Wife SWAP

[PsyOps]

Then what is this whole rant about? Im sensing a conflict between this and your other post.

I don't generally over analyze, so how about just answering the questions you pose in the second paragraph?

You do understand what a debate forum is all about don’t you? I am providing my opinion on the subject. Others chimed in. I countered, they countered. We had a debate in a forum.

I can’t figure out for the life of me why folks come in here and attack people for using a forum for its designed purpose? What is your purpose here? If you don’t have anything tangible to add to the discussion other than tell me I’m ranting, then perhaps you ought to just move along.

And you do specifically over analyze people having an opinion. So you’re just as guilty.

I already have answered those questions. Go back and read. I’m going to repeat for you again. Do you have answers for those questions?

 

[Larry Gude]

your perversion is ok
MY perversion is ok


someone said it the other day, now that Gay Marriage is Normalized, can the Polygamists be far behind


I would add NAMBLA and dog humpers to that question

What will they make you do next?



I knew at an early age I wasn't gay. My brother new he was. I was looking at boobs in dads Playboys we'd stolen and he was looking at the male models. No one made him gay.

As I became a man, moving on to 30 and now nearly 50, I LONG ago lost my attraction to high school girls let alone children.

I've never had the urge to #### a dog. Or a chicken. Or build a pit in my basement.

Of course, if I, somehow, developed a desire for 3 or 4 wives, that could change. I might find myself wanting a place to hide.

It seems to be the case that the only reason a lot of people out there are NOT gay is that you were told to not be and I find that fascinating and terrifying at the same time.

I came to being a Republican naturally. I fell in love with the electric guitar on my own. I didn't like Lima beans as a kid without being told how yuck they are. And I was able to successful grow to detest people like Donny Douche without wanting them locked up or killed.

Maybe I got it all wrong. Maybe gay marriage is going to suddenly make hoards of Christian men suddenly just tell the old lady "Look, baby, it's been great but, now that it's OK, well, I gotta be me. I can't deny it any more. And I can't keep my mouth shut any longer; your taste in drapery sucks."

If the goal was ever to oppose gay marriage the best, the BEST path would have been to look at your life, the kids, the bills, the expectations, the responsibilities, the never ending stress and strain and then look at gays, burst out laughing and say "Have at it, pal!"

The opposition has served NO purpose, advanced NO interest, has harmed the GOP, gravely, and served as no bargaining chip politically to get something we'd like. Reaffirmed gun rights. 100 mph speed limits on interstates. Beer as the national drink. ANYTHING.

I don't get it. I never will. What have you gained in this sandcastle by the waters edge endeavor? We on the right have failed the nation on wars, budgets, entitlements, Wall Street, Healthcare, immigration, getting NOTHING productive and healthy for the nation done and yet, we wanna lose this meaningless fight?

Gay marriage WON'T make you gay. Nor your kids. It won't take away YOUR right to marry only women. It won't.

 

[sockgirl77]

What will they make you do next?



I knew at an early age I wasn't gay. My brother new he was. I was looking at boobs in dads Playboys we'd stolen and he was looking at the male models. No one made him gay.

As I became a man, moving on to 30 and now nearly 50, I LONG ago lost my attraction to high school girls let alone children.

I've never had the urge to #### a dog. Or a chicken. Or build a pit in my basement.

Of course, if I, somehow, developed a desire for 3 or 4 wives, that could change. I might find myself wanting a place to hide.

It seems to be the case that the only reason a lot of people out there are NOT gay is that you were told to not be and I find that fascinating and terrifying at the same time.

I came to being a Republican naturally. I fell in love with the electric guitar on my own. I didn't like Lima beans as a kid without being told how yuck they are. And I was able to successful grow to detest people like Donny Douche without wanting them locked up or killed.

