So how do you Democrats feel about this?

[vegmom]

But, wouldnt the Hyundai use less gas and parts and oil, things subject to sales tax?
I suppose I am just wondering if a sales tax is more equitable than some other forms, if the poor truly work at living within there means, and eschewing celphones, cable tv, finer clothes, junk food, yada...
Thanks for being civil, btw.
I consider 100k/yr salary to be rich.

You've obviously never owned a Hyundai. I think repair cost wise they are on par or just ahead of the Mercs. And many wealthy people (emphasis- wealthy as in on their balance sheet not income statement) actually keep their vehicles longer. As a matter of fact, the #1 vehicle amongst American millionaires is the Ford F-150 (in which case SoMD is another OC ).

A bare-bones cell phone is a necessity these days, especially if you drive long distances for work or have small children. Junk food and processed crap tend to be a whole lot cheaper than fresh produce and real whole wheat bread. Cable you can do without if you can get an amplified aentenna to work (like me) or live close in to DC, but alot of folks out this way can't get squat even with an aerial on the roof.

 

[cwo_ghwebb]

But, wouldnt the Hyundai use less gas and parts and oil, things subject to sales tax?
I suppose I am just wondering if a sales tax is more equitable than some other forms, if the poor truly work at living within there means, and eschewing celphones, cable tv, finer clothes, junk food, yada...
Thanks for being civil, btw.
I consider 100k/yr salary to be rich.

Ok, we got one person saying $100k per year is rich. That for the entire family or just one person? What percentage should this individual pay in taxes?

I disagree with Vegmom saying processed food is cheaper than preparing your own. When my wife was battling cancer and we lost her income, things got pretty darn tight with three kids. We've been there when you run outta oil and can only afford to put in $10 of kerosene in the tank.

I remember going to Murray's cause they had a two for one sale and we were counting our pennies. A couple of folks ahead of us in line paid for their steaks, potato chips, and other processed food with their "Freedom Cards", and had a few dollars left over. One went back to get another steak and told the other still in line, 'don't worry, the dog will eat it!"

Anyhow, back to tax policy. I suggest folks read Walter Williams or Thomas Sowell, two economists who put this issue into perspective clearly. Both can be read here: Townhall.com::Income Confusion::By Thomas Sowell

 

[Pete]

You've obviously never owned a Hyundai. I think repair cost wise they are on par or just ahead of the Mercs. And many wealthy people (emphasis- wealthy as in on their balance sheet not income statement) actually keep their vehicles longer. As a matter of fact, the #1 vehicle amongst American millionaires is the Ford F-150 (in which case SoMD is another OC ). .

That is why they are wealthy, they make smart choices.

A bare-bones cell phone is a necessity these days, especially if you drive long distances for work or have small children.

This is bunk. Cell phones are not a necessity they are a luxury. People had small children and drove long distances for hundreds of years without cell phones. In this country it is nearly impossible to be more than 50 feet from a telephone or a person with one if you need one for an emergency.

Junk food and processed crap tend to be a whole lot cheaper than fresh produce and real whole wheat bread.

More crap. For comparison a family of 4 go through the drive through at McDonalds (The cheapest place I can think of) it is going to cost at least $20 for 1 meal. 2 pounds of ground beef $3, a bag of buns $2, bag of McCain crispy fries $4, gallon of milk $4. Add on $1 for the energy to cook it and $1 for condiments you have $15. Clip a couple coupons and shop for specials and you can save more.

Now you are going to say $5 isn't even worth bothering but to me when someone is on TANF and food stamps that $2 is someone else's and you owe the generous society a greater degree of fiduciary responsibility. Add on the cost for gas to go get it, figure they are going to do it 150 days a year and we are talking $750 a year. If they hit KFC it would even be more.

Cable you can do without if you can get an amplified aentenna to work (like me) or live close in to DC, but alot of folks out this way can't get squat even with an aerial on the roof.

I am going to be mean and say too bad. I have no problem paying higher taxes to provide poor with food, housing and medical care but I am not going to tear up because they can't watch Star Wars II Revenge of the Sith on HBO. When I was growing up we lived in the sticks and got 3 TV stations, ABC, CBS and PBS. It was enough and when it was too boring we went outside or read a book which was free from he library.


In a nut shell we as a society through guilt or some other emotion have made being poor yet having everything everyone else has too damn easy. There is no incentive to do better, work harder, make more to get what they want because someone suffering from some bullchit case of guilt has determined they are entitled to it and gives it to them. We have been guilted or brainwashed into thinking fast food, cable TV, cell phones are needs and or entitlements. Give them breaks for daycare, home mortgages, food, shelter yes by all means but please stop rationalizing lazy shameless behavior.

