Mark McGwire admits steroid use

[Larry Gude]

The media is a cancer.....in all walks of life. They were ok with sensationalizing the long ball until Barry Bonds came along and wasn't nice to them. People got their feelings hurt because Barry wasn't nice to them so they felt the need to use their power to take him down...maybe it wasn't the smartest thing in the world on Barry's part, but I'm sure he felt like everyone else was doing it, why did he have to change who he was to appease some geek with a microphone.

See, things come out, sooner or later. Did some petty reporters feel like 'getting' Bonds because he didn't hi five them? Probably. However, did some folks simply see Bonds as the opportunity, with the evidence, the story, to, finally, set things right in terms of cheating and the truth and ignoring it for so long? Is it ALL self interest for everyone or was there some component of guilt, of setting things, if not right but, at least back on course?

Not everyone is beholden to the league. Not everyone is beholden to teams. Once there was a clear story to chase beyond the control of the club house, as there inevitably would be, I don't know.

 

[Larry Gude]

Barry was a great player early in his career, would he have been a HR king? No, would he had been a HOF'er? Probably.

Or, if clean, would he have spent the last decade of his career listening to "Why is Bonds not keeping up with other hitters? Why is he dinged up again? Why did he not hit a HR for 10 straight games?"

 

[toppick08]

Exactly. It was a heck of a season, steroids or not. Since the steroid stuff has come out it's been a bit of a snoozer. The problem isn't that everyone was using steroids to get better, it's that everyone using steroids becomes a health problem, as well as a burden on those that want to stay healthier by not using them.

Lets be a little fair to McGwire though. Out of all the sluggers, he hit the ball the furthest. He probably wouldn't have hit 70, but he still would have been a slugger. Sosa and Bonds? Probably not so much.

No, Mantle did....

 

[thurley42]

See, things come out, sooner or later. Did some petty reporters feel like 'getting' Bonds because he didn't hi five them? Probably. However, did some folks simply see Bonds as the opportunity, with the evidence, the story, to, finally, set things right in terms of cheating and the truth and ignoring it for so long? Is it ALL self interest for everyone or was there some component of guilt, of setting things, if not right but, at least back on course?

Not everyone is beholden to the league. Not everyone is beholden to teams. Once there was a clear story to chase beyond the control of the club house, as there inevitably would be, I don't know.

What is back on course? Baseball more than any other sport has always been riddeled with scandal......

 

[thurley42]

Or, if clean, would he have spent the last decade of his career listening to "Why is Bonds not keeping up with other hitters? Why is he dinged up again? Why did he not hit a HR for 10 straight games?"

I agree....you should know by now that I don't hold anything against any of the players that have been linked to PEDs...

 

[Larry Gude]

I agree....you should know by now that I don't hold anything against any of the players that have been linked to PEDs...

See? There is the paradox. It is hard to hold them responsible. Everyone else was doing the Twist, too! However, they did each choose to cheat, individually, knowingly break the spirit of the rules. That everyone else was doing it is like expecting a cop to let you go for speeding.

Not everyone cheated. And this is where the press comes in, speaking truth to power, calling it like it is. Providing back up and support for everyone who did NOT cheat.

Of course, I don't stand to make an extra couple million a year if I speed.

 

[Larry Gude]

What is back on course? Baseball more than any other sport has always been riddeled with scandal......

And that right there is a great point, too! It's like a hooker that wants to be accepted into polite society, mom, apple pie and smile at the kiddies and then take you in the back room and give you what you REALLY want; some action!

 

[Otter]

Frankly, I suspect most used steroids at one time or another during the 80s,90s, 00s..Its SOP in alot of cases in the recovery from injuries/surgeries. Of the 3 culprits most mentioned cuz of the HR record(bonds, sosa, mcgwire)..I will always believe that without steroids, only mcgwire had a legitimate chance at breaking the record. He's always been a HR threat, his rookie year he had 35 at the all-star break..Was he using then?? Who knows..

 

[Beta84]

No, Mantle did....

Steroid era.

 

[Larry Gude]

Frankly, I suspect most used steroids at one time or another during the 80s,90s, 00s..Its SOP in alot of cases in the recovery from injuries/surgeries. Of the 3 culprits most mentioned cuz of the HR record(bonds, sosa, mcgwire)..I will always believe that without steroids, only mcgwire had a legitimate chance at breaking the record. He's always been a HR threat, his rookie year he had 35 at the all-star break..Was he using then?? Who knows..

I think you could make the argument, that he could make that argument, on these grounds;

"I actually got more injuries, ligaments and tendons because of the muscle mass increase. I got too strong for my body, for the things that can't get stronger like tendons and ligaments..."

I'd rather hear him say that then just say, without explanation, why the hell he would use in the first place if he believed he was great without them.

Haven't seen the whole interview. Maybe Costas asked him that?

 

[toppick08]

Steroid era.

Null and void to me.

 

[Otter]

I think you could make the argument, that he could make that argument, on these grounds;

"I actually got more injuries, ligaments and tendons because of the muscle mass increase. I got too strong for my body, for the things that can't get stronger like tendons and ligaments..."

