O.d.d.

[CalvertNewbie]

Just had a long talk with the Mom& grandmom. I called them to come and get him. She has had the child to several doctors. The child has been dismissed from 4 daycares in the last 1 1/2 years.
I also spoke with my licensing specialist, asking for guidance, since the parent & grandparents aren't willing to do the psychiatrist route.

My husband took pics of my bruised legs, and the bite marks on my arm.

I would have knocked this kid into next week, had he been mine.

The mother fought with me about the kid having to wear pullups while here. She insists he's potty trained. Believe me, he's not! I'm sick of shampooing carpets.

Friday is definately his last day. Maybe today was. :shrug:

I'm exhausted.

Thanks, everyone for all your input.

You tried, just as other providers have tried. If the mother refuses to get him the help that he obviously needs, he'll continue to be booted from every center she takes him to. Eventually she'll have to realize that he needs help and she'll get her head out of the sand. At least I hope for this little boy's sake, she does.

I dealt with a similar situation when I was the director of a before/after school program. I took a chance on a 9 year old boy with a single Mom, no father in the picture. She wanted to work to support her family, not go on welfare, which I completely respected. She needed help. She was upfront that he had anger issues but supposedly they were under control with meds. His teacher and principal both verified this. He was a handful but we were making real progress with him for about a month.

One day, the mother decided he would no longer take his meds (found this out the hard way). He got extremely violent, threw a heavy chair across the cafeteria for no apparent reason, barely missing a group of kids. Took three of us to restrain him and we all got hurt from him punching & kicking. He was a big boy but I had no clue a 9 year old could be so strong! With the safety of 50 other kids to worry about, we decided to throw in the towel and wish her luck. I felt so bad for her but we just weren't equipped to handle behavior like that.

 

[Bann]

Firm and consistent limits are necessary. Do not get into power struggles. It is best to give the child a choice - for example: you may pick up your toys or sit on the couch for 5 minutes. Repeat the choice the same way as many times as you need to do this. Do not vary your words and do not engage in discussion.

Praise the positives -- give praise when the child does something when asked without exhibiting the ODD behavior.


Is the child in school? If so, is there an IEP with behavior goals? It might help if you had access to that so you, the parent, and the school are all on the same page.

For further resources & assistance:

Children With Oppositional Defiant Disorder | American Academy of Child & Adolescent Psychiatry

Oppositional Defiant Disorder ODD

Solutions to Oppositional Defiant Disorder

Many more available on Google search.

I'll read further to see how old the child is, if he's been diagnosed officially, or the parent says he is, and if he's in school, etc... (and if, as TwinOaks said - if there is an IEP)

 

[Bann]

Personally I think ODD is a crutch for inconsistant parenting. But let's just say the kid does have some sort of disorder...ODD kids need to be run ragged, IMO. This is very helpful with ADD kids as well. Keep them tired. Find something he wants and make him run laps for it. They generally respond very well to rewards...and it helps to let them make choices..on everything. Even if it is essentially the same thing they are choosing. Such as "bratty johnny, would you like to eat lunch now, and then play or would you like to play for five minutes then eat lunch and play some more?" This avoids telling him what to do, and makes him less likely to argue. My adolescent psych teacher swears by the "choices" method..and said it has helped her patients..never tried it myself..but it makes sense.

It's actually a very good tactic to use with a lot of kids who get into that habit they have of saying "no" all the time when they're in that age/stage.

(not to make light of the situation Nanny Pam is going through)

 

[Bann]

In this case, I agree 100%

Also, I have no proof that the child has ODD. I'm just going by the symptoms.

The psych community is pretty split on most "childhood" diagnosis. Many believe that children shouldn't be diagnosed with anything. So these disorders and such should never be just accepted like everyone agrees they exist..because not everyone does. it is agreed that autism exists..but there are concerns as to the sheer numbers suddenly "diagnosed" and when it can be diagnosed and what criteria should be met. There is little consensus with the behavioral disorders, though. Childhood disorders of any type are exceedingly rare..so to assume every brat has some sort of disorder is silly and wastes resources that should be devoted to kids that need it. Children are all different. Personally I think a lot of what is labeled is just personality differences. We want to fit children..and people into nice little tidy charts day by day with what they are sup to be doing, thinking, and feeling...and we can't. Every kid that doesn't like to be touched, has sensory overload, and prefers to play alone is not autistic and every child that is hard headed and doesn't like to listen are not ODD. Every child does not need an iep or an advocate. then the ones that do don't have to work so hard to get it.

Personally when I hear ODD I automatically think inconsistency, and it plays in well that he has a single mom. Not because I have anything against sinlge moms (had one myself)..but because they are bound to be busy..and without the help a partner can provide it may be difficult to be absolutely consistent which some children seem to need more than others. Pair that with a child who naturally, by means of their personality (for lack of a better term..) need and crave absolute structure and consistency..and you can get a child that gets pretty out of hand.

