To 2nd Amendment

[Larry Gude]

Yeah but...

That's not much different from Sharpton telling people to blame everything on white people.

We might be in the same book here but nowhere near the same chapter or verse.

There ain't no Americans to speak of, let alone folk hero's and leaders like Osama and Khomeini, stating as fact that Islam entering into the US is foreign, evil, corrupting and smells bad.

There is this attempt at moral equivalency that I find, frankly, nuts.

Al Sharpton ain't flown or ordered no planes into the Pentagon and nobody is pledging to kill and die for him.

 

[Tonio]

Al Sharpton ain't flown or ordered no planes into the Pentagon and nobody is pledging to kill and die for him.

Sure. In terms of the amount of evil he's caused in the world, Sharpton is nowhere near Khomeini's league or Bin Laden's league. I compared them to Sharpton just to show that all three accumulate power by manipulating people's anger and resentment. I think there's some moral equivalency in their greed for power and their disregard for their fellow human beings, but definitely not in what their greed and disregard has caused. Do you think Sharpton would have become a Khomeini or a Bin Laden if he had been born in the Middle East?

 

[Larry Gude]

And there is ths difference...

Do you think Sharpton would have become a Khomeini or a Bin Laden if he had been born in the Middle East?

He WASN'T. He is in the US.

I don't know if you meant to or not but you make the most excellent point; it is not a matter of whether or not their will be people of ill will. It is a matter of what's to be done with them.

Al grew up in the US and therefore could only get away with so much. He may well have become a terrorist or a religious leader that ruled by asserting his own glory had he lived elsewhere.

THAT is the inherent superiority of our culture; you're only going so far because the people still hold the keys to power. We mock our Presidents when we disagree with them. We banter politically. We have complete changes of government every fours years or so, peacefully.

Zaqarwi said it out loud; democracy is blasphemy to Islam. Now, Spoiled or others may come running along and say Zaqarwi is wrong. That Bin Laden is wrong, that the Ayatollahs are wrong. That Islam embraces the individual.

I say "Show me". Why are these people hero's and demi Gods? We lock ours up.

The power of westernization is that Al, whatever he might have become in another world, is just a race hustler here.

THAT is what they fear most. If you speak for God in your culture, if you are one of the chosen ones, westernization is a big first step.

Down.

 

[Tonio]

I don't know if you meant to or not but you make the most excellent point; it is not a matter of whether or not their will be people of ill will. It is a matter of what's to be done with them.

Al grew up in the US and therefore could only get away with so much. He may well have become a terrorist or a religious leader that ruled by asserting his own glory had he lived elsewhere.

THAT is the inherent superiority of our culture; you're only going so far because the people still hold the keys to power. We mock our Presidents when we disagree with them. We banter politically. We have complete changes of government every fours years or so, peacefully...

Why are these people hero's and demi Gods? We lock ours up.

The power of westernization is that Al, whatever he might have become in another world, is just a race hustler here.

That's the point I was trying to make. Islam and Arab culture don't create demagoguery, since all societies have demagogues. As I see it, the culture and religion just give the power-mad freaks the freedom to cause massive bloodshed and suffering. That's one reason I love American democracy. Unleashed demagoguery is thankfully rare here--one example is Rev. Jim Jones.

 

[Larry Gude]

I suspect we are entering a...

...horse and cart argument here.

Islam and Arab culture don't create demagoguery, since all societies have demagogues

Just as the US way gets credit of limiting, Islam must bear the burden for pormoting.

They do 'create it' in the same sense the Marine Corp 'creates' fighting men and Hollywood 'creates' actors and actresses.

In that same sense the climate in the colonies in 1775 'created' our founding fathers, thus, I'm looking for Islam to 'create' new leaders. They are there but they can't flourish unless they 'westernize'.

Maybe we should call it by another name...'liberalize', which is what it is.

So now, at least we 'mericans can all get along, right?

 

[2ndAmendment]

I suspect that many in the Middle East and elsewhere in the world see the U.S. as a place of drinking, gambling, sex, and violence. Why? Because the only experience they have with U.S. culture is not the average guy on the street but what they see in the movies or on the news. Either venue is as bad for depicting the United States in the worst light.

 

[Tonio]

I suspect that many in the Middle East and elsewhere in the world see the U.S. as a place of drinking, gambling, sex, and violence. Why? Because the only experience they have with U.S. culture is not the average guy on the street but what they see in the movies or on the news. Either venue is as bad for depicting the United States in the worst light.

You're right, especially about the movies. Most American movies that are shown overseas are action movies, because they don't require a lot of translation.

 

[hamsterfang]

I suspect that many in the Middle East and elsewhere in the world see the U.S. as a place of drinking, gambling, sex, and violence. Why? Because the only experience they have with U.S. culture is not the average guy on the street but what they see in the movies or on the news. Either venue is as bad for depicting the United States in the worst light.

I agree with you 100% on this statement. It is a shame that more negatives get across than positives.

 

[Hessian]

Moderate Moslems...in Berlin

http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=43304

Looks like "honor" killings of moslem women in Germany has topped 45.

But let's not get involved because only the "fanatics" do that.

 

[SamSpade]

I suspect that many in the Middle East and elsewhere in the world see the U.S. as a place of drinking, gambling, sex, and violence. Why? Because the only experience they have with U.S. culture is not the average guy on the street but what they see in the movies or on the news. Either venue is as bad for depicting the United States in the worst light.

Exactly. You should read the online translations of their newspapers. Unbelievable.