I'd rather hear him say that then just say, without explanation, why the hell he would use in the first place if he believed he was great without them.

Haven't seen the whole interview. Maybe Costas asked him that?

I haven't seen the interview at all. My point is that his body didn't change all that much visually from his rookie year to retirement. And he has always been injury prone, believe I heard a blurb on the news where McGwire said most of his steroid use was to recover from injuries.

With no testing for 10 yrs or so after the ban of steroids in 91, anyone that played during that period is suspect. Much ado about nothing to me..How many hits/home runs did McGwire/bonds/sosa/..etc get off of juiced pitchers?? The argument can go on and on..

 

[Larry Gude]

With no testing for 10 yrs or so after the ban of steroids in 91, anyone that played during that period is suspect. Much ado about nothing to me..How many hits/home runs did McGwire/bonds/sosa/..etc get off of juiced pitchers?? The argument can go on and on..

Yawp.

 

[thurley42]

See? There is the paradox. It is hard to hold them responsible. Everyone else was doing the Twist, too! However, they did each choose to cheat, individually, knowingly break the spirit of the rules. That everyone else was doing it is like expecting a cop to let you go for speeding.

Not everyone cheated. And this is where the press comes in, speaking truth to power, calling it like it is. Providing back up and support for everyone who did NOT cheat.

Of course, I don't stand to make an extra couple million a year if I speed.

Pick your poison......aphetaimes, steroids, juiced balls, bats, throwing games, gambling....whatever comes next.

You are right, not everyone cheated....but we can agree that the majority of relevant players did. Without fact checking I heard Wilbon say this summer that 12 of the top 15 HR hitters in the last 20 years have been linked to one form of PED or another....another strong indicator is the number of pitchers and irrelevant players that have been linked or implicated. The whole Mets locker room scandal.....alot of people are guilty...and it's a shame that everyone will be judged by whether or not people think they used them.

Mix that in with all of the lies, deflections, media biased reporting.....we'll never know the truth, and personally I really don't care to know. I just want to move on....unless you can create a machine to clear/implicate every athlete from every illegal activity, I don't think any asteriks, bans, or any of the above should be used.

 

[thurley42]

Null and void to me.

You are killing me dude...

 

[donbarzini]

No, Mantle did....

No........Frank Howard did. When he hit it.

 

[Larry Gude]

Pick your poison......aphetaimes, steroids, juiced balls, bats, throwing games, gambling....whatever comes next.

You are right, not everyone cheated....but we can agree that the majority of relevant players did. Without fact checking I heard Wilbon say this summer that 12 of the top 15 HR hitters in the last 20 years have been linked to one form of PED or another....another strong indicator is the number of pitchers and irrelevant players that have been linked or implicated. The whole Mets locker room scandal.....alot of people are guilty...and it's a shame that everyone will be judged by whether or not people think they used them.

Mix that in with all of the lies, deflections, media biased reporting.....we'll never know the truth, and personally I really don't care to know. I just want to move on....unless you can create a machine to clear/implicate every athlete from every illegal activity, I don't think any asteriks, bans, or any of the above should be used.

And another interesting facet of this is the simple question; why WOULDN'T you seek to enhance your performance? Take some 100 hour a week executive. What's he/she on? Anti depressants? Stimulants? Supplements galore? They gotta get out there and compete and going to bed early, taking your vitamins and saying your prayers is only going to keep a human body going for so lone.

Hell, life or death jobs like solider, lots of them guys are on all sorts of stimulants and combat guys are damn well known to take steroids and for obvious reasons; be stronger, heal quicker, prevent injury, carry more, longer. All for $75k a year!

 

[thurley42]

I haven't seen the interview at all. My point is that his body didn't change all that much visually from his rookie year to retirement. And he has always been injury prone, believe I heard a blurb on the news where McGwire said most of his steroid use was to recover from injuries.

With no testing for 10 yrs or so after the ban of steroids in 91, anyone that played during that period is suspect. Much ado about nothing to me..How many hits/home runs did McGwire/bonds/sosa/..etc get off of juiced pitchers?? The argument can go on and on..

I think another point that needs to be visited is the types of supplements/drugs being used. I rememeber in 98 Mac was talking about using Andro....which at the time was completely legal....I was getting it through the exchange then...and that stuff ruled! My bench went up 30 pounds in a month on that stuff! It was banned in the first Prohormone ban of 01-02, but at that time was completely legal....

Supplement scientist are constantly developing another strand of prohormone/synthetic that hasn't been tested/banned by the FDA. They produce it until they get around to banning it, then repeat the process. One thing most experts agree on is that they are growing more and more dangerous....maybe more should be done to stop this process.

 

[Beta84]

Null and void to me.

I was talking about sluggers in the steroid era.

 

[thurley42]

I was talking about sluggers in the steroid era.

its like talking to a wall.....Top thinks the alcoholic racist dudes jacked up on speed are legit because the media gave people more privacy in their day.