Several on here have admitted being on public assistance at times and the "shame" they felt using their Independence Card at the store. This is because they had a core value that used to be inherent in Americans and that is self sufficiency. It shamed them to be in need of assistance so they got off it when possible. We have an entire culture that are devoid of this core value. They use public assistance as a lifestyle, they feel it is a life long entitlement, they are unashamed and have no intent of getting off. Couple this with guilt ridden liberals who heap more entitlements and you have 50% of the citizenry carrying the other 50% on their backs. This builds animosity and anger, promotes class warfare and in the end a taxpayer revolt that benefits no one.

What you are doing makes you feel warm and fuzzy but it is wrong and bad. To rationalize fast food eating, cell phone yakking, and cable TV watching as "needs" every American are entitled to is irresponsible and untrue.

 

[cwo_ghwebb]

That is why they are wealthy, they make smart choices.


This is bunk. Cell phones are not a necessity they are a luxury. People had small children and drove long distances for hundreds of years without cell phones. In this country it is nearly impossible to be more than 50 feet from a telephone or a person with one if you need one for an emergency.

More crap. For comparison a family of 4 go through the drive through at McDonalds (The cheapest place I can think of) it is going to cost at least $20 for 1 meal. 2 pounds of ground beef $3, a bag of buns $2, bag of McCain crispy fries $4, gallon of milk $4. Add on $1 for the energy to cook it and $1 for condiments you have $15. Clip a couple coupons and shop for specials and you can save more.

Now you are going to say $5 isn't even worth bothering but to me when someone is on TANF and food stamps that $2 is someone else's and you owe the generous society a greater degree of fiduciary responsibility. Add on the cost for gas to go get it, figure they are going to do it 150 days a year and we are talking $750 a year. If they hit KFC it would even be more.

I am going to be mean and say too bad. I have no problem paying higher taxes to provide poor with food, housing and medical care but I am not going to tear up because they can't watch Star Wars II Revenge of the Sith on HBO. When I was growing up we lived in the sticks and got 3 TV stations, ABC, CBS and PBS. It was enough and when it was too boring we went outside or read a book which was free from he library.


In a nut shell we as a society through guilt or some other emotion have made being poor yet having everything everyone else has too damn easy. There is no incentive to do better, work harder, make more to get what they want because someone suffering from some bullchit case of guilt has determined they are entitled to it and gives it to them. We have been guilted or brainwashed into thinking fast food, cable TV, cell phones are needs and or entitlements. Give them breaks for daycare, home mortgages, food, shelter yes by all means but please stop rationalizing lazy shameless behavior.

Several on here have admitted being on public assistance at times and the "shame" they felt using their Independence Card at the store. This is because they had a core value that used to be inherent in Americans and that is self sufficiency. It shamed them to be in need of assistance so they got off it when possible. We have an entire culture that are devoid of this core value. They use public assistance as a lifestyle, they feel it is a life long entitlement, they are unashamed and have no intent of getting off. Couple this with guilt ridden liberals who heap more entitlements and you have 50% of the citizenry carrying the other 50% on their backs. This builds animosity and anger, promotes class warfare and in the end a taxpayer revolt that benefits no one.

What you are doing makes you feel warm and fuzzy but it is wrong and bad. To rationalize fast food eating, cell phone yakking, and cable TV watching as "needs" every American are entitled to is irresponsible and untrue.

I'm glad we got some smart folks here who write well. Agree 100%

America's poor live far better than average citizens throughout the world. Travel a bit and you'll see it's true.

 

[Plan B]

I'm glad ... America's poor live far better than average citizens throughout the world. Travel a bit and you'll see it's true.

None of the above releives us of the responsibilities we have.
Getting along while we hash out these differences is the rub.

 

[Pete]

None of the above releives us of the responsibilities we have.
Getting along while we hash out these differences is the rub.

We are never going to get along when one side wants to give away more of our money willy nilly to an ungrateful segment of society.

We are never going to get along as long as one side wants to use our tax money to cultivate a permanently dependent constituency and keep them through fear the evil conservatives are going to take away their assistance.

 

[Plan B]

We are never going to get along when one side wants to give away more of our money willy nilly to an ungrateful segment of society.

We are never going to get along as long as one side wants to use our tax money to cultivate a permanently dependent constituency and keep them through fear the evil conservatives are going to take away their assistance.

