The Funny Thing about Jesus

[hooknline]

Oh this will tick some people off

When Jesus put forth the gospels through those chosen by God, he really understood his assignment and mission placed on his shoulders by God our father.

Have you ever really thought about the crown of thorns placed on Jesus at the time of his Glory? We as Christians know about Jesus as the savior for those who believe and to those who have fed on more than spirital milk will know about the crucifiction as the bridge that joins us sinners who repent from the heart back to our one an only God through his Son's Sacrifice which God Delighted in although through any fathers misory.

Have you ever thought more deeply about the crown of thorns? I consider the crucifiction as a bridge that cross over from sinful men back to a holy and just God who never stopped loving his Sons/Daughters only required justice first and mercy. When we cross over the crucified arms of Jesus to pin our sins on the cross and obtain (once Again) acess to our holy Father we can approach God from a true heart and pray to him through Jesus who works as any faithful son would in working for his fathers objective.

I know that Jesus had alot of hidden messages to those who believe only to reveal them at the proper time (as fitting). With the crown of thorns, have you ever thought of it as the center of the jouney across the Arms of Jesus (or shoulders) and as the half way point in which we pin our sins on the cross of our holy savior? I love the way God and his Son Jesus worked in forming their plan in the Holy Gospel.

 

[vraiblonde]

crucifiction

Is this a Freudian slip?

It's "crucifixion".

 

[VoteJP]

Mr Short-Bus.

When we cross over the crucified arms of Jesus to pin our sins on the cross and obtain (once Again) access to our holy Father ...

I love the way God and his Son Jesus worked in forming their plan in the Holy Gospel.

I say you misunderstand what side of the cross you and we are on.

Humanity's sins are not pinned on the cross along with Christ - no, our sins are included with humanity that executed an innocent man as a martyr.

The cross and the crown of thorns are to our shame and not to our credit.

It would be like praising the gun that shot JFK, as in praise the holy gun that murder the man.

The cross and all of its cruelties included are not to be praised nor glorified nor idolized.

 

[hooknline]

I think you need to do some more research JP. his death at calvary was for our benefit(the Grace of God knowing we fall short of his expectations). Climb on over and you will see.

 

[itsbob]

Is this a Freudian slip?

It's "crucifixion".

Actually it was a message.

The FSM is trying to communicate through him to humanity, he may well be the chosen one.. The GMB (Great Meat Ball)..

The FSM has spoken, the bible, Jesus, the crucifixion, Christianity, it's all built on fiction.

He has spoken, Marinara be his name. May his noodly appendage touch you, that you too shall be saved.

 

[hooknline]

I wrote this thread to other Christians as a discussion about the meaning of the cross (the spiritial meaning that is). The Crown of thorns also has meaning in my opinion and that is what I would like other believers to think about (in a spiritial way). Please don't take this thread out of context. Most Christians look at the cross as the link back to a perfect Just God through his Son. This is what I hope to discuss as Jesus had many parables and hidden meaning when he spoke (I like to think of it as hidden treasure). There is not one word from his mouth during his ministry on earth that did not have a future planned message. Remember he said "those who have ears let them hear" Every place that was recorded by his workers during his time on earth had meaning for those to come in the future (like us). When I heard Dr. Charles Stanley from In Touch Ministries years ago talk about the Cross and it being a bridge that brings us back to God (or allows our uproach in prayer to God) it made sense (in a spiritial context) and can be found through reading the old and new testament. My question to other beleivers is what about the Crown of thorns. Do you think God chose that on the Lord for more than suffering? I have wondered (thinking outside of the box and spiritially) if the crown placed on his head was the point where we surrender in our journey back to him.


variblonde - sorry for the mis-spell (unintentional)

Any who think Christianity is fiction might want to travel to Iran where they think the murder of 6 million Jews is fiction. Bobby

 

[Merlin99]

I wrote this thread to other Christians as a discussion about the meaning of the cross (the spiritial meaning that is). The Crown of thorns also has meaning in my opinion and that is what I would like other believers to think about (in a spiritial way). Please don't take this thread out of context. Most Christians look at the cross as the link back to a perfect Just God through his Son. This is what I hope to discuss as Jesus had many parables and hidden meaning when he spoke (I like to think of it as hidden treasure). There is not one word from his mouth during his ministry on earth that did not have a future planned message. Remember he said "those who have ears let them hear" Every place that was recorded by his workers during his time on earth had meaning for those to come in the future (like us). When I heard Dr. Charles Stanley from In Touch Ministries years ago talk about the Cross and it being a bridge that brings us back to God (or allows our uproach in prayer to God) it made sense (in a spiritial context) and can be found through reading the old and new testament. My question to other beleivers is what about the Crown of thorns. Do you think God chose that on the Lord for more than suffering? I have wondered (thinking outside of the box and spiritially) if the crown placed on his head was the point where we surrender in our journey back to him.


variblonde - sorry for the mis-spell (unintentional)

Any who think Christianity is fiction might want to travel to Iran where they think the murder of 6 million Jews is fiction. Bobby

Huh? why?

