Huntng with the AR15?

[Bonehead]

The 762X39 has similar ballistics to a 30-30 which has kiled a lot of deer but in my opinion it is the minimum. I would not try to kill a white tail with a .223 it just does not (with ball ammo) have enough energy to HUMANELY kill a 200 lb animal.....at least one with 4 legs and a head shot. Yeah a .17 will kill a deer too with a head shot. Yes a 50 caliber ball moving at lot slower will effectively kill a white tail it is all a matter of energy transfer a .223 punches a nice neat hole through unless it contacts bone.

 

[Novus Collectus]

Talking about four legs on the target not two. The .223 is designed (with ball ammo) to wound the .308 or 7.62X54 however are not.

No, military ammo is not designed to just wound, but it often does as a side result. You cannot hunt with military bullets (ball ammo) anyway and you have to use hollow or soft points.

 

[Novus Collectus]

The 762X39 has similar ballistics to a 30-30 which has kiled a lot of deer but in my opinion it is the minimum. I would not try to kill a white tail with a .223 it just does not (with ball ammo) have enough energy to HUMANELY kill a 200 lb animal.....at least one with 4 legs and a head shot. Yeah a .17 will kill a deer too with a head shot. Yes a 50 caliber ball moving at lot slower will effectively kill a white tail it is all a matter of energy transfer a .223 punches a nice neat hole through unless it contacts bone.

Once again, you cannot hunt deer with ball ammor. You must use hollow points or soft points and those do more than just punch a hole.

If you say the .223 with over 1,200 foot pounds of muzzle energy cannot be used humanely for deer at any hunting distance, then what do you think about using a 700 pound muzzle energy black powder rifle or using bow and arrows?
If the .223 can kill a human at 300 yards, then it can humanely kill a deer at 75 yards which I assume is within the usual deer hunting stand distances.

 

[Novus Collectus]

First off, what are you going to hunt with a .223? In most states it doesn't meet (I don't think) minimum caliber/ bullet size for hunting deer or medium, large game.

I don't think it is "most" states, just some.
Also, in MD you are allowed to hunt most of the game with rifles.

Are you going to go hunt rabbit with an M-16?

What part of "varmint rifle" do you not understand?

I kind of like the idea of a bolt action when hunting, just for the fact someone doesn't get "target drunk" and let loose their entire magazine spraying the woods downrange with 8 - 20 rounds. I can see someone with a semi auto rifle chasing a deer through the woods in his sights letting loose round after round while the deer jumps and scurrries by 100 yards away..

In MD you are not allowed to hunt deer with more than 8 rounds in the mag.
When hunting other game it cannot be more than three, so no "spraying the woods".
In MD it is illegal to hunt under the influence of alcohol.
In MD it is illegal to hunt with a full auto rifle, so no "spraying the woods".
Guess what, if someone is breaking these laws, then banning the use of semi autos wouldn't have stopped them either.It is not the lawful hunter using a semi auto that you have to worry about and the way you describe what you did is just like how the Brady Campaign would put it.

At least a bolt action slows down the hunt just a LITTLE bit, to give the hunter a chance to think about the next shot, where his gun is pointing, and to get a better view off of his sights as to his surroundings.. Not to say someone can't empty a magazine in a VERY short amount of time with a bolt action, I just think most hunters it would slow them down enough to get them to think about where the next round is going.

So hunters are made less responsible and careful by the semi autos. Hmm, I figured hunters learned to be responsible and don't let evil guns conduct mind control on them.
I always thought of hunters as responsible people since statistically hunting with firearms is one of the safest sports in America with fewer deaths and injuries.

In 2005 there were 808 hunting injuries with all kinds of hunting, including bow and airgun, with 95 of them resulting in death. Most of thsoe were with a shotgun, not a rifle.
By comparison, 63,000 people were injured fishing.
.....I think we can continue to trust hunters with semi auto rifles.

