Bare-ya-cuda
Well-Known Member
Please do your waiting in the middle of the closest train tracks or interstate near you.
Biden Is About to Commit an Impeachable Offense
- Thread starter GURPS
- Start date
Please do your waiting in the middle of the closest train tracks or interstate near you.
glhs837
Power with Control
This is what kills me. Why the hell are we allowing folks who will 99% never find a job making enough to pay it off borrow that sort of money in the first place.
It's two-fold. One is the college will admit anyone who has the money - I don't think most of them will refuse anyone if they have money. The other is that the government will promise a loan to anyone who wants or needs one. Period. If there was ANY kind of evaluation where either 1) the college determined whether or not you have the academic chops to complete your degree AND charge the courses accordingly - less for courses unlikely to advance a career in a well paying job and 2) the government actually decided whether or not you're worth the risk and made a similar evaluation.
But they don't. It is much easier politically and in actuality to just rubber stamp the process. IMAGINE if the government made the slightest effort to turn DOWN someone who is too risky to lend money to?
glhs837
Power with Control
Almost sounds like a mortgage crisis I remember a few year back, eh?
that would hurt the discussion racially ..... progressives have to push brown people into college
It's not all about race, although that DOES play heavily into any government program where some means of qualifying is expected.
SOME of it should be about the ability to pay back. Someone getting a degree in engineering or computer science, there's a good chance they'll be able to pay it back. A degree in say, sociology isn't likely to produce a return on investment, because such careers are notorious for low pay.
HERE'S a thought - aside from the fact that tuitions have increased at more than twice inflation for DECADES - how about courses costing different, rather than charge the same per credit hour regardless of its overall value? How about a little MORE restriction in admissions? You know, I do know any number of people who have graduate school debts - that never finished graduate school. They USED to be very restrictive.
How about more teacher's colleges? How about a revamping - utterly - of the curricula so we have graduates who have not wasted a fourth of their time in school learning stuff that has no relevance to their degree? For instance, why do we insist that an undergraduate degree consist of at least 120-130 credit hours - but as much as 30-35 credits of which have NOTHING whatsoever to do with the completion of the degree? Why do we insist on undergrads having this "broad" scope of education, which will profit them NOTHING while they pay back those tens of thousands of debt?
How about the most well-heeled elite colleges provide their undergrads FREE tuition while restricting admissions? Most of them CAN do it. Why not promote corporate donations to endowments?
But lastly - why does it have to cost SO damned much? It's averaging out to over 100k just to complete it. What makes it so expensive?
because the Gov is funding the tuition
how about an aptitude test Like the Military ASVAB ...... where do your skills lie
if you want 12 yrs or gender studies, you are on your own ...
you want a STEM Degree, do you have an aptitude for STEM - ok you might get a loan
if your skills test show something more hands on, maybe a loan for a trade school, no well then you are on your own.
Even Trade Schools do this .... I wanted to study auto repair, not take more classes in English
One of my nieces applied to an art school years ago - same thing. Curricula is all about art, and it was extensive. I was surprised - not even a random history or English class.
Now I admit - I did ENJOY taking classes about history and art and music - but I would not have bothered if I didn't need them to complete the degree.
glhs837
Power with Control
The why is simple. More classes equals more tuition.
See, and I think more pertinent curricula could be promoted instead. I sure could have used a lot more hands on design classes. Most of the REALLY interesting topics - lasers, microprocessor design and so forth - I didn't get until the last year. Ditto the math (which mostly I found extremely easy).
Now, THAT was Maryland. I went to an engineering school previously, and non-science, math and engineering classes - you only needed one per semester - most people called it their bullchit course, and ALL of them were taught in ONE building. Even that is a lot.
I do also think - college should be year round. I get the "tradition" of summers off for kids - but get real - there's no logic in applying it to college.
IDK how my bro arranged his classes for his degree, but I remember he took additional programming classes as electives. It took him many, many years to complete this degree. He felt he was wasting money on filler classes, so he filled them with more challenging courses.
