Do you trust the police?

Do you trust the police

  • No

    Votes: 15 30.6%
  • Yes

    Votes: 34 69.4%

  • Total voters
    49

Larry Gude

Strung Out
What is the alternative?
As an American truth should ALWAYS be spoken to power whether it is Barack Obama, Nancy Pelosi, John Boehner or the local cop. ALWAYS. This is a land of, by and for the people. The ONLY way our government will act as OUR government is if we insist. Constantly.

Best we not ever just give up on that.
 

PsyOps

Pixelated
I have distrust in government in general. Are cops an extension of this or are they just enforcers of the laws our governments pass? Are they bad people running around looking for someone to harass? I think cops get it right over 99% of the time. But they are forced to enforce bad laws. I also think our government has imbedded into our LE psyche a mentality of militarization; that they are sent out onto a battlefield and more fighting an enemy than protecting the people they are charged to serve. This causes them view all of us as potentially enemies. A systemic problem that I blame on our leaders in government than I do on our law enforcement.
 

Chris0nllyn

Well-Known Member
What is the alternative?
Don't take that as me saying we should have no police force. I understand the need for police, but when we have Miranda rights that explicitly say "anything you say can, and will, be used against you", and no mention of using anything for you, IMO, there's a problem.

Why should you trust someone, anyone, you...
a). Do not know personally.
b). Has the power to use anything you say against you.
c). Let's be honest, 99% of the time, they are not here to be your friend. They are there to do a job. A job where it seems they increasingly taught that it's "us against them".
 

inkah

Active Member
I absolutely do not trust the police (except the one that belongs to me, of course :)

too easy to abuse absolute power and the blue circle (or whatever) that doesn't hold folks accountable for abuse of that power

also, it seems around here at least, they aren't very well educated on the law and enforcement seems to be intermittent and "at will" - possibly depending on relations and who they went to school with?

even good people are jackasses sometimes and I am trying hard to appreciate them better...

but bloody hell, please someone tell them to stop enabling the local addicts!!!
 

mAlice

professional daydreamer
You're confusing hate with distrust. I don't hate cops. There are a lot of good cops, and a lot of bad cops. When you need one, it's luck of the draw whether you will get a good one or a bad one.
It is not unheard of for cops to arrest/victimize the victim of a crime, because they're in such a big hurry to be billy bad ass and make an arrest, they don't care who they arrest.

I recently made a call to the police regarding something potentially serious, and was blown off. When I couldn't get any advice from the local police, I called the FBI. Fortunately, I didn't have a number with me that would provide me with anything other than VM (after hours). A good number was on my desk (now in my phone). Long story short, I finally got some usable information in the threatening VM's I was getting, and was able to determine that it wasn't the threat that I thought it was (due to a mental illness).

So, please don't confuse hate with distrust. I think most of us believe that most cops do a bang up job. No pun intended.
 

glhs837

Power with Control
See, that's part of the issue. Saying that because I don't automatically defend or even agree all officers no matter what, I therefore hate all officers. BS.
 

MMM_donuts

New Member
I agree. I certainly don't hate cops and I know a few that I think the world of but I don't trust that group as a whole. I know some really bad ones, too.

I appreciate what they do. I appreciate the environment that they put them in and I often get to see it firsthand so it's not like I'm just armchair quarterbacking.

They are community leaders and their behavior should be held to a higher standard. They should have much tougher criteria, more education, and a dramatic increase in pay and benefits.
 

GregV814

Well-Known Member
Asset forfeiture laws mean any police department is one bad budget away from legalized theft.
Not to prove you are factually wrong or an idiot, you DO realize that the Police Department is merely an enforcer of the law and rule of law legislated by the local/city/municipal government and none of the money goes to the police in asset forfeitures right??? Its earmarked for the general fund to pay for welfare cheats/POS crackhead baby momma's and schools.

What happened? Did your M-190 with tinted windows get seized again because you had several ounces of cocaine in the console you "were holding for a friend" ?...
 

Chris0nllyn

Well-Known Member
Not to prove you are factually wrong or an idiot, you DO realize that the Police Department is merely an enforcer of the law and rule of law legislated by the local/city/municipal government and none of the money goes to the police in asset forfeitures right??? Its earmarked for the general fund to pay for welfare cheats/POS crackhead baby momma's and schools.

What happened? Did your M-190 with tinted windows get seized again because you had several ounces of cocaine in the console you "were holding for a friend" ?...
http://www.washingtonpost.com/sf/investigative/collection/stop-and-seize-2/
 

glhs837

Power with Control
Here's part of the problem. SO, this case has been mentioned, if you have not seen the video, please do so before commenting. Cliff notes, 12 year old had an airsoft with the orange cap removed from the barrel. Was in a park, guy calls 911, as far as I know, we still do not know if the phrase "I'm pretty sure it's a toy gun" was reported to the responding officers. But keep in mind, no shots have been fired, nobody has been injured in any way. Investigation appeared to consist of pulling up 2 feet away from the kid, hopping out, saying something to him and shooting him dead.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/11/24/tamir-rice-boy-shot-cleveland-police_n_6211064.html



http://www.foxnews.com/us/2014/11/23/12-year-old-boy-brandishing-fake-gun-at-rec-center-dies-after-being-shot-by/

For reference above. What prompted this post was the first link, the interview with the police union rep defending the officers.



" Eventually, Follmer dismissed Melber's questions about excessive force and wrapped up the debate with a message to Americans.