 

[Novus Collectus]

I can't believe some of you think 7.62x39 is too small to kill whitetails, I know someone that has killed 100+ with .223(not in MD), is it the best caliber for whitetail? Maybe not but with modern day hunting rounds it can certianly kill whitetail sized game with no problem. And what about coyote, more coyote have probably been taken with .223 then any other caliber.

Yes it is illegal to hunt deer with .223 in MD but not in alot of states and even here in MD you only have to step up to .243 to be "legal".

I saw nothing on the DNR websight saying .223 is not a legal hunting round for deer in MD. The requirement is 1,200 ft/pounds muzzle energy and most .223 rounds qualify.

 

[AK-74me]

I saw nothing on the DNR websight saying .223 is not a legal hunting round for deer in MD. The requirement is 1,200 ft/pounds muzzle energy and most .223 rounds qualify.

You maybe right, it might be one of those things that has just been passed along and taken as "law". I was under the impression though that .243 was the minimum for hunting whitetail in MD. I thought I remember reading it in those hunting and trapping guides they give you when you buy your hunting license. I might be wrong though.

 

[itsbob]

In MD you are not allowed to hunt deer with more than 8 rounds in the mag.
When hunting other game it cannot be more than three, so no "spraying the woods".
In MD it is illegal to hunt under the influence of alcohol.
In MD it is illegal to hunt with a full auto rifle, so no "spraying the woods".
Guess what, if someone is breaking these laws, then banning the use of semi autos wouldn't have stopped them either.It is not the lawful hunter using a semi auto that you have to worry about and the way you describe what you did is just like how the Brady Campaign would put it.

It's also illegal to carry weapons on a school campus, we can see how well that law work..

Just because it's illegal doesn't mean people don't do it..

And I don't see how chasing a deer in your sights and shooting 8 rounds would be much better than doing the same with 20 rounds.

And suggesting you have to have a full auto weapon to constitute "spraying" is silly at best... How fast can you let loose 8 or even 20 rounds of .223 in a semi auto rifle?? 1/2 second.. one WHOLE second??

I'm not saying make them illegal, I'm just suggesting that bolt action rifles are safer to hunt with..

Hunting is only one SMALL reason to possess a firearm..

 

[Novus Collectus]

It's also illegal to carry weapons on a school campus, we can see how well that law work..

Just because it's illegal doesn't mean people don't do it..

Yes, that was my point. But the people who follow most hunting laws are also not going to be breaking the rest of them. Statistically hunters are safe and law abiding and I trust the overwhelming majority with the contyinued use of semi auto rifles.

And I don't see how chasing a deer in your sights and shooting 8 rounds would be much better than doing the same with 20 rounds.

And I don't see any hunters in MD doing this, except for maybe some criminal ones that wouldn't have a hunting license anyway.

And suggesting you have to have a full auto weapon to constitute "spraying" is silly at best...

"Spraying" is an expression the Brady Campaign and the gun banners like the VPC use to describe semi automatic rifles and handguns.

How fast can you let loose 8 or even 20 rounds of .223 in a semi auto rifle?? 1/2 second.. one WHOLE second??

Well considering the full auto M16 can only fire 11 rounds a second on full auto, I would have to say not many can be fired in a second when firing semi auto.
Once again, it is a famous false claim by the antis so suggest semi autos can "spray" a clip of bullets as fast as a full auto firing 500 or 600 rounds a minute. Wish you choosed your debating points better.

I'm not saying make them illegal, I'm just suggesting that bolt action rifles are safer to hunt with..

I think it depends on the hunter, the game and the situation to state a bolt action is safer.
But the supposed safety aside and utilitarianly speaking, sometimes it is better to use a semi auto for hunting (depending on the game, the situation and the hunting enviroment).

 

[itsbob]

Well considering the full auto M16 can only fire 11 rounds a second on full auto, I would have to say not many can be fired in a second when firing semi auto.
Once again, it is a famous false claim by the antis so suggest semi autos can "spray" a clip of bullets as fast as a full auto firing 500 or 600 rounds a minute. Wish you choosed your debating points better.