I know that when it came to optional classes - within the degree - I did tend to prefer the math classes. After a while I noticed that another semester and I could get an additional degree in applied math. But I was just plain tired of college at that point.
PeoplesElbow
Well-Known Member
Working summer jobs to pay for the fall and spring?
I did attend a few summer sessions, it was a good way to get a hard class out of the way, but many taught over the summer are not engineering classes.
I did a graduate degree, another reason for the summers off is that is when a lot of the research work that funds the departments is done. When I was a masters student the first year and a half i did my classes during fall and spring and research over the summer, and then my last three semesters when I had already finished with classes.
Sneakers
Just sneakin' around....
I worked full time thru the summer, and weekends during classes.
Overall - there needs to be either an overhaul of how we use higher education in the hiring process or what is required to be proficient in an area.
I don't see why a four year degree is necessary to show someone can do a specific job. I got a degree in engineering. While the math was important - I didn't need most of it. I didn't need any of the chemistry required. Physics was important - but - honestly - didn't need four semesters of it. Not if I was planning a career in computer science or electrical engineering. Easily half of it fell into the mechanical engineering aspect.
I mean, ok, I get it. You don't know WHAT you will need. And that's ALWAYS true, but I have yet to hear of a colleague say they use ANY text they used in college except as a paperweight.
There simply MUST be a way to fast track someone into their chosen career without squandering four years and tens of thousands of dollars. Because honest to God - newly minted graduates often don't know much beyond what we teach them on the job.
I don't see why a four year degree is necessary to show someone can do a specific job. I got a degree in engineering. While the math was important - I didn't need most of it. I didn't need any of the chemistry required. Physics was important - but - honestly - didn't need four semesters of it. Not if I was planning a career in computer science or electrical engineering. Easily half of it fell into the mechanical engineering aspect.
I mean, ok, I get it. You don't know WHAT you will need. And that's ALWAYS true, but I have yet to hear of a colleague say they use ANY text they used in college except as a paperweight.
There simply MUST be a way to fast track someone into their chosen career without squandering four years and tens of thousands of dollars. Because honest to God - newly minted graduates often don't know much beyond what we teach them on the job.
WingsOfGold
Well-Known Member
Crazy coloreds!
THEREFORE BE IT RESOLVED, that the NAACP stands with Black borrowers across the country in support of a baseline cancellation of no less than $50,000 in federal student loan debt; and
BE IT FURTHER RESOLVED, that the NAACP supports the complete forgiveness of all federal student loans for public service and frontline/essential workers; and
BE IT FURTHER RESOLVED, that the NAACP supports the end to all interest on student loan repayments; and
BE IT FINALLY RESOLVED, that the members of the NAACP specifically call on the Biden Administration and Congress to immediately take action to ensure that borrowers are provided with student debt relief giving Black borrowers the opportunities to pursue homeownership, develop economy-boosting discretionary income, and equal opportunity towards upward mobility.
naacp.org
THEREFORE BE IT RESOLVED, that the NAACP stands with Black borrowers across the country in support of a baseline cancellation of no less than $50,000 in federal student loan debt; and
BE IT FURTHER RESOLVED, that the NAACP supports the complete forgiveness of all federal student loans for public service and frontline/essential workers; and
BE IT FURTHER RESOLVED, that the NAACP supports the end to all interest on student loan repayments; and
BE IT FINALLY RESOLVED, that the members of the NAACP specifically call on the Biden Administration and Congress to immediately take action to ensure that borrowers are provided with student debt relief giving Black borrowers the opportunities to pursue homeownership, develop economy-boosting discretionary income, and equal opportunity towards upward mobility.
Student Debt Cancellation $50,000 & Beyond
The members of the NAACP specifically call on the Biden Administration and Congress to immediately take action to ensure that borrowers are provided with student debt relief giving Black borrowers the opportunities to pursue homeownership, develop economy-boosting discretionary income, and equal...
OccamsRazor
Well-Known Member
Hmmm...