 

[VoteJP]

Mr Short-Bus.

I think you need to do some more research JP. his death at calvary was for our benefit(the Grace of God knowing we fall short of his expectations). Climb on over and you will see.

It is not a compliment nor praiseworthy to be forgiven or to be given grace or to fall short.

You preach such things as badges-of-honor when the exact opposite is the truth.

Consider a child when the parent gives that child the grace of forgiveness because the child has fallen short.

The child needs to straighten-up and stop the wrongdoing and that is when the honor and glory comes in.

Praiseworthy is when one does not need forgiven and does not need the grace and does not fall short.

 

[Zguy28]

Praiseworthy is when one does not need forgiven and does not need the grace and does not fall short.

Indeed this is true. Jesus was the only one who accomplished that. That's why he was worthy of being a propitiation for our sins.

 

[VoteJP]

Mr Short-Bus.

Indeed this is true. Jesus was the only one who accomplished that. That's why he was worthy of being a propitiation for our sins.

I guess that saying is okay for some people, but it seems to imply that people need not even try to do right and just accept being a sinner.

You might or might not mean it in that way, but it comes across that way in my perspective.

I have heard many Christians brag about being sinners and of falling short as I do believe that is the point of the original posting here - to hang more of our sins on Jesus as He can carry more, and that is not the point nor the message of the sacrifice of Christ.

To follow Christ as in be-a-Christian means to stop sinning and to stop needing forgiveness and to stop falling short.

 

[vraiblonde]

I guess that saying is okay for some people, but it seems to imply that people need not even try to do right and just accept being a sinner.

You might or might not mean it in that way, but it comes across that way in my perspective.

I have heard many Christians brag about being sinners and of falling short as I do believe that is the point of the original posting here - to hang more of our sins on Jesus as He can carry more, and that is not the point nor the message of the sacrifice of Christ.

To follow Christ as in be-a-Christian means to stop sinning and to stop needing forgiveness and to stop falling short.

 

[itsbob]

I guess that saying is okay for some people, but it seems to imply that people need not even try to do right and just accept being a sinner.

You might or might not mean it in that way, but it comes across that way in my perspective.

I have heard many Christians brag about being sinners and of falling short as I do believe that is the point of the original posting here - to hang more of our sins on Jesus as He can carry more, and that is not the point nor the message of the sacrifice of Christ.

To follow Christ as in be-a-Christian means to stop sinning and to stop needing forgiveness and to stop falling short.

OR you could just be a good person, and not be good for fear of retribution in the after life..

But not to worry.. the way you treated your family.. if there is a hell, that shall be where you spend eternity so it doesn't really matter how good or not you are..

 

[hooknline]

where do you read that I am writing it is OK to sin or do wrong JP?

Paul preached about this very issue when he said in Romans 10:10-11

When a Christian approaches God in prayer through Jesus Christ, his heart (truth) is being examined by God (do you not believe this?) No person can trick God when he is in prayer. The Cross (the suffering of Jesus) placed our sins (or mistakes) on Jesus through repentance and a change of direction in ones life. This is my understanding of what Jesus teaches me. If God is perfect and a God of Justice, how could any Man or Woman approach God in prayer if not through the Grace of God through the sacrafice of his only Son.
God requires Justice and if men and women are prone to mistakes and fall short of God's expectations of his will for our lives, how can anyone be saved if not through some payment of the mistake or correction of the mistake ? If that mistake or sin can not be reversed or corrected, how could one ever again approach a perfect and just God? God took care of this issue through his Grace of given his only son over as payment for our Sins (with a repentent heart) and we once again can approach God in prayer. this is my understanding of the meaning of Jesus sacrafice at Calvary. With that said, please understand my original post was a question to "Christian believers" about the reason behind the crown of thorns. (kind of a think tank or brainstorming) this is what my goal originaly was and you either refuse to see this or simply don't want to think about any possible other meaning of the crown of thorns.

 

[VoteJP]

Mr Short-Bus.

OR you could just be a good person, and not be good for fear of retribution in the after life..

That is the problem of viewing people as being "good" and or as justified by Christ, when the person(s) continue to fall short and needing more forgiveness and they continue to sin.

No one can be a "good person" unless they in-fact stop needing forgiveness.

As like the speed limit is 55 and most people travel 60-70 mph, so those people see themselves and each other as "good drivers" when in-fact they are not because they are falling short.

.. if there is a hell, that shall be where you spend eternity so it doesn't really matter how good or not you are..

There is no such place as hell, but I give others the benefit of doubt and so if there really were a hell then that is where I will go.

