up to no effing good.


LYNCH THE S.O.B.

 

[rraley]

Toxick, this has nothing to do with DeLay's status as a Republican.

The GOP is so concerned about DeLay's ethical history that they changed House rules so that leaders indicted during their service are not required to resign that leadership post. Disgusting. Democrats did that in 1993 to protect the former chairman of the Approrpriations committee, and Republicans had a field day. Now they do the same thing. Pathetic, utterly pathetic.

Poor ethics transcends party lines, right now power is being abused by the party in power, so its time for a new order.

 

[SmallTown]

Poor ethics transcends party lines, right now power is being abused by the party in power, so its time for a new order.

So going by your others posts, democrat abuse is better than republican abuse

 

[rraley]

No Smalltown, what I am suggesting is that after a certain amount of time, change in leadership is needed to check the spread of poor ethics. The GOP was pretty good ethically for the couple of cycles after 94, and besides Gingrich, who resigned, has remained pretty solid. It is not until this DeLay Congress that it has gotten out of hand.

 

[Lenny]

Who cares what he did?

The guy has an {R} after his name, and that's good enough for me. You just KNOW he's up to no effing good.


LYNCH THE S.O.B.

This is the Democrats' vengence for Frist compaigning against Daschle in South Dakota. That's it!

 

[Bustem' Down]

When did politicians get ethics?

 

[Bustem' Down]

The tracking of the airplane may have made folks mad, but there was nothing illegal about it.

I don't see why we shouldn't track planes.

 

[Ken King]

... that they changed House rules ...

Isn't that their Constitutional prerogative?

 

[Larry Gude]

Ah, now we're getting somewhere...

DeLay Congress

So now it's not just Delay, it's 'his' entire Congress.

RR, you need to do your homework and quit reading your talking points. When you do your homework you will find that the charges against Delay are silly at best.

Say this out loud: "My team wants Delay out because he's kicking our butts."

As of about a week ago, my side was LIVID with Delay for his outrageous handling of the Terri case. So, instead of letting us handle OUR problem Democrats, once again, get in their own way.

You're too young to hold accountable for Clinton but to be scolded by any Democrat about ethics is to be lectured by a drug addict about the perils of caffeine. Your side sat on its collective hands for 8 years while crime after crime after crime was commited by the Clintons and your guys made excuse after excuse after excuse.

So now, instead of focusing on Delay and the over the top manner in which he went charging after the Constitution and judges, my side is forced by Democrat attacks to reassess our guy and notice that a great many of the screamers on your side went right along with Tom's assault on Michael Schiavo. That maybe instead of holding Tom accountable, we now notice that a great many of his detractors have done similarly 'iffy' things with travel and constituent favors.

So, if Delay survives this, and I'm starting to think he should, he'll owe this pathetic little "Get Tom" scheme a great thanks.

 

[vraiblonde]

Isn't that their Constitutional prerogative?

Democrats think that only THEY can exercise their majority. When Republicans are in power, they cry and scream about how the Rs are "partisan" and demand that they do what Democrats say. Unfortunately, Republicans fall for this tantrum-throwing every time and temper their agenda or abandon it completely.

 

[Bruzilla]

Maybe RR will start yelling about how Senate Democrats changed the rules about using proposed fillibusters to stall votes on judges.

 

[vraiblonde]

Maybe RR will start yelling about how Senate Democrats changed the rules about using proposed fillibusters to stall votes on judges.

Dream on. The talking points are already out on that one. Harry Reid says that it's a fundamental responsibility of the government to filibuster judicial nominees and it's the most patriotic thing you can do, as a Congressman. He and Nancy Pelosi went on and on about it. They didn't say WHY it was so patriotic, just dodged that question and kept to their script.

 

[rraley]

On a side note, I agree with Bob Dole, the NRA, and Harry Reid that the Senate filibuster should be maintained as is and that to go to the nuclear option would spark a brand new, even harsher time of partisanship than before.

Back to the matter at hand, this has nothing to do with "talking points." This has to do with calling a spade a spade. When there are serious, substantial allegations against the majority leader, they should be investigated. What should not happen is a changing of the rules so that that investigation can be halted. This has nothing to do with the Schiavo case (which pissed the hell out of me, on a side note), because this was going on long before that. Many were suggesting that DeLay came out so hardcore on that issue to get his negative news off the front pages and to rally conservatives behind him.

Look, there have been admonishments, indictments, and questions about ethics...shouldn't it be looked into, not avoided? We know what many within the GOP have decided to say about this (save Chris Shays and some others who hold ethics above partisanship), and if they don't decide to change their ways, then we should consider getting them out of power in this country in that chamber.