Maybe so, if what you say is the true interpretation of both your fellow citizen's views, and you do not understand the matter at hand from bias, and without the facts.
Davy Crockett said, 'Just make sure, then go ahead'.

 

[Pete]

Maybe so, if what you say is the true interpretation of both your fellow citizen's views, and you do not understand the matter at hand from bias, and without the facts.
Davy Crockett said, 'Just make sure, then go ahead'.

Yea OK. We are never going to get along if you keep denying the clearly obvious.

 

[MMDad]

Maybe so, if what you say is the true interpretation of both your fellow citizen's views, and you do not understand the matter at hand from bias, and without the facts.
Davy Crockett said, 'Just make sure, then go ahead'.

How old are you? 14? Your opinions sound like they come straight from the mouth of a middle school Social Studies teacher.

You seriously need to expose yourself to the poverty you claim to champion. Hang out with the entitlement class. Visit the working poor who are trying to make a living.

Visit a couple of third world countries. Start with Mexico. Go to one of the border cities, like TJ. Observe the poor there who believe they are entitled to a free living. Then go south a while and observe the people who have less money, but have the pride to actually work for what they have.

I can't believe you have any knowledge of poverty beyond what you see on TV while sitting on your parents couch. You couldn't possibly be this ignorant if you had actually seen it with your own eyes.

Pete has seen it, that's why what he wrote is the truth. We will never convince you of that because you will have never seen the truth. Turn off the TV, leave the house, see the truth.

 

[AndyMarquisLIVE]

I am going to be mean and say too bad. I have no problem paying higher taxes to provide poor with food, housing and medical care but I am not going to tear up because they can't watch Star Wars II Revenge of the Sith on HBO. When I was growing up we lived in the sticks and got 3 TV stations, ABC, CBS and PBS. It was enough and when it was too boring we went outside or read a book which was free from he library.

I lived without cable, a cell phone and fast food. :shrug:

Actually, we didn't have a phone in our house when I was growing up. I had to use Hotmail behind my 28k free NetZero internet to write to my friends, either that or I had to write a letter

Cable.

DVD Player, nope. We had a 25 year-old television set hooked up to an amplified antenna. My sister, when she turned 15, had to work to help pay bills. We rarely went out to eat, and if we did, McDonalds was gourmet. All I had to look forward to at the end of the day was going to school the next.

That is why I am a registered Republican. They, not the Democrats, represent people like me and my family.

What people like Plan_B and the Democrats don't realize is that is very common in America. The Democrats have screwed the welfare system up so much that people like my family were ineligible for healthcare but the Welfare system bought my neighbor a brand new Mustang.

If it wasn't for the conservative Church, I don't know what we would've done. They helped us out a lot, gave us money to put food on the table. Did Democrats help? No.

It's liberals who have turned the welfare system into a matter of what color your skin is. It's Democratic policies that have created the suffering many American families have to endure.

The Welfare system allows people to live without working (see example: my neighbors). They make more money off welfare (enough to buy 2 Mustangs) than somebody who works 8-5 (and sometimes later than that).

That is why I will not vote for the Democrats. I've seen how (pardon the language) fukced up the Welfare system is.

Mr. Bush has done more for me and people like me than any Democrat. All the Democrats have done is personally insulted people like me (race fans) with their whole getting immunizations before the races that they attended on my tax dollar .

 

[Plan B]

If the state of welfare now, and in the past, restricts you voting habits, you are not keeping vital issues in perspective.
I am 52, married with kids and retired military, and grew up in Appallachian East TN with shoeless freinds. So forgive this old hillbilly's grammar and spelling. Disagree with this independant's views, but don't write that you know the issues if you are going to insult someone you don't even know, Please.
Clinton reformed welfare. Bush sent their kids to Iraq with deceit. Taxes are low for a blue state.

 

[Pete]

If the state of welfare now, and in the past, restricts you voting habits, you are not keeping vital issues in perspective.
I am 52, married with kids and retired military, and grew up in Appallachian East TN with shoeless freinds. So forgive this old hillbilly's grammar and spelling. Disagree with this independant's views, but don't write that you know the issues if you are going to insult someone you don't even know, Please.
Clinton reformed welfare. Bush sent their kids to Iraq with deceit. Taxes are low for a blue state.

Clinton "reformed" much to his distress at the point of the GOP spear led by Gingrich and the GOP controlled senate and house. If it were not for overwhelming pressure he would have never done it.