Maybe I got it all wrong. Maybe gay marriage is going to suddenly make hoards of Christian men suddenly just tell the old lady "Look, baby, it's been great but, now that it's OK, well, I gotta be me. I can't deny it any more. And I can't keep my mouth shut any longer; your taste in drapery sucks."

If the goal was ever to oppose gay marriage the best, the BEST path would have been to look at your life, the kids, the bills, the expectations, the responsibilities, the never ending stress and strain and then look at gays, burst out laughing and say "Have at it, pal!"

The opposition has served NO purpose, advanced NO interest, has harmed the GOP, gravely, and served as no bargaining chip politically to get something we'd like. Reaffirmed gun rights. 100 mph speed limits on interstates. Beer as the national drink. ANYTHING.

I don't get it. I never will. What have you gained in this sandcastle by the waters edge endeavor? We on the right have failed the nation on wars, budgets, entitlements, Wall Street, Healthcare, immigration, getting NOTHING productive and healthy for the nation done and yet, we wanna lose this meaningless fight?

Gay marriage WON'T make you gay. Nor your kids. It won't take away YOUR right to marry only women. It won't.

Well said!

 

[bcp]

LOL, and you think you're going to be at the gate, you have lost your mind!!!

there you go, another obama kiss ass liberal heathen trying to interpret a book that they have never read.

tell me sparky, what is it that makes you think I wont have a chance at the gates.

 

[Midnightrider]

You do understand what a debate forum is all about don’t you? I am providing my opinion on the subject. Others chimed in. I countered, they countered. We had a debate in a forum.

I can’t figure out for the life of me why folks come in here and attack people for using a forum for its designed purpose? What is your purpose here? If you don’t have anything tangible to add to the discussion other than tell me I’m ranting, then perhaps you ought to just move along.

And you do specifically over analyze people having an opinion. So you’re just as guilty.

I already have answered those questions. Go back and read. I’m going to repeat for you again. Do you have answers for those questions?

where is the attack and where did i over analyze you?

I am guessing in your debating you never heard of the socratic method

I do have answers to those questions. I'd be fine with any of those people coming to a school and talking about tolerance from their point of view.

So now please, go ahead and answer THOSE questions. I dont want to have to go back and read between the lines of a bunch of your posts only to over analyze your statements.

 

[SoMDGirl42]

Gay marriage WON'T make you gay. Nor your kids. It won't take away YOUR right to marry only women. It won't.

I think you may be right. I do believe gay people know from an early age they are gay.

I've never been attracted to another woman. I had my first crush on a boy in kindergarten. I know I'm not gay.

I have known a few people from the time they were very, very young, 3 or 4. I knew then they were gay. How did others not see it? :shrug:

I believe they are born gay. Just my opinion, but I'm not gay, so I'm not really sure.

 

[PsyOps]

where is the attack and where did i over analyze you?

I am guessing in your debating you never heard of the socratic method

I do have answers to those questions. I'd be fine with any of those people coming to a school and talking about tolerance from their point of view.

So now please, go ahead and answer THOSE questions. I dont want to have to go back and read between the lines of a bunch of your posts only to over analyze your statements.

The post you keep referring me to, demanding I answer my own questions, is – BY CRACKY – using the Socratic Method. I’m quite familiar with dialectics because it’s the form I typically like to use in debates. IF you’ve read my posts in the past you’d know this.

In response to my list of questions you originally popped in with:

Of all the changes to society you list, which if any are the result of gays being less oppressed in recent years?

IF you had read any of the thread you’d know that question is totally irrelevant to the point I was making. IF you had read the thread, you’d know I already answered those questions. Actually, IF you even read or tried to understand the questions you’d know they have very little to do with gays and oppression and more to do with where this country is trending morally. It’s not an attempt to define where we should be morally. I’m simply trying to get from anyone that is interested in having the discussion as to whether this country is on a moral decline or not; gay marriage only being one small part of the equation. I’m trying to frame this in an neutral way; except to say that in my life (50 years – or 75 in MMDad years ) I feel I’ve seen a decline in a lot of different places. Gay marriage is NOT necessarily one of them for me; but it is for great number of people.

