D.O.G.E

[glhs837]

Tesla paid back a loan. And yes, they did so early. Tesla is a liberal democrat idea. Battery operated cars with no real solution on how they can be powered unless liberal ideas of EV charging stations across the US can be assembled.

Elon Musk was granted numerous subsidies. I don't care if it was Tesla or SpaceX, give them back if you want to end them for everyone else. If you are in charge of recommendations to cut government funding, repay all of your subsidies. I don't really give a crap about what SpaceX has done. Musk has been put in charge of cutting government waste. The first thing he can do is cut any money going to his companies. He's a billionaire. He can survive on his own without government help. Put up or shut up.

Please bring facts. Tesla has built out the largest charging system not just in the US but the world. And most owners charge at home. But multi family housing and cities do need more charging. But that shouldn't be on Tesla.

By subsidies you mean the sorts of incentives any business might be offered by a locality or state to open up shop? Or a specific subsidy that only Tesla or SpaceX received. Please, tell me what they were. A tax break for a while, that sort of thing? Hard to debate generics like that.

What govt money is going to his companies? I assume you don't mean the NASA contracts that SpaceX has won through fair competition. If you mean the sort of technical collaboration that anyone that's contracted with NASA gets, that's not specific to SpaceX. RocketLab and others get the same help. That sort of assitance goes all the way back to when NASA was NACA.

So I say to you, put up or shut up. Lets talks specifics here or I cant bother to reply. Which subsidies and what govt dollars?

 

[SamSpade]

#1. Micromanaging type hate telework, they would rather someone accomplish less while they can direct their every action. When I need to get something done I take my computer and head home, Im in the office almost exclusively, but have to get away to get long complex tasks done.

My daily work doesn't change no matter where I work. At one time, my agency had telework "centers" where you can drive in - fairly close to DC - and plug in. My job entirely consists of logging in, working at my desk, and barring bathroom breaks and lunch - I don't move. If I need to contact a fellow employee, I have a whole set of tools where I can contact them right from my desk where we can share screens and walk through stuff - something you can't EVEN do in person.

When I was IN office before the pandemic - this was the same. I rarely saw another soul that I worked with, and when he retired - I hadn't seen my boss in person in easily ten years. Telework, not telework, NOTHING is any different.

#5. End of fiscal year money exists because that is the only way government has to track things, it became so complicated they decided to compartmentalize things, where they made it wasteful is when some bean counter sees that "last year you only spent $100k instead of the $200k allotted, this year you only need $100k" so departments buy all sorts of useless crap to spend it. Can't tell you how many smart boards still in boxes or on the wall that have never been used I've seen.

I hate this, but I've been part of this for exactly the reasons you mentioned - if you don't waste the rest of your budget, they will CUT it the next year - when you actually NEED it. I've had higher ups come around and ask us if there's anything (wink wink) that we *need*.

IF - the persons who determine the budget - went a little further than rubber stamping things and actually examined legitimate expenses - this would never happen. It's just easier for the ones doing the approving.

 

[glhs837]

My daily work doesn't change no matter where I work. At one time, my agency had telework "centers" where you can drive in - fairly close to DC - and plug in. My job entirely consists of logging in, working at my desk, and barring bathroom breaks and lunch - I don't move. If I need to contact a fellow employee, I have a whole set of tools where I can contact them right from my desk where we can share screens and walk through stuff - something you can't EVEN do in person.

When I was IN office before the pandemic - this was the same. I rarely saw another soul that I worked with, and when he retired - I hadn't seen my boss in person in easily ten years. Telework, not telework, NOTHING is any different.



I hate this, but I've been part of this for exactly the reasons you mentioned - if you don't waste the rest of your budget, they will CUT it the next year - when you actually NEED it. I've had higher ups come around and ask us if there's anything (wink wink) that we *need*.

IF - the persons who determine the budget - went a little further than rubber stamping things and actually examined legitimate expenses - this would never happen. It's just easier for the ones doing the approving.

Used this a few years back to spend 500K on some things we for sure needed. But the downside is that since we just bought them outright, we had no money for sustaining these things. And now that bill is due and nobody wants to pay.

 

[LightRoasted]

For your consideration ...

Donald Trump is not a conservative. At best he is a populist.

He's more of a conservative than the majority of those in Washington. He is a nationalist, who always putting America first.

