Drinking age?

[BuddyLee]

Oh yeah.. Lower it to 18
They're gonna drink no matter what the age requirement is anyhow & at least this way they can be honest w/ ya vs sneaking around like creatures of the night..

Then they can sneak around at 15 and 16.

 

[BuddyLee]

Youth who drink alcohol are 50 times more likely to use cocaine than those who never drink alcohol.

Woo hoo!

Traffic crashes are the greatest single cause of death for persons aged 6–33. About 45% of these fatalities are in alcohol-related crashes.

Nice.

Underage drinking costs the United States more than $58 billion every year — enough to buy every public school student a state-of-the-art computer.

Can I have a new computer?

Alcohol kills 6½ times more youth than all other illicit drugs combined.

Eh...forget about the cocaine fact.

Alcohol - Facts, Statistics, Resources, and Impairment Charts

 

[BuddyLee]

Since 1982, alcohol-related traffic fatalities on our nation's roadways have decreased 33% and among youth under 21 these fatalities have decreased nearly 60%.

:shocker:

The National Minimum Drinking Age Act was passed in 1984 by the way.

 

[BuddyLee]

High school seniors who could not legally drink until age 21 drank less before age 21 and between ages 21 - 25 than did seniors in states with lower drinking ages.(5,6) Similarly, a national survey of 16 - 21 year-olds found that teens from states with a higher MLPA drank less frequently.(7)

The 1978 National Study of Adolescent Drinking Behavior found that 10th - 12th graders in states with lower drinking ages drank significantly more, were less likely to abstain from alcohol, and were drunk more often than students in states with a drinking age of 21.(8)

A study of New York college students documented that students who began drinking at younger ages were more likely to drink heavily in college. They were also more likely to report alcohol-related problems such as trouble at work, with friends, family, and police.(9)

The behavior of 18 year-olds is particularly influential on youth ages 15 - 17, as young people typically imitate the practices of those who are slightly older, rather than the practices of those who are significantly older.(10) Therefore, if 18 year-olds can legally drink, their immediate, younger peers will drink too.

A good point.

CSPI: Fact Sheet -- Age-21 -- Facts

 

[BuddyLee]

State motor vehicle fatality data from the 48 continental states found that lowering the MLPA for beer from 21 to 18 during the 1970s resulted in an 11% increase in fatalities among this age group.<SMALL>(11)</SMALL>

An Arizona Department of Public Safety report found that fatal accidents increased over 25% while traffic fatalities increased more than 35% after the state MLPA was lowered from 21 to 19.<SMALL>(12)</SMALL>

A Michigan study found that police reports of “had been drinking” crashes increased 35%, while the incidence of nighttime single-vehicle crashes among young men increased 17% after the state reduced its MLPA from 21 to 18.<SMALL>(13)</SMALL> Another Michigan study found that DWI arrests increased 141% for 18 - 20 year-olds after the state lowered the MLPA. Roadside surveys showed that the proportion of 16 - 20 year-old drivers with blood alcohol concentrations (BAC) over .05 more than doubled.<SMALL>(14)</SMALL>

CSPI: Fact Sheet -- Age-21 -- Facts

I could go all night folks.

 

[BuddyLee]

Between 1979 and 1984, the suicide rate was 9.7% greater among adolescents and young adults who could legally consume alcohol than among their peers who could not.<SMALL>(19)</SMALL>

In raising the MLPA from 18 to 21, states observed an average 16% decrease in the rate of vandalism arrests, compared to an average 1.7% increase in states with a constant MLPA of 18.<SMALL>(21)</SMALL>

In Australia, lowering the drinking age was associated with an increase of 20% to 25% in cases of male delinquency.<SMALL>(22)</SMALL>

 

[Larry Gude]

It's not...

Here's my question, why is it important to drink at 18? Is this a guy thing? Because it makes you an adult? No it doesn't and it doesn't make you a man or woman either. I didn't suffer because I couldn't drink at 18. I think they raised it about a year before my 18th birthday but I wasn't much of a drinker anyway. So what is the big deal?

...important to drink. It is a poison to ones body. It makes you act like an idiot. It contributes to more death and mayhem. And it's fun.