 

[Midnightrider]

The post you keep referring me to, demanding I answer my own questions, is – BY CRACKY – using the Socratic Method. I’m quite familiar with dialectics because it’s the form I typically like to use in debates. IF you’ve read my posts in the past you’d know this.

In response to my list of questions you originally popped in with:



IF you had read any of the thread you’d know that question is totally irrelevant to the point I was making. IF you had read the thread, you’d know I already answered those questions. Actually, IF you even read or tried to understand the questions you’d know they have very little to do with gays and oppression and more to do with where this country is trending morally. It’s not an attempt to define where we should be morally. I’m simply trying to get from anyone that is interested in having the discussion as to whether this country is on a moral decline or not; gay marriage only being one small part of the equation. I’m trying to frame this in an neutral way; except to say that in my life (50 years – or 75 in MMDad years ) I feel I’ve seen a decline in a lot of different places. Gay marriage is NOT necessarily one of them for me; but it is for great number of people.

why are you so snarky?

IF you didn't ramble on and make it seem like you think everything is the fault of the gays and Obama, and IF you bothered to answer questions instead of demand that others go back and try to glean what your position is from your rambling posts, you might be able to get a point across.

instead you leave us to assume that your rambling about the decline of society is somehow linked to gays and their quest for equality.

so now that i have answerd your questions (from that second paragraph), how about giving them a shot yourself.

 

[PsyOps]

why are you so snarky?

IF you didn't ramble on and make it seem like you think everything is the fault of the gays and Obama, and IF you bothered to answer questions instead of demand that others go back and try to glean what your position is from your rambling posts, you might be able to get a point across.

instead you leave us to assume that your rambling about the decline of society is somehow linked to gays and their quest for equality.

so now that i have answerd your questions (from that second paragraph), how about giving them a shot yourself.

I’m being snarky? Do you have any mirrors in your house?

Please find where I once said it was the fault of gays and Obama? I don’t even recall mentioning Obama in this thread. I never claimed our decline is due to gays. See you jump into the middle of this discussion and really don’t know what you’re talking about in regards to my thoughts.

Go do you your homework, do some reading and we’ll discuss. I’m not doing it again for you.

And maybe I’m snarky because I like this band:

 

[Midnightrider]

I’m being snarky? Do you have any mirrors in your house?

Please find where I once said it was the fault of gays and Obama? I don’t even recall mentioning Obama in this thread. I never claimed our decline is due to gays. See you jump into the middle of this discussion and really don’t know what you’re talking about in regards to my thoughts.

Go do you your homework, do some reading and we’ll discuss. I’m not doing it again for you.

And maybe I’m snarky because I like this band:

I've read plenty of your writings but its not my "homework" to go chase down your answers only so you can claim that's not what you meant.

What is so hard about those questions that you refuse to answer? It should be simple to answer, it was for me.

 

[PsyOps]

I've read plenty of your writings but its not my "homework" to go chase down your answers only so you can claim that's not what you meant.

What is so hard about those questions that you refuse to answer? It should be simple to answer, it was for me.

It is your homework when you pop into the middle of a discussion and due to your lack of understanding of the discussion throw false allegations at folks.

It ‘s no more difficult for me to answer these questions AGAIN than it would have been for you to take a little time to go back and read rather than incessantly rant about my not answering to your whims…

My answers:

Q: Do you agree things are different today than when we were kids?
A: Yes.

Q: Are your kids safer than when you a kid?
A: No.

Q: Are things better or worse around your old neighborhood than it was 30 years ago?
A: Much worse.

Q: Do you believe people are becoming more dependent today than before? Is it immoral to be so dependent on things like the government, as this country is increasingly becoming?
A: Yes and Yes.

Q: Do you believe people are becoming more lazy?
A: Yes.

