Where Did God come From?

[gumbo]

I have read the Bible a few times, staying mostly in the New Testament and I do consider myself a Christan.
I was conversing with someone about God today and was asked a question that left me at a loss for words.
Where did God come from ? Then I was asked who created God ?
Now that I felt like a Deer looking into a set of high beams.
I was asked yet a third question.
Did God create us or did we create God ?

The third question asked really got to me because I can't answer the first two.





Help !

 

[Railroad]

God didn't "come from" anywhere. He is timeless, and has always existed, and always will exist. Nobody "created" God. He is the Alpha and the Omega, the Beginning and the End. All beings have an origin - and He is the Origin of them all.

 

[gumbo]

God didn't "come from" anywhere. He is timeless, and has always existed, and always will exist. Nobody "created" God. He is the Alpha and the Omega, the Beginning and the End. All beings have an origin - and He is the Origin of them all.

This is fine for someone who wants to believe or for someone like myself that just excepts it's beyond my comprehension, but when debating about this with an atheist ?

 

[Railroad]

This is fine for someone who wants to believe or for someone like myself that just excepts it's beyond my comprehension, but when debating about this with an atheist ?

Ask the atheist where he/she came from. And for every answer, ask where THAT came from. At some point (and it won't take long), you'll make it to the point where the atheist is just as stumped as you are.

When you remove all other options, the answer is God.

Other than that, I can advise you to also ask 2A and see what his answer is.

 

[Tonio]

Ask the atheist where he/she came from. And for every answer, ask where THAT came from. At some point (and it won't take long), you'll make it to the point where the atheist is just as stumped as you are.

When you remove all other options, the answer is God.

Other than that, I can advise you to also ask 2A and see what his answer is.

I've met a few athiests, and only one wanted to force his beliefs on everyone else. I believe that every political or religious following has people like that, who can't just let others alone with their beliefs. They're in the minority, but they're extremely vocal, and they seem defensive about their beliefs.

I don't think the existence of God can be proven or disproven logically. And why would you WANT to try to prove the existence of God? Isn't it enough that you and I believe He exists?

 

[2ndAmendment]

This is fine for someone who wants to believe or for someone like myself that just excepts it's beyond my comprehension, but when debating about this with an atheist ?

The first thing you must understand is there is no way to debate an atheist. Atheism is as much a religion as any other although I do not consider Christianity a religion but a relationship. Atheism is a belief system. They believe there is no God. Just like evolution is a belief system; can't prove evolution either. I believe the Bible about creation. Period. If the wisdom of man disagrees with the Bible, then I accept the Bible.

You say your are a Christian. Believe the Bible. You must if you are a Christian; people that don't that call themselves Christian are deluding themselves in my opinion. The Bible says God is the Alpha and the Omega and the Creator of all things. God is spiritual and lives in the spirit. You cannot prove spirit. Just as there is no way for them to prove that there is no God.

We have to have faith of a little child. A little kid believes everything their parents tell them. That is why I think Santa Claus, the Easter Bunny, Tooth Fairy, and the like are so dangerous. We tell kids to believe in God, Santa, and the Easter Bunny, and then tell them that Santa and the Easter Bunny are not real. Duh. Well dad, you lied about Santa and the Easter Bunny, why should I believe you about God?

Just tell them that the things of the Spirit are only understandable by those that are of the Spirit. That is in the Bible by the way. You don't understand to believe; you believe to understand.

 

[mAlice]

Did God create us or did we create God ?

The third question asked really got to me because I can't answer the first two.





Help !

I can't help you, but I do believe man created god. That's just my opinion and I don't expect anyone else to change their views based on that opinion. Each to their own. I feel that one must take comfort wherever it can be found.

 

[Toxick]

but when debating about this with an atheist ?

Debating with an atheist is like having sex with a tree-knot.
Fun for a few minutes - but ultimately pointless, and sometimes painful.



Their minds are made up. Period. And most of the atheists I have dealt with are every bit as zealous and proselytizing and convinced of their own grasp of the truth as any fundamentalist christian I've ever met.


If their minds weren't made up, they would call themselves "agnostic".

Although, in my experience, an agnostic is simply an atheist who is unwilling to make the commitment.

 

[aps45819]

This is fine for someone who wants to believe or for someone like myself that just excepts it's beyond my comprehension,

You've just defined "Faith"
It's beyond everybody's comprehension, anything that can be defined or comprehended has limits, God doesn't.

 

[mAlice]

Debating with an atheist is like having sex with a tree-knot.
Fun for a few minutes - but ultimately pointless, and sometimes painful.



Their minds are made up. Period. And most of the atheists I have dealt with are every bit as zealous and proselytizing and convinced of their own grasp of the truth as any fundamentalist christian I've ever met.


If their minds weren't made up, they would call themselves "agnostic".

Although, in my experience, an agnostic is simply an atheist who is unwilling to make the commitment.

Debating the existence of a deity is futile at best.

Yes, my mind is made up, but I don't think I'm zealous about it by any stretch of the imagination. I don't care for that type attacking me with their beliefs, so I won't do the same to someone else. I just hope you're not confusing zeal with refusal to cave in to someone else's beliefs.

 

[Tonio]

Debating with an atheist is like having sex with a tree-knot.
Fun for a few minutes - but ultimately pointless, and sometimes painful.



Their minds are made up. Period. And most of the atheists I have dealt with are every bit as zealous and proselytizing and convinced of their own grasp of the truth as any fundamentalist christian I've ever met.