Well since it's impossible to place an M16 (current version) on "Full Auto".. three round burst.. stop.. three round burst.. stop.. three round burst.. it may be possible to send more rounds downrange in less time on semi auto.

 

[Larry Gude]

You guys...

...are quibbling.

If I'm riding the farm and I see a ground hog, I'd love to have an ar, an aimpoint and a 20 round mag.

Hunting, varminting, is sometimes targets of opportunity. I'm not going to dedicate 2 hours to watching a hole to kill a ground hog so I can 1 shot him.
If I've got him with a good back ground, BLAM, BLAM, BLAM, BLAM etc...

 

[itsbob]

...are quibbling.

If I'm riding the farm and I see a ground hog, I'd love to have an ar, an aimpoint and a 20 round mag.

Hunting, varminting, is sometimes targets of opportunity. I'm not going to dedicate 2 hours to watching a hole to kill a ground hog so I can 1 shot him.
If I've got him with a good back ground, BLAM, BLAM, BLAM, BLAM etc...

Have to admit, THAT sounds like a lot of fun!!

 

[Ponytail]

...are quibbling.

If I'm riding the farm and I see a ground hog, I'd love to have an ar, an aimpoint and a 20 round mag.

Hunting, varminting, is sometimes targets of opportunity. I'm not going to dedicate 2 hours to watching a hole to kill a ground hog so I can 1 shot him.
If I've got him with a good back ground, BLAM, BLAM, BLAM, BLAM etc...

My grandfathers' claim to fame, was the fact that he got more woodchucks from the seat of his tractor using a 1-1/2" Long handled box wrench, than he did with a firearm. Deer, well, that's another story...sort of. As many deer that he has had wake him from a dead sleep, a wrench would have been just as deadly.

 

[Larry Gude]

Well...

Have to admit, THAT sounds like a lot of fun!!

...that's a matter of perspective, of course.

 

[itsbob]

...that's a matter of perspective, of course.

Shooting was a LOT more fun when I wasn't paying for the bullets though..

I like Archery, you don't have to worry about ammo prices but once.. though they REALLY need to make a bow that can make a resounding BANG when you let an arrow go.. smoke, lots of smoke would be cool too..

 

[Larry Gude]

I love old timers...

My grandfathers' claim to fame, was the fact that he got more woodchucks from the seat of his tractor using a 1-1/2" Long handled box wrench, than he did with a firearm. Deer, well, that's another story...sort of. As many deer that he has had wake him from a dead sleep, a wrench would have been just as deadly.

...never waste a dime when a penny will suffice!

WHACK

 

[Larry Gude]

Well...

Shooting was a LOT more fun when I wasn't paying for the bullets though..

I like Archery, you don't have to worry about ammo prices but once.. though they REALLY need to make a bow that can make a resounding BANG when you let an arrow go.. smoke, lots of smoke would be cool too..

...you can tie roman candles to them, duct tape, and let her rip. It's best to have someone else light while you're already drawn though...ask me how I know...

 

[Larry Gude]

Well...

Shooting was a LOT more fun when I wasn't paying for the bullets though..

...I was more speaking for Mr. Groundhog and his end of the deal...

 

[Dukesdad]

Ar 15?

$hit, if I had a mortar I'd use it on these friggin bambies out here...

 

[Novus Collectus]

$hit, if I had a mortar I'd use it on these friggin bambies out here...

HOWITZER HUNT - Mountain Howitzer Cannon Whitetail Deer Hunt and build your own 12 pound Mountain Howitzer Cannon

Bizarre as it seems, it technically might be legal to hunt deer in MD with muzzloading mortars and howitzers like that guy in Wisconsin did.

 

[Dukesdad]

HOWITZER HUNT - Mountain Howitzer Cannon Whitetail Deer Hunt and build your own 12 pound Mountain Howitzer Cannon

Bizarre as it seems, it technically might be legal to hunt deer in MD with muzzloading mortars and howitzers like that guy in Wisconsin did.

It never ceases to amaze me what can be founf on the internet....