Issue #2...the draft...
- Thread starter Larry Gude
- Start date
fttrsbeerwench
New Member
I vote that there be mandatory draft for the sake of making us a closer nation. If those 20 guys hangin' out in front of Canopy Liquor can't find a job.. Send 'em to boot camp.
Immigrants should have to prove they love America by serving in the miltary to gain legal citizenship.
I don't think women should HAVE to , but they can if they want to..
Gay's are ok, but let's not push for the right to wear pink panties under the uniform. It's a man's military and should stay that way.
Take better care of the grunts so that it actually pays to serve.
I don't worry about becoming to militarized, but I think it would help us, as a people, get back some of the traditional values we have let slip away in the name of diversity or equal rights or whatever else anyone can b!tch about.
Immigrants should have to prove they love America by serving in the miltary to gain legal citizenship.
I don't think women should HAVE to , but they can if they want to..
Gay's are ok, but let's not push for the right to wear pink panties under the uniform. It's a man's military and should stay that way.
Take better care of the grunts so that it actually pays to serve.
I don't worry about becoming to militarized, but I think it would help us, as a people, get back some of the traditional values we have let slip away in the name of diversity or equal rights or whatever else anyone can b!tch about.
MMDad
Lem Putt
I really can't argue that the current way is best, or that it even works well. People who know more than me have done studies which justified removing the work from the military personnel and giving it to civilians. They have also found that privatizing manufacturing is more efficient.gumbo said:
Yes, for two reasons. Taking manufacturing away from private industry making it government owned is how the USSR did it, and it's how China does it now.I'm I sounding communist?
Second, the state telling you what your job will be is way too totalitarian. Example:
Gumbo and Vrai turn 18 at the same time, and get inducted. The "job decider" says "Gumbo, what are you good at?" Gumbo says "I really like cars, how about making me a mechanic?"
"Sorry, no mechanic jobs left. You are now a hair stylist. Next!"
Vrai (in her bubbly teenage blonde voice): "Hi I really like hair! Can I be a stylist too?"
"Sorry, the last postion has been filled. You will be a sewer scrubber. You should probably cut your nails."
dustin
UAIOE
exactly my thoughts too..Pete said:
you put crap in the system, you get crap out...
my ideas:
active duty: cutback to the amount of personnell needed, raise their pay and benefits (this keeps highly skilled people in).
reserve forces: reorganize completely so you have deployable reserves and "nondeployable". their pay and benefits are not as good, but good enough. deployable reserves basically are the current reserve forces.
nondeployable reserves are those individuals who will have been through boot camp and receive a percentage of deployable reserve pay, no benefits, but they still get a very small monthly check. they have to maintain an extremely minimal uniform requirement (pay would cover this) and this is verified when they go to drill once a year for one weekend. you dont show up to drill and your pay is cut off. (which would basically give the DOD the ability to keep tabs on their people). when/if the shizzle hits the fan, and everyone else is gone, you call in these peeps.
Railroad
Routinely Derailed
My reason for choosing pro-draft was pure frustration and had little to do with improving our armed services. I mentally committed the same crime too many parents are committing in real life - passing off the problem of teaching self-discipline to our kids to someone else, in this case a company commander or drill sergeant. My thinking was in part based on the 8-week boot camp experience I had in 1979, and in part on the hellish (part-myth) impression I have of the USMC's Paris Island. The fact is, boot camp alone won't undo all the damage done by lack of discipline and dedicated parenting, though I wish that it could and so I voted for the draft.
Pete's right, one or two or a few incurably screwed-up individuals are nothing more than an irritant, and not a problem that is easily solved in a military unit that has a job to do - with or without the application of violent punishment.
The damage caused by the Dr. Spock approach to thoroughly ruining people is done and is continuing to spread, and the coddled masses produced by that approach are getting older.
As for the ostensibly real reason for having a draft, there is no sense increasing the volume of inductees in the military when we are underfunding and mismanaging the military to begin with, and chasing the good experienced folks out of the military with stupid policies. My Bullshoot detector was maxed out when I got out in 1987 and at the rate things were going downhill then, I'm amazed that anyone would want to be there now. And therein lies a reason to re-start the discussion on the draft: go ahead and screw up the military to the point that nobody wants to do it, and it will become necessary to draft people to serve in the military.
Let's look at the what's-in-it-for-me things that might interest a prospective enlisted person.
Training: Learning a new job skill that could lead to a civilian career after you get out. (This is why I joined in 1979). Nope, that won't work anymore because we aren't training our people worth a hoot anymore. The Advanced Electronics Field I chose upon enlistment entailed about 2 years of school, most of it up front before reporting to the fleet. I was a highly-trained technician when my foot touched the deck of a ship for the first time. My bosses could reasonably expect that they could continue to do their jobs while I could apply my training to do a good bit of mine. Not so, anymore. Pete will tell you, he was as much of a full-time teacher as he was a leader or manager.
Okay, so training has gone to crap.
That leaves:
Meanwhile back in middle-class America, there are kids who give themselves paramilitary haircuts, wear combat boots, and destroy things like new homes under construction because of the outlet for pent-up energy. I met a very few people like that in the military, people who quite simply wanted to be violent because that's how they got their thrills. I don't know what to say about these people because I don't understand them, but I imagine putting those folks in the Marine Corps might be a very good thing.
Pete's right, one or two or a few incurably screwed-up individuals are nothing more than an irritant, and not a problem that is easily solved in a military unit that has a job to do - with or without the application of violent punishment.
The damage caused by the Dr. Spock approach to thoroughly ruining people is done and is continuing to spread, and the coddled masses produced by that approach are getting older.
As for the ostensibly real reason for having a draft, there is no sense increasing the volume of inductees in the military when we are underfunding and mismanaging the military to begin with, and chasing the good experienced folks out of the military with stupid policies. My Bullshoot detector was maxed out when I got out in 1987 and at the rate things were going downhill then, I'm amazed that anyone would want to be there now. And therein lies a reason to re-start the discussion on the draft: go ahead and screw up the military to the point that nobody wants to do it, and it will become necessary to draft people to serve in the military.
Let's look at the what's-in-it-for-me things that might interest a prospective enlisted person.
Training: Learning a new job skill that could lead to a civilian career after you get out. (This is why I joined in 1979). Nope, that won't work anymore because we aren't training our people worth a hoot anymore. The Advanced Electronics Field I chose upon enlistment entailed about 2 years of school, most of it up front before reporting to the fleet. I was a highly-trained technician when my foot touched the deck of a ship for the first time. My bosses could reasonably expect that they could continue to do their jobs while I could apply my training to do a good bit of mine. Not so, anymore. Pete will tell you, he was as much of a full-time teacher as he was a leader or manager.
Okay, so training has gone to crap.
That leaves:
- Nifty new clothes to wear (properly pressed and clean at all times, of course),
- Travel (to places you may or may not want to go), and
- Challenges (to do things someone else has decided you will do, poorly if necessary and well if possible, with or without tools).
Meanwhile back in middle-class America, there are kids who give themselves paramilitary haircuts, wear combat boots, and destroy things like new homes under construction because of the outlet for pent-up energy. I met a very few people like that in the military, people who quite simply wanted to be violent because that's how they got their thrills. I don't know what to say about these people because I don't understand them, but I imagine putting those folks in the Marine Corps might be a very good thing.
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