 

[22AcaciaAve]

Please bring facts. Tesla has built out the largest charging system not just in the US but the world. And most owners charge at home. But multi family housing and cities do need more charging. But that shouldn't be on Tesla.

By subsidies you mean the sorts of incentives any business might be offered by a locality or state to open up shop? Or a specific subsidy that only Tesla or SpaceX received. Please, tell me what they were. A tax break for a while, that sort of thing? Hard to debate generics like that.

What govt money is going to his companies? I assume you don't mean the NASA contracts that SpaceX has won through fair competition. If you mean the sort of technical collaboration that anyone that's contracted with NASA gets, that's not specific to SpaceX. RocketLab and others get the same help. That sort of assitance goes all the way back to when NASA was NACA.

So I say to you, put up or shut up. Lets talks specifics here or I cant bother to reply. Which subsidies and what govt dollars?

I'm not going to provide a list to you. You can go on google and find out if you wish to, but I doubt you really care. Musk got his, now he wants to shut the flow to others down.

His companies may not have survived their early start up days without federal funding. The interesting thing about Musk is how he has lobbied for STRONGER regulations against gas powered cars. He supported the EV mandate that would ban gas powered cars by 2035. I wonder why? Isn't this a Biden supported thing that republicans have fought against?

Musk got butt-hurt when Tesla was not invited to an EV political event in 2021. Now he suddenly was against the Biden initiatives that he supported well before that.

It's not so much what Musk got, he got what a lot of others did. Now he's made his money and he wants to shut it down for everyone else. Like I said, give back all of the subsidies you got and I will take you a lot more seriously. If he's just a business man I have no issue. He should take advantage of everything he can get. But if he is going to have an advisory position to government to clean up excess spending he should start with his own excess benefits.

 

[22AcaciaAve]

For your consideration ...





He's more of a conservative than the majority of those in Washington. He is a nationalist, who always putting America first.

Certainly is more conservative than anyone in the Democrat party which seems to be leaning more and more to the radical liberal side. I think that is why he won.

 

[vraiblonde]

Certainly is more conservative than anyone in the Democrat party which seems to be leaning more and more to the radical liberal side.

This is the understatement of the year and tells me all I need to know about where you're coming from.

I don't really understand why you're going after Elon Musk, except that you hate him because of his affiliation with Trump. There are legit government contracts that provide a valuable service more efficiently and cost-effective than the government could do it. And there is a piss ton of crap - payoffs, kickbacks, outright theft, etc. The crap is what's on the chopping block and it never occurred to me that anyone outside of the thieves stealing our money would object to that.

This is what I hate about humans - they're ****ing idiots. They whine bitch moan about something, then when someone tries to solve the problem they whine bitch moan about the solution. They don't want the problem solved, they just want to whine bitch moan. Because if the problem gets solved, then they have to find something new to whine bitch moan about.

 

[GURPS]

Ramaswamy shreds NYC $220M migrant hotel deal paying Pakistan 'to house illegals in our own country'​

Vivek Ramaswamy eviscerated a reported agreement that New York City would pay up to $220 million to a Pakistani-owned hotel in Manhattan to house illegal migrants.

"A taxpayer-funded hotel for illegal migrants is owned by the Pakistani government, which means NYC taxpayers are effectively paying a foreign government to house illegals in our own country. This is nuts," Ramaswamy wrote on X.

Ramaswamy, a former Republican presidential candidate, was tapped by President-elect Trump to co-lead the newly-established Department of Government Efficiency (DOGE) with Elon Musk. He responded to a post by former investment banker and author John LeFevre decrying the deal regarding the Roosevelt Hotel in Manhattan.

 

[vraiblonde]

Ramaswamy shreds NYC $220M migrant hotel deal paying Pakistan 'to house illegals in our own country'​

Vivek Ramaswamy eviscerated a reported agreement that New York City would pay up to $220 million to a Pakistani-owned hotel in Manhattan to house illegal migrants.

"A taxpayer-funded hotel for illegal migrants is owned by the Pakistani government, which means NYC taxpayers are effectively paying a foreign government to house illegals in our own country. This is nuts," Ramaswamy wrote on X.

Ramaswamy, a former Republican presidential candidate, was tapped by President-elect Trump to co-lead the newly-established Department of Government Efficiency (DOGE) with Elon Musk. He responded to a post by former investment banker and author John LeFevre decrying the deal regarding the Roosevelt Hotel in Manhattan.