Q: Do you believe Obamacare is immoral?
A: Yes.

Q: Do you believe the efforts for gun control are immoral?
A: Yes.

Most importantly... did you watch the video?

 

[Midnightrider]

It is your homework when you pop into the middle of a discussion and due to your lack of understanding of the discussion throw false allegations at folks.

It ‘s no more difficult for me to answer these questions AGAIN than it would have been for you to take a little time to go back and read rather than incessantly rant about my not answering to your whims…

My answers:

Q: Do you agree things are different today than when we were kids?
A: Yes.

Q: Are your kids safer than when you a kid?
A: No.

Q: Are things better or worse around your old neighborhood than it was 30 years ago?
A: Much worse.

Q: Do you believe people are becoming more dependent today than before? Is it immoral to be so dependent on things like the government, as this country is increasingly becoming?
A: Yes and Yes.

Q: Do you believe people are becoming more lazy?
A: Yes.

Q: Do you believe Obamacare is immoral?
A: Yes.

Q: Do you believe the efforts for gun control are immoral?
A: Yes.

Most importantly... did you watch the video?

We were talking about gays and marriage and you know those arent the questions i was talking about


how about these?

Please try to think broader in scope (not cleavage… ideas). I'm not hung up on the gay marriage thing. I have always tried to keep these discussions in the context of where they lead. Where are we going with all of this. How far are YOU willing to go. Again, where is that line in the sand for you? I know you have to have one? You're okay if a gay person comes into your kid's school and tried to educate them on tolerance towards gays. What about a transvestite? What about a cross dresser?

 

[PsyOps]

We were talking about gays and marriage and you know those arent the questions i was talking about

Your original reply to me was back at post 106, to my questions you quoted. So, yes I thought those were the questions you were talking about.

The OP is about polygamy and how, when we accept one of these social ‘choices’ as okay, the next group will be stepping up to demand their rights be recognized. I have expounded on those thought and tried to frame things in a way that shows how the changes going on in our society are all interrelated. I’m not just stuck on the gay marriage issue. I’m looking at things in their totality.

how about these?

Please try to think broader in scope (not cleavage… ideas). I'm not hung up on the gay marriage thing. I have always tried to keep these discussions in the context of where they lead. Where are we going with all of this. How far are YOU willing to go. Again, where is that line in the sand for you? I know you have to have one? You're okay if a gay person comes into your kid's school and tried to educate them on tolerance towards gays. What about a transvestite? What about a cross dresser?

The line in the sand for me, as I have tried point out over and over, is you can do as you please. If you are gay, a polygamist, transvestite, a cross-dresser, what-have-you fine! Live your life. If you aren’t harming anyone, it’s not my business.

But, don’t feel you need to throw it in my face in some way as to demand I accept it. More importantly… leave it out of our schools. Stop trying to bring these things into our schools and trying to teach our kids to accept things that I, as a parent, may not want some stranger teaching to my kids. Do not make laws that forbid them. And don’t make laws that separate certain crimes against a ‘special’ group as a hate crime. Stop demanding that I regard your group as special. If you want to be equal then play equal.

You read my post in the http://forums.somd.com/politics/267681-those-tolerant-repugs-action-3.html thread. That is what I am getting at. While we are removing all the things that have, for so long, been normal and good for building our kid’s character, self confidence, and ability to deal with a tough world, we are replacing them with things that have been considered immoral. The kids are the target, and as a parent I don’t like that and I don’t have to like it.

 

[Midnightrider]

Your original reply to me was back at post 106, to my questions you quoted. So, yes I thought those were the questions you were talking about.

The OP is about polygamy and how, when we accept one of these social ‘choices’ as okay, the next group will be stepping up to demand their rights be recognized. I have expounded on those thought and tried to frame things in a way that shows how the changes going on in our society are all interrelated. I’m not just stuck on the gay marriage issue. I’m looking at things in their totality.

other changes in society.

women can vote
blacks are free
blacks can vote
whites and blacks can marry

not all changes in our society have been bad, so this issue of gay marriage could easily be a "good" not a "bad" and could be interrelated to the good changes.