Just had a long talk with the Mom& grandmom. I called them to come and get him. She has had the child to several doctors. The child has been dismissed from 4 daycares in the last 1 1/2 years.
I also spoke with my licensing specialist, asking for guidance, since the parent & grandparents aren't willing to do the psychiatrist route.

My husband took pics of my bruised legs, and the bite marks on my arm.

I would have knocked this kid into next week, had he been mine.

The mother fought with me about the kid having to wear pullups while here. She insists he's potty trained. Believe me, he's not! I'm sick of shampooing carpets.

Friday is definately his last day. Maybe today was. :shrug:

I'm exhausted.

Thanks, everyone for all your input.

You have no choice - the parent sounds like SHE's most of the problem here.

 

[bohman]

...Kennedy Kreeger is a great place to start. This kid needs his own child advocate.

Agreed, Kennedy is a great place. I had a chance to watch them in action years ago and they do good work. Can be hard to get a kid seen by them, though, just because they are that good - there can be a waiting list depending on the issue.

Just had a long talk with the Mom& grandmom. I called them to come and get him. She has had the child to several doctors. The child has been dismissed from 4 daycares in the last 1 1/2 years.
I also spoke with my licensing specialist, asking for guidance, since the parent & grandparents aren't willing to do the psychiatrist route.

Looks like we found the problem.

But on the other hand he's brilliant on the PC, with video games, his DS etc. He figured out NetFlix on his own. My daughter never gave him the URL. He saw the movies come in the mail, went online, figured it all out, and when his movies started arriving instead of hers she went online and saw he bumped hers down and put his picks on the top of the list. my daughter was floored.

This is something I've witnessed over the years - never underestimate somebody based on a disability. I have a cousin with Down's that taught himself to read. Nobody believed he'd be able, so no one tried to teach him. So he just picked up the newspaper every day and did it himself.

 

[twinoaks207]

Nanny Pam, you did the right thing for you. If the parent is in denial about the issues that the child has, all the good intentions and training in the world will not help. A very wise school psychologist that I once worked with explained that all parents of special needs children go through a grieving process concerning their child. Basically, they are grieving the loss of the child that we all hope to have. All parents are different. Evidently the Mom of this child has not yet hit the acceptance stage. Someday she will and then she will get help for her child. Pray for them, they will need it! Until then, we can only hope that the little one will not seriously hurt someone before he gets the help that he needs to be the best person he can be.

 

[Bann]

Nanny Pam, you did the right thing for you. If the parent is in denial about the issues that the child has, all the good intentions and training in the world will not help. A very wise school psychologist that I once worked with explained that all parents of special needs children go through a grieving process concerning their child. Basically, they are grieving the loss of the child that we all hope to have. All parents are different. Evidently the Mom of this child has not yet hit the acceptance stage. Someday she will and then she will get help for her child. Pray for them, they will need it! Until then, we can only hope that the little one will not seriously hurt someone before he gets the help that he needs to be the best person he can be.

And it can happen over & over again as the child reaches certain "milestone ages" along the way of growing up.

 

[Roberta]

Personally I think ODD is a crutch for inconsistant parenting. But let's just say the kid does have some sort of disorder...ODD kids need to be run ragged, IMO. This is very helpful with ADD kids as well. Keep them tired. Find something he wants and make him run laps for it. They generally respond very well to rewards...and it helps to let them make choices..on everything. Even if it is essentially the same thing they are choosing. Such as "bratty johnny, would you like to eat lunch now, and then play or would you like to play for five minutes then eat lunch and play some more?" This avoids telling him what to do, and makes him less likely to argue. My adolescent psych teacher swears by the "choices" method..and said it has helped her patients..never tried it myself..but it makes sense.

That's a crock.This nanny country we have become. Just TELL him what to do. He NEEDS to know who is the child and who is the ADULT!! GROW A SET.

 

[Roberta]

I would definitely speak to the mother about failing to warn you about his condition. Every daycare I've ever had my kids in has had paperwork to fill out and it specifically asks about medical and behavioral issues. I don't know anything about ODD other than what I just read but it seems like a lot to deal with. 1. I'd up the rates for having to deal with a special needs child and buy plenty of Advil. Or 2. Tell the mother it's too much for you and keep the biatch's deposit for not telling you about the ODD.

O.d.d.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Has anyone had any experience with this? Please advise.

I am about to cry. I am at wits end. I've researched the internet. The Mother did warn me about this child, but I took him anyway. I put up with her late payments because she's a single Mom.
I've been kicked, bitten, #### on, punched, screamed at, etc. I hate to turn my back on a child that really needs help, but my concern now, is with my other children who are also confused with his defiant behavior. It's not fair to them. I guess I've answered my own question. I really should dismiss this child.

Any experience with ODD will be helpful to me. What comes next?

Thanks!

Pam


Reading comprehension is your friend.