And there is absolutely no doubt in my mind politician palms got greased hard to make that happen.

 

[glhs837]

I'm not going to provide a list to you. You can go on google and find out if you wish to, but I doubt you really care. Musk got his, now he wants to shut the flow to others down.

His companies may not have survived their early start up days without federal funding. The interesting thing about Musk is how he has lobbied for STRONGER regulations against gas powered cars. He supported the EV mandate that would ban gas powered cars by 2035. I wonder why? Isn't this a Biden supported thing that republicans have fought against?

Musk got butt-hurt when Tesla was not invited to an EV political event in 2021. Now he suddenly was against the Biden initiatives that he supported well before that.

It's not so much what Musk got, he got what a lot of others did. Now he's made his money and he wants to shut it down for everyone else. Like I said, give back all of the subsidies you got and I will take you a lot more seriously. If he's just a business man I have no issue. He should take advantage of everything he can get. But if he is going to have an advisory position to government to clean up excess spending he should start with his own excess benefits.

So, you got nothing. I bring facts to support my contention, you bring nothing. I do care enough to provide facts. Which subsidy do you want him to give back that only his companies got from the Feds?

 

[GURPS]

 

[SamSpade]

View attachment 181568

Rumor is, she wants the Hegseth job and is lining up other Senators to oppose.

Without a real compelling case against Pete - because it looks a lot like a media shtshow bereft of substance - this is the worst kind of reaction from a Senator. I’d rather she just be a RINO.

 

[GURPS]

Rumor is, she wants the Hegseth job and is lining up other Senators to oppose.

Stupid Bint

THAT AIN'T HAPPENING

 

[stgislander]

Rumor is, she wants the Hegseth job and is lining up other Senators to oppose.

Wouldn't surprise me if she gets A LOT of donations from defense contractors.

 

[glhs837]

I'm not going to provide a list to you. You can go on google and find out if you wish to, but I doubt you really care. Musk got his, now he wants to shut the flow to others down.

His companies may not have survived their early start up days without federal funding. The interesting thing about Musk is how he has lobbied for STRONGER regulations against gas powered cars. He supported the EV mandate that would ban gas powered cars by 2035. I wonder why? Isn't this a Biden supported thing that republicans have fought against?

Like I said, give back all of the subsidies you got and I will take you a lot more seriously.

Well, regarding SpaceX, someone's done the work for us. So, SpaceX got nothing but contracts for work, work they performed. And below you see all the benefits we the taxpayers have received in return. Lots of other space startups folded and we got nothing back. Same for EV makers, billions upon billions spent and they take the money and run.

NASA money indeed saved SpaceX from bankruptcy in 2008, although claims that they bet on a company without any experience are baseless. By the time the $278M COTS program contract was awarded, SpaceX had already had a failed Falcon 1 launch, and by the time the $1.6B CRS program contract was awarded, they had already successfully launched a payload into orbit. Still, they've received a lot of contracts over the years, which leads us to the question:

How much did SpaceX get from the government and is this investment worth it?

From 2006 through 2023, SpaceX received $13.7B nominally and $15.9B inflation-adjusted for 2023. That's pretty close to the $13.8-15.9B that NASA and DoD have saved thanks to them. If we add to this the taxes on the $6B per year contribution to the US economy that SpaceX returned and attracted from abroad or created from scratch, they've most likely already paid back every last dime they got from the government.

Section titles. please feel free to link through and see the well researched article complete with linked original sources for all assertions.

NASA: at least $5.8-7.9B of savings​

Department of Defense (DoD): $8B of savings​

Commercial launches: $3.2-4.7B of savings
​

 

[Hijinx]

Rumor is, she wants the Hegseth job and is lining up other Senators to oppose.

Without a real compelling case against Pete - because it looks a lot like a media shtshow bereft of substance - this is the worst kind of reaction from a Senator. I’d rather she just be a RINO.

If this Senator Whatsername thinks she can screw over Hegseth and have Trump name her instead, I believe she is on some serious drugs.

 

[GURPS]

Speaking of issues electrifying the nation, yesterday Fortune ran a followup story headlined, “Elon Musk is planning a rude awakening for 94% of federal workers by monitoring their every move.” Hopefully. Creaky corporate media reporters are suddenly re-discovering their duty to criticize the government — for criticizing the government. (We won’t let them get away with it, but that is a side issue.) Fortune found outrage even though Musk is only an advisor to a future government. Whatever, Fortune.



