In support of the Apocrypha

[ItalianScallion]

The best defense against error in any form (fake Bibles and religions) is a solid knowledge of your King James Bible. If you read it, forgeries become readily apparent. Why the Apocrypha Isn't in the Bible.

This really troubles me....really... Who said this?

Lent can't come fast enough--giving up internet access. Come on Ash Wednesday!!!

But this again is the problem, don't you see? God never asks us to give up something for "Lent" and then go back to it again later. This is man made and does very little to bring us closer to God.

True "fasting" is giving up everything for a time: Food, drink, TV, phone, internet, work, et all, to commune exclusively with God. To pray, then be silent and listen to His voice uninterrupted by anything and anyone. (Now that is, if you can. Certain folks; the elderly, diabetics, heart patients, etc., cannot). You devote yourselves entirely to prayer.

If you do this and you do it often, it teaches you to become totally dependant on God. Giving up one thing once a year does little. Especially if you go back to it later (as Starman said)...

 

[Zguy28]

If you can give up something through just the Lent period, why can't you give it up for the rest of your life? That is what we are called to do when it comes to "Repentance".

I have Catholic friends who give up eating "cookies" or "drinking beer" for Lent. Then when Lent period is over they go right back to those things they "gave up". Spiritual Sacrifice?

Some things it is good to give up for a time in order to draw you closer to God. We should be careful in our criticism on this. Personally, I believe Lent and other "Fasting days" should apply to food as originally intended. But I'm not going to criticize somebody giving up something like internet usage as a sort of fast.

And yes, I do agree with the cookies and beer one's you mentioned. Ridiculous to say the least.

 

[libby]

If you can give up something through just the Lent period, why can't you give it up for the rest of your life? That is what we are called to do when it comes to "Repentance".

I have Catholic friends who give up eating "cookies" or "drinking beer" for Lent. Then when Lent period is over they go right back to those things they "gave up". Spiritual Sacrifice?[/QU

So you think a spiritual sacrifice (and presumably any other) isn't a worthwhile sacrifice unless it's forever?
Should we then assume that a monetary sacrifice to the poor is of no value unless you give up all of your money for all time?
If you volunteer for some cause, but can only do it for a while, does that make it for naught?

I can't judge the motives of your friends, but if they're giving up cookies to lose weight, then I would think it's of no value. If they're giving up cookies or beer as a spiritual sacrifice just for the 40 days of Lent, then I would be careful not to judge that as insincere unless you've decided to become a consecrated religious yourself.

 

[Starman3000m]

Some things it is good to give up for a time in order to draw you closer to God. We should be careful in our criticism on this. Personally, I believe Lent and other "Fasting days" should apply to food as originally intended. But I'm not going to criticize somebody giving up something like internet usage as a sort of fast.

And yes, I do agree with the cookies and beer one's you mentioned. Ridiculous to say the least.

Please, all, accept my deepest apologies if this came across as a "criticism" but my intended comment was that if a person can choose to give up something for a short period to honor God, why not make that a forever commitment to God? Beer would be a good one to give up forever, cookies on the other hand...

BTW: The Bible does not state that if you do not observe a "fast" during certain days you are committing a sinful act against God.
When a person is saved, fasting is one of those "non-essential" points that has no bearing on one's Salvation.

 

[Zguy28]

Please, all, accept my deepest apologies if this came across as a "criticism" but my intended comment was that if a person can choose to give up something for a short period to honor God, why not make that a forever commitment to God? Beer would be a good one to give up forever, cookies on the other hand...

BTW: The Bible does not state that if you do not observe a "fast" during certain days you are committing a sinful act against God.
When a person is saved, fasting is one of those "non-essential" points that has no bearing on one's Salvation.

Absolutely. And I wasn't getting on you, just saying we (all of us) must be careful.

We are not commanded to fast in the NT, but it does assume we will.

14Then the disciples of John came to him, saying, "Why do we and the Pharisees fast, but your disciples do not fast?" 15And Jesus said to them, "Can the wedding guests mourn as long as the bridegroom is with them? The days will come when the bridegroom is taken away from them, and then they will fast.

Kind of like prayer. Some particular prayers are commanded, but over all, prayer is not commanded (that I know of), but Jesus said "when you pray."