 

[Roberta]

Attitudes like this prove why there are so many abused kids in this world. Had my daughter bought into all that mess, her AUTISTIC child might have been dead from the beatings she would have received. Autistic children are pretty much immune to pain. They don't perceive it in the same way other kids do. She laughed at a spanking. Still does.

Instead my daughter changed pediatricians, and finally had her daughter diagnosed correctly at age 2. By age 3 she was in an early intervention program in the public school system with an IEP, and now at 4 - 1/2 is a different kid. She's still Autistic, there is no cure, but she's learning, and is a delight to be around. We've also learned along the way how best to deal with these children.

Instead of making your own lame diagnosis, you should sit the mom down and figure out how you can help her find a way to help her child, and you as his provider. I can put you in touch with my daughter, and she can tell you how she went about making the public school system help her. It's a long hard drawn out war, but she's winning it, one little battle at a time.

Kennedy Kreeger is a great place to start. This kid needs his own child advocate.

Who said any thing about Autisum? The thread is about O.D.D.....

 

[Bann]

That's a crock.This nanny country we have become. Just TELL him what to do. He NEEDS to know who is the child and who is the ADULT!! GROW A SET.

At Lunchtime: "would you like a peanut butter & jelly, or a bologna & cheese sandwich?" That constitutes a CHOICE.

At naptime: "would you like mommy to cover you up or would you like to cover yourself up?" Again - another choice.

It's not like you're "giving in" to a kid by giving them a choice in something you were already going to expect that they do. (as in eat or sleep)

I think that is what she's talking about with giving choices. NOT ALL kids are totally compliant all the time. Some are definitely more compliant than others and some not at all. It's a very good TACTIC for removing the "power struggle" all kids go through. (some more than others, granted)

O.d.d.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Has anyone had any experience with this? Please advise.

I am about to cry. I am at wits end. I've researched the internet. The Mother did warn me about this child, but I took him anyway. I put up with her late payments because she's a single Mom.
I've been kicked, bitten, #### on, punched, screamed at, etc. I hate to turn my back on a child that really needs help, but my concern now, is with my other children who are also confused with his defiant behavior. It's not fair to them. I guess I've answered my own question. I really should dismiss this child.

Any experience with ODD will be helpful to me. What comes next?

Thanks!

Pam


Reading comprehension is your friend.

Who said any thing about Autisum? The thread is about O.D.D.....

Do you have to be such a biatch? Geez.

 

[Roberta]

At Lunchtime: "would you like a peanut butter & jelly, or a bologna & cheese sandwich?" That constitutes a CHOICE.

At naptime: "would you like mommy to cover you up or would you like to cover yourself up?" Again - another choice.

It's not like you're "giving in" to a kid by giving them a choice in something you were already going to expect that they do. (as in eat or sleep)

I think that is what she's talking about with giving choices. NOT ALL kids are totally compliant all the time. Some are definitely more compliant than others and some not at all. It's a very good TACTIC for removing the "power struggle" all kids go through. (some more than others, granted)






Do you have to be such a biatch? Geez.

Those are choices you give any child. Why is it a problem solving tacit with a problem child???

YES. I am just expressing my opinions. Do you have a problem with that? Oh, F*&^ing well. Your problem, deal with it.

 

[lnmarsh]

Those are choices you give any child. Why is it a problem solving tacit with a problem child???

YES. I am just expressing my opinions. Do you have a problem with that? Oh, F*&^ing well. Your problem, deal with it.

You've managed to hijack this thread which was about kids, disorders, discussion, needing help, options, information, sympathy, and ADULT conversation and have managed to turn it into a b1tching match.

Good job.

Just because you dont agree with someone's opinion and/or vice versa dosnt automatically make your right and everyone else wrong nor does it give you the right to come at people so nasty.

I really appreciated this thread for its maturity. You, singlehandedly, have destroyed that.

Good. Job.



And what is so bad is for the most part, I agree with you in that in most cases (not all the time with every kid...everyone is different), children need to be TOLD during a confrontation. But the way you put it makes me want to argue with you!

 

[Bann]

Those are choices you give any child. Why is it a problem solving tacit with a problem child???

YES. I am just expressing my opinions. Do you have a problem with that? Oh, F*&^ing well. Your problem, deal with it.

Well I SAID it was a choice for any child in my first post agreeing with LT.

And you are a biatch in nearly every thread you inhabit. Hope you're having a nice life.

 

[Roberta]

Well I SAID it was a choice for any child in my first post agreeing with LT.

And you are a biatch in nearly every thread you inhabit. Hope you're having a nice life.

Hey, I just express my opinions and reply like everyone else here and I am the Bi*&^. If you don't like my input, put me on ignore. DIAF

 

[Bann]

]Hey, I just express my opinions and reply like everyone else here[/B] and I am the Bi*&^. If you don't like my input, put me on ignore. DIAF

Ooh, I should DIAF for my opinion? But yet you jumped all in someone else's shiat for expressing their opinion and replying like everyone else!