The reason being that I will fight and defy any such God or persons that would hurt and burn people in torture and so that demon of a God is my enemy now and ever after.

Of course I know that evil God does not exist and I can mock it without fear.

 

[VoteJP]

Mr Short-Bus.

where do you read that I am writing it is OK to sin or do wrong JP?

Paul preached about this very issue when he said in Romans 10:10-11

I do not see you connection to Romans 10:10-11, but I do see where the implication of putting more of your sins onto Christ (or on the crown of thorns or on the cross) means instead of stopping the sinning you are justifying the sinning by dumping the sins onto Jesus.

You do not directly say that but it is strongly implied in your words.

As like children playing in the yard and the child telling the other children it is okay to do some wrongs because their parents will forgive them and the kids can get away with keep doing the wrongs as they have no reason to stop.

And in-fact that is true because Jesus paid the price of sin completely in full so any sins today are forgiven by God (though not forgiven by our fellow man) and so in that case you can indeed dump more and more onto Christ.

We really are free to keep on sinning and to put the sins onto Christ but that is to our shame and not His, link = Hebrews 12:2 and Hebrews 6:6 and 1 Corinthians 15:34.

You will not burn in any mystical hell, but on earth in this life you will be lost by needing more and more forgiveness.

When a Christian approaches God in prayer through Jesus Christ, his heart (truth) is being examined by God (do you not believe this?) No person can trick God when he is in prayer.

God does not examine the messenger and thereby dismisses the message - no.

To attack the messenger and avoid the message is an evil process of the weak and debased.

In fact it is the messenger's job to make certain the prayer is correct and proper.

The Cross (the suffering of Jesus) placed our sins (or mistakes) on Jesus through repentance and a change of direction in ones life. This is my understanding of what Jesus teaches me.

That is fine, but it is hardly some thing to brag about.

It is a compliment to forgive - yes, but not a compliment to be forgiven, as it is righteous to not need forgiveness, or to no longer need it.

God requires Justice and if men and women are prone to mistakes and fall short of God's expectations of his will for our lives, how can anyone be saved if not through some payment of the mistake or correction of the mistake ?

If that mistake or sin can not be reversed or corrected, how could one ever again approach a perfect and just God?

Jesus gave justification and thereby justice, and Jesus paid the penalty in full completely, and there is no need to dump any more onto Christ.

Everybody gets saved on Judgment Day so God's expectations are complete and now is the time to put away the lingering evils of this world.

With that said, please understand my original post was a question to "Christian believers" about the reason behind the crown of thorns. (kind of a think tank or brainstorming) this is what my goal originaly was and you either refuse to see this or simply don't want to think about any possible other meaning of the crown of thorns.

The crown of thorns was not a symbol just as the cross is not a fitting icon, and those were Roman instruments of cruelty and barbarism.

Trying to give some high noble meaning to the instruments of murder is not the way of following Jesus Christ.

 

[hooknline]

I do not see you connection to Romans 10:10-11, but I do see where the implication of putting more of your sins onto Christ (or on the crown of thorns or on the cross) means instead of stopping the sinning you are justifying the sinning by dumping the sins onto Jesus.

You do not directly say that but it is strongly implied in your words.

As like children playing in the yard and the child telling the other children it is okay to do some wrongs because their parents will forgive them and the kids can get away with keep doing the wrongs as they have no reason to stop.

And in-fact that is true because Jesus paid the price of sin completely in full so any sins today are forgiven by God (though not forgiven by our fellow man) and so in that case you can indeed dump more and more onto Christ.

We really are free to keep on sinning and to put the sins onto Christ but that is to our shame and not His, link = Hebrews 12:2 and Hebrews 6:6 and 1 Corinthians 15:34.

You will not burn in any mystical hell, but on earth in this life you will be lost by needing more and more forgiveness.



God does not examine the messenger and thereby dismisses the message - no.

To attack the messenger and avoid the message is an evil process of the weak and debased.

In fact it is the messenger's job to make certain the prayer is correct and proper.



That is fine, but it is hardly some thing to brag about.

It is a compliment to forgive - yes, but not a compliment to be forgiven, as it is righteous to not need forgiveness, or to no longer need it.



Jesus gave justification and thereby justice, and Jesus paid the penalty in full completely, and there is no need to dump any more onto Christ.

Everybody gets saved on Judgment Day so God's expectations are complete and now is the time to put away the lingering evils of this world.



The crown of thorns was not a symbol just as the cross is not a fitting icon, and those were Roman instruments of cruelty and barbarism.

Trying to give some high noble meaning to the instruments of murder is not the way of following Jesus Christ.