I'd challenge anyone to fast from breakfast and lunch 1 day a week for a month. You will not be disappointed.

 

[Starman3000m]

This really troubles me....really... Who said this?

But this again is the problem, don't you see? God never asks us to give up something for "Lent" and then go back to it again later. This is man made and does very little to bring us closer to God.

True "fasting" is giving up everything for a time: Food, drink, TV, phone, internet, work, et all, to commune exclusively with God. To pray, then be silent and listen to His voice uninterrupted by anything and anyone. (Now that is, if you can. Certain folks; the elderly, diabetics, heart patients, etc., cannot). You devote yourselves entirely to prayer.

If you do this and you do it often, it teaches you to become totally dependant on God. Giving up one thing once a year does little. Especially if you go back to it later (as Starman said)...

 

[baydoll]

This really troubles me....really... Who said this?

That's the one thing I disagree with Tracy the author of that article on, ItalianScallion (I'm just now noticing I've been mis-spelling your username all of this time, dur! Sorry! ). I'm not a KJV-Only groupie. But I do highly respect her opinion. : )

(edited for spelling!)

 

[baydoll]

Soon enough you will be accused of works based salvation, one! You're treading on thin ice! Some people cannot consider how the spiritual exercises of Lent help us to detach from this world and focus on Christ as the one need we truly have. That would be to suggest that Christ needs our help and His Sacrifice wasn't sufficient.

Diverting again, libby? What, don't like the way your friend's thread has gone?

 

[baydoll]

Bring it. I really do understand the "go it alone" folks more everyday. It must be so much easier living that life.

Well before they 'bring it', would you please kindly answer the questions I asked you previously? Thank you!

 

[baydoll]

Absolutely. And I wasn't getting on you, just saying we (all of us) must be careful.

We are not commanded to fast in the NT, but it does assume we will.

14Then the disciples of John came to him, saying, "Why do we and the Pharisees fast, but your disciples do not fast?" 15And Jesus said to them, "Can the wedding guests mourn as long as the bridegroom is with them? The days will come when the bridegroom is taken away from them, and then they will fast.

Kind of like prayer. Some particular prayers are commanded, but over all, prayer is not commanded (that I know of), but Jesus said "when you pray."

Nevertheless, Catholics are in direct disobedience of God's Word regarding this. Specifically in Matthew 6.

 

[Zguy28]

Nevertheless, Catholics are in direct disobedience of God's Word regarding this. Specifically in Matthew 6.

Legalistic much?

And I thought I was puritan. Obviously you don't differentiate between personal fasting and those encouraged as a corporate fast.

Christ speaks to the attitude of the heart regarding things like this. Don't go around trumpeting your fast for the reward of sympathy from men. He's not saying "Ooh, don't let anybody find out or your doomed!"

 

[ItalianScallion]

That's the one thing I disagree with Tracy the author of that article on, ItalianScallion (I'm just now noticing I've been mis-spelling your username all of this time, dur! Sorry! ). I'm not a KJV-Only groupie. But I do highly respect her opinion. : )

No problem. Stallion was in my BC (before Christ) days.

Ok on the KJV only thing. I just have a BIG problem with folks who tote it as THE standard for Bibles, as she apparently does...

 

[baydoll]

Legalistic much?

And I thought I was puritan. Obviously you don't differentiate between personal fasting and those encouraged as a corporate fast.

Christ speaks to the attitude of the heart regarding things like this. Don't go around trumpeting your fast for the reward of sympathy from men. He's not saying "Ooh, don't let anybody find out or your doomed!"

Actually no.

The difference is God commands us to fast in private as we are led, not in public and on special days.

Galatians 4: 9 But now that you know God—or rather are known by God—how is it that you are turning back to those weak and miserable principles? Do you wish to be enslaved by them all over again? 10 You are observing special days and months and seasons and years! 11 I fear for you, that somehow I have wasted my efforts on you.

 

[baydoll]

No problem. Stallion was in my BC (before Christ) days.

Ok on the KJV only thing. I just have a BIG problem with folks who tote it as THE standard for Bibles, as she apparently does...

I'm glad we agree!