The headline —Billionaire takes over government!— was incredibly deceptive. The story barely involved Musk, who’d only tweeted about the story. The news was Senator Joni Ernst (R-Iowa) did two things this week. First, she released a 60-page report on how few government workers even show up to work these days. It’s a hoot, written tongue-in-cheek, and it’s astonishing how badly managed the federal government is.

Read Joni’s report, at least the executive summary. Here are its first few paragraphs:



Secondly, not accidentally timed with her report, Senator Ernst sponsored a bill titled the REMOTE Act, which among other things would allow mild monitoring software to be installed on federal workers’ computers, and would require agencies to “assess” the “impact” of remote work. In other words, meh.

But Fortune breathlessly labeled Ernst’s bill DOGE-related.

That’s it! The story does not claim that Musk was involved, with either the report or the bill. Fortune didn’t even claim Musk had ever spoken with Senator Ernst. The space billionaire tweeted about Ernst’s report, and Ernst tweeted that she looked forward to working with him. Yet Fortune placed Musk into the headline’s first two words. And then used him as a prompt for a bunch of Marxist, anti-billionaire fearmongering included in the article.

In a very cowardly fashion, Fortune turned off the article’s comments section. Mark my words, this story is red-pilling even more Democrats.

☕️ TAKING CHANCES ☙ Saturday, December 7, 2024 ☙ C&C NEWS 🦠

A trifecta of game-changing stories: Daniel Penny's astonishing trial twist; damning 60-page non-attendance report tanks deep-state workforce; new detrans lawsuit targets top trans doctor; and more.

www.coffeeandcovid.com

 

[22AcaciaAve]

So, you got nothing. I bring facts to support my contention, you bring nothing. I do care enough to provide facts. Which subsidy do you want him to give back that only his companies got from the Feds?

What facts are you bringing? From a reddit group id called PerAsperaAdMars? No sorry, not buying that. Reddit has more lies than this place. You are better than that.

If Elon Musk wants to continue with SpaceX, more power to him. But don't take an advisory position with the government where he can influence the control of money to possible opponents.

It is obvious we will continue to disagree about Uncle Elon. I have no desire to continue the fight. I respect your opinion, and I also strongly disagree.

 

[glhs837]

What facts are you bringing? From a reddit group id called PerAsperaAdMars? No sorry, not buying that. Reddit has more lies than this place. You are better than that.

If Elon Musk wants to continue with SpaceX, more power to him. But don't take an advisory position with the government where he can influence the control of money to possible opponents.

It is obvious we will continue to disagree about Uncle Elon. I have no desire to continue the fight. I respect your opinion, and I also strongly disagree.

So you ignore the fact that the post has links to prove every point made? You are right, you can say anything on Reddit. But if you back your assertions with verifiable facts, that lends credence. Every bit of blue text is a link to the source for all claims made.

Of course every source he links could all be part of a huge conspiracy. In which case there is indeed no point discussing things.

Are there assertions in that article that you feel are false and not proven?

Let me be clear, I agree that in this role, he should not be influencing what actions are taken. But at the same time, he is entitled to an opinion, isn't he?

 

[Clem72]

Secondly, not accidentally timed with her report, Senator Ernst sponsored a bill titled the REMOTE Act, which among other things would allow mild monitoring software to be installed on federal workers’ computers, and would require agencies to “assess” the “impact” of remote work. In other words, meh.

They already had several forms of monitoring before I retired. Normal rank and file didn't have admin access so they couldn't install software themselves, the network was locked down, and even accidentally plugging in a USB drive could lock your computer up as a security violation.

If they are talking about software that monitors how "active" you are, that's problematic as there are lots of people that only need to use their computer for a portion of their work. Like if someone spent 2 hours writing e-mails and reading documentation, and 6 hours in the vault reviewing flight data is that worse than someone who spent 3 hours farting around designing the perfect PowerPoint to advertise their chick-fil-a fundraiser and then spent 5 hours wandering around gossiping with their friends?

I have to assume there are lots of smaller federal agencies that aren't complying with the former type of monitoring, and it's no big deal to require them to implement it. The latter will be a nightmare.