This is my last post to you concerning this thread regardless of your reply.
I never said it was some idol or even implied. I wanted the opinion of "Christians" as to secondary meaning or their opinion of no secondary meaning (do you not know what "think tank" or "brainstorming" means?)
Jesus had "in depth meaning" to every action he did on earth during his ministry. Why should the crown of thorns be any different?

 

[VoteJP]

Mr Short-Bus.

This is my last post to you concerning this thread regardless of your reply.
I never said it was some idol or even implied. I wanted the opinion of "Christians" as to secondary meaning or their opinion of no secondary meaning (do you not know what "think tank" or "brainstorming" means?)
Jesus had "in depth meaning" to every action he did on earth during his ministry. Why should the crown of thorns be any different?

Hi "hook".

I say if you look this thread over then you might find that I am the one (1) that is trying to discuss your point and I am not trying to be unfriendly nor intolerant as I will do in some other cases.

What I said was "symbol" as in symbolic, and I did not call the crown as an "idol", and if I did see it as an idol then I would be happy to denounce that or insult you-and-it as such but I did not.

And if you see "symbol" as a synonym to an idol then I can accept that and I will try to not use that term - for this case.

My point was that there was no meaning to the crown of thorns as it was just an instrument of cruelty and of ignorance, and that Jesus did NOT give meaning nor deep meaning to that crown because that was a thing done to Jesus and not done by Jesus.

As my previous comparison then when JFK was shot then we can not give meaning to the rifle or to the bullet or to his blood in the car because those were done to JFK, link picture, and not his own doing.

I see the real meaning of the sacrifice of Christ is that Jesus defied His assassins in direct contempt of their vicious barbarism.

So the crown of thorns as like the wooden cross or the whip that beat Him or the spear that stabbed the side of Christ do NOT have any other meaning aside from their brutal and murderous purposes.

Jesus did not do the crown of thorns as that was done to Him.

 

[Marie]

We really are free to keep on sinning

<DIR>1Jn 1:8 If we say we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.
</DIR>

 

[ItalianScallion]

Have you ever really thought about the crown of thorns placed on Jesus at the time of his Glory? Have you ever thought more deeply about the crown of thorns?
I know that Jesus had alot of hidden messages to those who believe only to reveal them at the proper time (as fitting).
With the crown of thorns, have you ever thought of it as the center of the jouney across the Arms of Jesus (or shoulders) and as the half way point in which we pin our sins on the cross of our holy savior?

I never saw the crown of thorns as anything other than what is was: A crown, because Jesus claimed to be a king. The used it to cause Him more pain.
Why would there be any "center of our journey"? I don't see how we can measure it in any way, really...

 

[Dondi]

With the crown of thorns, have you ever thought of it as the center of the jouney across the Arms of Jesus (or shoulders) and as the half way point in which we pin our sins on the cross of our holy savior? I love the way God and his Son Jesus worked in forming their plan in the Holy Gospel.

I fail to see the coorelation. You're talking about arms and shoulders, not the head.

In the cross illustration, I can grasp the concept of a bridge. In fact, I have on occasion in witnessing used the illustration of two cliffs, with man on one side and God on the other, separated by a great chasm of sin, and the cross connecting the two cliffs as a bridge. But it really isn't the cross that connects us to God, it's Jesus. The cross only serves as a reminder that Christ died on it for our atonement.

Jesus, to my knowledge, never spoke anything about a crown of thorns. All it served to do was have the Roman soldiers make a mockery out of Jesus being King of the Jews. Same goes for the robe, for that matter. And it contributed to the wounds that poured out His blood. But if you see in the OT where they slaughtered the sacrifices, there were no significant meanings to the implements they used to kill the animals. They simply helped in carrying out the instructions.

On the other hand, Jesus did speak about taking up one's cross:

"Saying, The Son of man must suffer many things, and be rejected of the elders and chief priests and scribes, and be slain, and be raised the third day.

And he said to them all, If any man will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross daily, and follow me.

For whosoever will save his life shall lose it: but whosoever will lose his life for my sake, the same shall save it.

For what is a man advantaged, if he gain the whole world, and lose himself, or be cast away? - Luke 9:22-25"

Jesus often used visual images in His illustrations that people of the time would be familiar with. They have seen the Roman crucifixions take place outside the city and the grueling suffering associated with it. The cross conjours up images of the condemned criminals carrying their own cross bar up the hill to be nailed to it. It was an unpleasant burden and constant reminder of the fate that awaited them. No one witnessing such an event wanted any part of it. Yet it is this kind of suffering, self imposed if you will, that Christ instructs us to do, denying ourselves of the comfort zone we surround ourselves and into the face of danger and shame for the gospels sake, bearing the burden of the message of God into unknown territories.

Are we willing to subject ourselves to that kind of commitment for God? Are we willing to risk our lives for the sake of Christ, knowing that there is something better that awaits us? Or are we content to stay fishing?

The disciples learned this lesson the hard way.