If their minds weren't made up, they would call themselves "agnostic".

Although, in my experience, an agnostic is simply an atheist who is unwilling to make the commitment.

You could make a good argument that athiesm draws more than its share of close-minded zealots. But I believe most of the zealots were like that before they discovered athiesm, and the belief system just goes along well with their zealotry. For whatever reason, the zealots seem personally offended that you don't believe what they believe. At least the PETA zealots try to be funny in their zealotry.

 

[Tonio]

Debating the existence of a deity is futile at best.

Yes, my mind is made up, but I don't think I'm zealous about it by any stretch of the imagination. I don't care for that type attacking me with their beliefs, so I won't do the same to someone else. I just hope you're not confusing zeal with refusal to cave in to someone else's beliefs.

Good reply. Zealots are people who insist that only their beliefs are right. In their eyes, if you believe something else, then you're a cancer on the human race.

 

[Toxick]

Yes, my mind is made up, but I don't think I'm zealous about it by any stretch of the imagination. I don't care for that type attacking me with their beliefs, so I won't do the same to someone else. I just hope you're not confusing zeal with refusal to cave in to someone else's beliefs.

No, I'm quite sure I know what the definition of zeal is.

I don't think I've demonstrated that sort of ignorance, that you would think I would conflate those two things.



There are atheists who - when they get on the subject of God - will launch an all out frontal assault on any 'xtian' who dares cross their path. I will not say most atheists are that way - much like most christians will not "attack" you with their beliefs, but they are there, and they are vocal.


And it is, indeed, the vocal ones who set the perception of their respective groups.

 

[mAlice]

No, I'm quite sure I know what the definition of zeal is.

I didn't mean to imply that you're ignorant of the definition. I've just seen a lot of zeal in the form of, not so much trying to spread the word, but to convince someone why they are wrong in their beliefs, whatever they may be, instead of just accepting that people are different.

 

[mAlice]

I didn't mean to imply that you're ignorant of the definition. I've just seen a lot of zeal in the form of, not so much trying to spread the word, but to convince someone why they are wrong in their beliefs, whatever they may be, instead of just accepting that people are different.

Maybe none of this makes sense...I've been out of sorts this week.

 

[Toxick]

Maybe none of this makes sense...I've been out of sorts this week.

No, it made sense.

And unfortunately, I can understand zealotry in all it's forms, and I understand why people have debates and arguments and will continue to do so until we all reach the clearing at the end of the path.

I don't condone such zealotry, and I don't engage in it - but I understand it.

People will always think that they're right. If they didn't think their belief system was THE RIGHT ONE, it would cease being their belief system. And one of the hardest things for a human being to do, is to believe that they are correct about something, and still stand idly by as they watch someone doing what they believe to be the incorrect thing.

(I have long stated: If you want to learn about something, go on the internet and make an incorrect statement about it - you will suddenly be completely innundated with more information about the subject than you ever cared to know.)


Very few people believe that "everyone has their own truth and it's as valid to them as your beliefs are to you". (Personally, I'm not one of these people. I believe something is either right or not right. I've chosen a belief system based on my observations and where the evidence has led me, and I'm sure I'm right).

Human nature + diversity = conflict.



God must have been laughing as he was mixing up that stew.

 

[mAlice]

Looking at Beaker's thread...Ken Rosignol is a zealot. He think's society in general should pay for his loss.

 

[mAlice]

Looking at Beaker's thread...Ken Rosignol is a zealot. He think's society in general should pay for his loss.

Pardon me...Beaky. Maybe a nose thing? :shrug:

 

[California_bred]

Debating with an atheist is like having sex with a tree-knot.
Fun for a few minutes - but ultimately pointless, and sometimes painful.

I know you mentioned fundamental Christians but can't you place any fanatic from any religious or non-religious groups in that statement? I've had more Christians try to force their religious beliefs on me than any other groups. Most atheists I have met don't even bother unless the subject comes up.

 

[2ndAmendment]

I know you mentioned fundamental Christians but can't you place any fanatic from any religious or non-religious groups in that statement? I've had more Christians try to force their religious beliefs on me than any other groups. Most atheists I have met don't even bother unless the subject comes up.

The difference between Christians bringing the subject up and atheists not bringing the topic up is that Christians are charged with the duty to go into all the world and make disciples. Atheists aren't.

Mark 16:14-16

The Disciples Commissioned

<sup id="en-NASB-24888">14</sup>Afterward He appeared to the eleven themselves as they were reclining at the table; and He reproached them for their unbelief and hardness of heart, because they had not believed those who had seen Him after He had risen. <sup id="en-NASB-24889">15</sup>And He said to them, "Go into all the world and preach the gospel to all creation.

<sup id="en-NASB-24890">16</sup>"He who has believed and has been baptized shall be saved; but he who has disbelieved shall be condemned.

New Christians are more likely to try to "force" you to believe. Mature Christians would still like you to believe and will discuss faith in God with you, but will not force anything. It is a matter of realizing that it is not the job of a Christian to convert anyone. It is the job of all Christians to proclaim the Gospel. The conversion is up to the Holy Spirit. If a person rejects the gospel, a Christian should fall back on

Matthew 7:6
<sup id="en-NASB-23323">6</sup>"Do not give what is holy to dogs, and do not throw your pearls before swine, or they will trample them under their feet, and turn and tear you to pieces.