"How about this: Listen to police officers' commands. Listen to what we tell you, and just stop," he said. "I think that eliminates a lot of problems."

"I think the nation needs to realize that when we tell you to do something, do it," he added.
 

GregV814

Well-Known Member


Chris, Chris, Chris...


Those are nice pictures of Police Officers. And from your beacon of truth the Washington Post too.........But having served in the Police Community for my adult life I can reliably state that the funds from asset forfeitures go to the general fund and not to line the pockets of the officers. You see, when the property is seized, the State ( lawyers and a Judge) have to agree that the product was seized in the accordance of laws. Then, the former owner of the property is given a fair opportunity to recapture it. Now, if it was seized improperly, he/she will get it back unless it was contraband to begin with.....Usually the asset forfeitures are the ill gotten derivitavies of a criminal enterprize you know....so, keep posting pictures of policemen if that floats you boat and keep reading the "WaPo"...enjoy!!!
 

Chris0nllyn

Well-Known Member
Chris, Chris, Chris...


Those are nice pictures of Police Officers. And from your beacon of truth the Washington Post too.........But having served in the Police Community for my adult life I can reliably state that the funds from asset forfeitures go to the general fund and not to line the pockets of the officers. You see, when the property is seized, the State ( lawyers and a Judge) have to agree that the product was seized in the accordance of laws. Then, the former owner of the property is given a fair opportunity to recapture it. Now, if it was seized improperly, he/she will get it back unless it was contraband to begin with.....Usually the asset forfeitures are the ill gotten derivitavies of a criminal enterprize you know....so, keep posting pictures of policemen if that floats you boat and keep reading the "WaPo"...enjoy!!!
False.

Portions of the money go to the department (not the individual officer, but I'm not sure who ever claimed that).

You believe it's "fair" to steal someone's property, and force THEM to prove they got it legitimately? Even when someone does prove it, they don't necessarily get it all back (not accounting for lawyer fees).

You obviously didn't read the series, because that "usually...criminal enterprise" isn't true either.

Not sure what problem you have with The Washington Post, but it's not exactly some new phenomenon that just picked up and decided to wright a piece on.

http://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2013/08/12/taken
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/drugs/special/forfeiture.html
http://reason.com/blog/2014/12/18/philadelphia-drops-two-asset-forfeiture
http://www.heritage.org/research/reports/2014/03/civil-asset-forfeiture-7-things-you-should-know
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/bob-barr/asset-forfeiture-reform-r_b_6333770.html
http://www.ij.org/images/pdf_folder/other_pubs/assetforfeituretoemail.pdf

 
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GregV814

Well-Known Member
you did mean "write" didnt you???

well, Golly wow!!! I hope the ghestapo thugs dont seize my set of end wrenches!!!!!

Maybe I'll call 7 on your side and the Baltimore Sun!!!
 

glhs837

Power with Control
you did mean "write" didnt you???

well, Golly wow!!! I hope the ghestapo thugs dont seize my set of end wrenches!!!!!

Maybe I'll call 7 on your side and the Baltimore Sun!!!



So, what I'm hearing is that you have no argument, so went right to snark and insult. Always told my kids that when in the course of debate, the other person insults you or says "eff you", that means they ran out of points to make. And here's thing about the ol' "Well, it goes into the general fund, so there's no reason to play fast and loose", and one reason you usually see shenanigans on a smaller level. Take a place like Baltimore, it's budget, both city and LE, are so huge that such number don't mean squat. But on a smaller level, taking 10-30K, that goes into the general fund. And that means there is more available in the overall budget for the LE department.
 

GregV814

Well-Known Member
Do you really think the Police Department, at the direction of the State's Attorney, Mayor or Solicitor General will barge into your home and seize you property without cause and an affidavit or search warrant?????? Do you really think an honest Joe will lose his/her possessions without having done anything wrong???

Please dont rely on mass media to form an ironclad thought about this topic. Ask any States Attorney about the mechanism to seize anyones property.
 

glhs837

Power with Control
Did I say that? Do I think the majority of seizure's are straight up and legit? Sure I do. Do I therefore assume that ALL of them are? Of course not, there are too many recorded incidents of BS seizure's that are NOT legit. You remind me of the people who assume that if you question any officer anywhere about anything, you are a cop hater who thinks all police are evil. There's this thing, it's called judgment, it's pretty neat. It allows you to look at individual instances of a thing and form an opinion not based on other similar things.

I personally think well over 95% of officers are straight up. I also think the system works a bit too hard to serve and protect the bad ones. Does that mean I think all cops are bad? Of course not. But I know damn well they are not all angels.
 

Chris0nllyn

Well-Known Member
Do you really think the Police Department, at the direction of the State's Attorney, Mayor or Solicitor General will barge into your home and seize you property without cause and an affidavit or search warrant?????? Do you really think an honest Joe will lose his/her possessions without having done anything wrong???

Please dont rely on mass media to form an ironclad thought about this topic. Ask any States Attorney about the mechanism to seize anyones property.
:lol: Splitting hairs much?

Who has said any of that?

And yes, there are completely innocent people that get their property stolen without doing anything wrong.
 

Merlin99

Visualize whirled peas
PREMO Member
Do you really think the Police Department, at the direction of the State's Attorney, Mayor or Solicitor General will barge into your home and seize you property without cause and an affidavit or search warrant?????? Do you really think an honest Joe will lose his/her possessions without having done anything wrong???

Please dont rely on mass media to form an ironclad thought about this topic. Ask any States Attorney about the mechanism to seize anyones property.
Yes
 
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