From the beginning, this is college presidents looking at the reality of having a student population of 18-22 year olds, 25% of which can drink, 75% which aren't supposed to be and about 99% that are.

They have to expend their resources to babysit kids who are supposed to be learning and growing up and expanding their horizons.

Add to that the hypocrisy of voting and military age.

One thing studies showing increases in problems from lowering drinking ages leave out is what were those problem rates in the 50's and 60's and 70'? This is a responsibility issue, not an age issue. If you expect an 18 year to act like an adult they will do so, far more than if they are not expected to. If you expect them to act like a child, they will do so, far more than if they are not expected to.

So, it's really simple; do we want us, we the people, to be adults at 18 or not? I say yes.

 

[Larry Gude]

Bl...

Not if everyone agree's with it.

Perhaps you need another poll.

...that's why we have a constitution; because rights are not a matter of mob rule. They are inalienable and not subject to the whims of the day.

You think about that and then see if the argument isn't accurate. Not everyone thought women should be voting, at any age. Not everyone thought blacks were citizens.

 

[Queenofdenile1]

...important to drink. It is a poison to ones body. It makes you act like an idiot. It contributes to more death and mayhem. And it's fun.

From the beginning, this is college presidents looking at the reality of having a student population of 18-22 year olds, 25% of which can drink, 75% which aren't supposed to be and about 99% that are.

They have to expend their resources to babysit kids who are supposed to be learning and growing up and expanding their horizons.

Add to that the hypocrisy of voting and military age.

One thing studies showing increases in problems from lowering drinking ages leave out is what were those problem rates in the 50's and 60's and 70'? This is a responsibility issue, not an age issue. If you expect an 18 year to act like an adult they will do so, far more than if they are not expected to. If you expect them to act like a child, they will do so, far more than if they are not expected to.

So, it's really simple; do we want us, we the people, to be adults at 18 or not? I say yes.

I don't agree. It isn't that simple in today's society. It just doesn't work that way. It's not about statistics, it's about what actually is taking place. Kids can be influenced. You can't honestly expect to have every 18 year old act like an adult. It's a gamble. Depending on the child, how the child was raised, what values it carries, as to how that child will turn out at 18. Some may turn out to be worthless bums. Some may turn out to be pretty good kids. Some may turn out to be crooks and "I don't give a crap about squat" kids. I don't think an 18 year old is an adult. Okay, I'll rephrase, I think physically, an 18 year old is an adult, but mentally they should know the difference between and wrong but which road they take is a flip of the coin. I still say, I'd rather see the drinking age stay at 21. If I had to choose, I'd say 21 as an adult. So if it means raising the voting age and joining the military...then 21. It gives them more time to experience life a little bit more. Even if they are in college, doesn't make them an adult. Just because they can do laundry, cook and clean, doesn't make them an adult. There are 10 year olds that can do that and they are not an adult and some of them are more adult than some 18 years olds.

I think raising the driving age would be beneficial, but that is another thread.

 

[Larry Gude]

I don't...

I don't agree. It isn't that simple in today's society. It just doesn't work that way. It's not about statistics, it's about what actually is taking place. Kids can be influenced. You can't honestly expect to have every 18 year old act like an adult. It's a gamble. Depending on the child, how the child was raised, what values it carries, as to how that child will turn out at 18. Some may turn out to be worthless bums. Some may turn out to be pretty good kids. Some may turn out to be crooks and "I don't give a crap about squat" kids. I don't think an 18 year old is an adult. Okay, I'll rephrase, I think physically, an 18 year old is an adult, but mentally they should know the difference between and wrong but which road they take is a flip of the coin. I still say, I'd rather see the drinking age stay at 21. If I had to choose, I'd say 21 as an adult. So if it means raising the voting age and joining the military...then 21. It gives them more time to experience life a little bit more. Even if they are in college, doesn't make them an adult. Just because they can do laundry, cook and clean, doesn't make them an adult. There are 10 year olds that can do that and they are not an adult and some of them are more adult than some 18 years olds.

I think raising the driving age would be beneficial, but that is another thread.