The line in the sand for me, as I have tried point out over and over, is you can do as you please. If you are gay, a polygamist, transvestite, a cross-dresser, what-have-you fine! Live your life. If you aren’t harming anyone, it’s not my business.

But, don’t feel you need to throw it in my face in some way as to demand I accept it. More importantly… leave it out of our schools. Stop trying to bring these things into our schools and trying to teach our kids to accept things that I, as a parent, may not want some stranger teaching to my kids. Do not make laws that forbid them. And don’t make laws that separate certain crimes against a ‘special’ group as a hate crime. Stop demanding that I regard your group as special. If you want to be equal then play equal.
You read my post in the http://forums.somd.com/politics/267681-those-tolerant-repugs-action-3.html thread. That is what I am getting at. While we are removing all the things that have, for so long, been normal and good for building our kid’s character, self confidence, and ability to deal with a tough world, we are replacing them with things that have been considered immoral. The kids are the target, and as a parent I don’t like that and I don’t have to like it.

many would argue that we are simply eliminating some of the bigotry. But in any case, your question was about having a GLBT come and talk to a school about tolerence. How is discussing tolerence a bad thing? was it a bad thing for blacks who fought for civil rights to speak at school about tolerence?

and people aren't equal if they dont have the same rights.

 

[Ray_]

many would argue that we are simply eliminating some of the bigotry. But in any case, your question was about having a GLBT come and talk to a school about tolerence. How is discussing tolerence a bad thing? was it a bad thing for blacks who fought for civil rights to speak at school about tolerence?

Interesting discussion. I think the answer to the above question is that one is a physical characteristic while the other is a behavior so I don't think it is a valid or fair comparison.

 

[PsyOps]

other changes in society.

women can vote
blacks are free
blacks can vote
whites and blacks can marry

not all changes in our society have been bad, so this issue of gay marriage could easily be a "good" not a "bad" and could be interrelated to the good changes.

I wont disagree with this at all. Let me put it a different way for you:

Dodgeball = good
Gay = good

Winning = good
There's nothing wrong with losing as long as you tried = good

Having 'God' mentioned in schools = good
Leave sex ed to the parents = good

Earning millions through hard work = good
We should give from our heart to those that are less fortunate = good

 

[PsyOps]

many would argue that we are simply eliminating some of the bigotry. But in any case, your question was about having a GLBT come and talk to a school about tolerence. How is discussing tolerence a bad thing? was it a bad thing for blacks who fought for civil rights to speak at school about tolerence?

and people aren't equal if they dont have the same rights.

You mean in the same this country is pushing gun control to eliminate crime? I'm certain we both feel the same about bigotry. But would you agree there is a difference between bigotry and believing something is immoral. I think ploygamy is morally wrong. But I don't hate them for it. And I definitely don't want someone coming to my kid's school trying to tell them it's okay. Leave that up to me, the parent. It doesn't belong in our schools.

And your attempt at moral equivalencies wont fly. There is a different between an entire race of people and an extreme minority of people that are living certain lifestyles.

 

[Midnightrider]

You mean in the same this country is pushing gun control to eliminate crime? I'm certain we both feel the same about bigotry. But would you agree there is a difference between bigotry and believing something is immoral. I think ploygamy is morally wrong. But I don't hate them for it. And I definitely don't want someone coming to my kid's school trying to tell them it's okay. Leave that up to me, the parent. It doesn't belong in our schools.

And your attempt at moral equivalencies wont fly. There is a different between an entire race of people and an extreme minority of people that are living certain lifestyles.

there isnt a difference to the people who were/are being oppressed.

Teaching tolerence is different than teaching right and wrong. If you thought it was "right" or they were just like you there would be no need to be tolerent.