...expect them to, at all. I do expect them to be exposed to life and learn from it and grow from it. I am not a 'learn it from a book' person when it comes to things like this; driving, drinking, etc.

You're argument is that a 21 year old is more mature and going to make better decisions than an 18 year old. Well, I can't argue with that, but that is an apples and oranges comparison.

Try these;

Who is more responsible at 21, a kid who has been drinking, or legal to do so, since they were 18, or a 21 year old who has never had a sip? I'll take A.

Who is a better driver, an 18 year old who has been driving for two years or an 18 year old who just got their permit? I'll take A.

Now, I do applaud you that you are consistent and would rather raise the voting age and the military age rather than lowering the drinking age.

I, for damn sure, don't think anyone under 30 should have the right to vote, so, I'd actually go for that, 21 to vote.

 

[BuddyLee]

...that's why we have a constitution; because rights are not a matter of mob rule. They are inalienable and not subject to the whims of the day.

You think about that and then see if the argument isn't accurate. Not everyone thought women should be voting, at any age. Not everyone thought blacks were citizens.

Well Larry, I'd be fine with that argument if the Constitution actually stated as much.

I don't see anywhere in the Constitution that states an 18 year old has the right to drink a beer.

 

[BuddyLee]

Who is more responsible at 21, a kid who has been drinking, or legal to do so, since they were 18, or a 21 year old who has never had a sip? I'll take A.

I'll take B. 'A' only works if you're someone like me.

There are more kids that can be influenced by other kids than there are parents who can influence their kids, at least in today's world.

 

[Larry Gude]

I'm sorry...

I'll take B. 'A' only works if you're someone like me.

There are more kids that can be influenced by other kids than there are parents who can influence their kids, at least in today's world.

...you're vote no longer counts. We've decided that it's in your best interest to wait until age 30, much better than 21, before placing such weighty responsibilities on your shoulders.

 

[jaybeeztoo]

...you're vote no longer counts. We've decided that it's in your best interest to wait until age 30, much better than 21, before placing such weighty responsibilities on your shoulders.

 

[toppick08]

I need a beer...

 

[Larry Gude]

Now...

I need a beer...

...that you mention it, my flower day is done. Now, I gotta run, or jog, or slog, as my case may be. Then it's off to the pool and MANY BEERS!!!

 

[BuddyLee]

...you're vote no longer counts. We've decided that it's in your best interest to wait until age 30, much better than 21, before placing such weighty responsibilities on your shoulders.

I don't see votes killing anybody.

Unless you believe in Puff Daddy. Vote or die!

 

[BuddyLee]

...that you mention it, my flower day is done. Now, I gotta run, or jog, or slog, as my case may be. Then it's off to the pool and MANY BEERS!!!

No drunk swimming over .08!

 

[Queenofdenile1]

...expect them to, at all. I do expect them to be exposed to life and learn from it and grow from it. I am not a 'learn it from a book' person when it comes to things like this; driving, drinking, etc.

You're argument is that a 21 year old is more mature and going to make better decisions than an 18 year old. Well, I can't argue with that, but that is an apples and oranges comparison.

Try these;

Who is more responsible at 21, a kid who has been drinking, or legal to do so, since they were 18, or a 21 year old who has never had a sip? I'll take A.

Who is a better driver, an 18 year old who has been driving for two years or an 18 year old who just got their permit? I'll take A.

Now, I do applaud you that you are consistent and would rather raise the voting age and the military age rather than lowering the drinking age.

I, for damn sure, don't think anyone under 30 should have the right to vote, so, I'd actually go for that, 21 to vote.

Question 1...I can see your point, but I would hope that at the age of 21, from a mental perspective that a child would be more cautious, make better decisions, which is why I pick 21. If they have been drinking for three years, yes they may have more experience with alcohol but you have a three year gap. I don't know if I'd want to take the risk in having my teen child learn from their mistakes that could potentially put them in jail, or worse.

Question 2... Again, it goes back to maturity and I would hope that in two years they would make better decisions in the driving. It would give me two more years to pound in their head the laws of driving. Lerners permit would be okay for two years w/a parent only in the car with them.

As for the Military, I think 18 is young. I think 21 is better. Voting..., I don't even wanna vote!!!