Toys for Tots rejects Jesus dolls

[Toxick]

The only command that Jesus give his followers to celebrate or memorialize is the memorial of his death. God isn't pleased with any observance that links Jesus with superstition. (Isiaiah 65:11,12)

In case anyone was wondering:

The REAL Isaiah 65:11-12 read like so:


11 But ye are they that forsake the LORD, that forget my holy mountain, that prepare a table for that troop, and that furnish the drink offering unto that number. 12 Therefore will I number you to the sword, and ye shall all bow down to the slaughter: because when I called, ye did not answer; when I spake, ye did not hear; but did evil before mine eyes, and did choose [that] wherein I delighted not.




And if you're going to try and misrepresent Biblical verses, you should be aware that the word "Jesus" doesn't appear in the Old Testament. I'm fairly certain that the word "memorialize" also doesn't appear there - but I wouldn't bet the farm on that.

And the prophet Isaiah most often refers to God as "the LORD" or "the LORD God" rather than just "God".

 

[Toxick]

It is generally believed by historians that Jesus had older siblings.

By which historians?

Its generally believed that he had younger siblings - And the bible specifically mentions 4 brothers and an indeterminate number of sisters.

And Mary and Joseph were already married before she got pregnant,

I'm not sure where you got this information either.

Can't you Jesus freaks use your logical mind for a few minutes instead of just buying what your parents fed you as a kid? It never ceases to amaze me the stuff people will believe.

What do you care what people believe?

And some of us were atheists at one point, and didn't become "Jesus Freaks" until after much study and contemplation.

But I hope that doesn't interfere with your "buying what your parents fed you as a kid" theory.

 

[itsbob]

Religion as a whole is a fabrication of man. Christmas is a fabrication of Sears and JC Penny.

Killing pine trees for no obvious reason then for decoration, buying presents for everyone because that's what you do.. Being nice, in the "Christmas Spirit" while if you were indeed a decent person, you'd be in the "Christmas Spirit" everyday, not just one month a year, not to be a good christian, but to ba a good person.

 

[Dondi]

In case anyone was wondering:


And if you're going to try and misrepresent Biblical verses, you should be aware that the word "Jesus" doesn't appear in the Old Testament. I'm fairly certain that the word "memorialize" also doesn't appear there - but I wouldn't bet the farm on that.

You're right. The word "Jesus" doesn't appear in the Old Testament. But then it wouldn't, would it, since "Jesus" is translated as "Joshua" in the Hebrew, which means the salvation of God.

 

[Dondi]

Religion as a whole is a fabrication of man. Christmas is a fabrication of Sears and JC Penny.

Sez U. But man is a fabrication of God.

And Christmas has been celebrated long before Sears and J.C. Penneys were even established. Besides, I thought it was Macy's who popularized secular Christmas.

Killing pine trees for no obvious reason then for decoration, buying presents for everyone because that's what you do.. Being nice, in the "Christmas Spirit" while if you were indeed a decent person, you'd be in the "Christmas Spirit" everyday, not just one month a year, not to be a good christian, but to ba a good person.

You are absolutely right. We need to have the spirit of giving 365 days a year. Which is a principle Christ taught:

"Give, and it shall be given unto you; good measure, pressed down, and shaken together, and running over, shall men give into your bosom. For with the same measure that ye mete withal it shall be measured to you again." - Luke 6:38

 

[Frank]

So now its Who Cares? i would say its the Fanatics who get all bent when EVERYONE doesnt share the same Fanatic beliefs, in making some arbitrarily picked date a holy day.

Does it matter? We don't do Thanksgiving and Easter on the precise date. And we move other holidays like Martin Luther King's birthday and Columbus Day to Monday so we get three day weekends out of them - and no one's complaining.

 

[itsbob]

Sez U. But man is a fabrication of God.

And Christmas has been celebrated long before Sears and J.C. Penneys were even established. Besides, I thought it was Macy's who popularized secular Christmas.





You are absolutely right. We need to have the spirit of giving 365 days a year. Which is a principle Christ taught:

"Give, and it shall be given unto you; good measure, pressed down, and shaken together, and running over, shall men give into your bosom. For with the same measure that ye mete withal it shall be measured to you again." - Luke 6:38

Man maybe a fabrication of God, I do believe in a higher power, but religion as a whole is a fabrication of man..

What's the difference between Sears, JC Penny, Wal-Mart and the Catholic, Baptist, Mormon churches?

They are all multi BILLION dollar corporations..

They all have a product to sell..

They all have billions if not trillions of dollars of assets...

They all have a sales staff.. (half of them don't get paid)

They all have CEO's COO's, presidents, etc. just by different names





Half of them get to do it tax free, year after year.

I wish they sold stock in churches.

 

[itsbob]

(RED) Toys for Tots rejects J... 12-14-2006 09:48 AM

That was mighty Christian of you, Thanks..




and Merry Christmas!!

 

[Dondi]

How do you get 100 million Angels? it says Multitude it could have been as many as 20 Angels.

I knew someone would ask this.

Luke 2:13-14 - "Suddenly a great company of the heavenly host appeared with the angel, praising God and saying,
"Glory to God in the highest,
and on earth peace to men on whom his favor rests."

Revelation 5:11 - "Then I looked and heard the voice of many angels, numbering thousands upon thousands, and ten thousand times ten thousand. They encircled the throne and the living creatures and the elders."

10,000 X 10,000 = 100,000,000 give or take thousands of thousands

This is the number of the heavenly host that is around the throne of God.

So now its Who Cares? i would say its the Fanatics who get all bent when EVERYONE doesnt share the same Fanatic beliefs, in making some arbitrarily picked date a holy day.

Not making YOU celebrate Christmas. But aren't you glad you have the holiday off? Be a little more appreciative, please. Us Fanatics gave you a vacation.

 

[Dondi]

Man maybe a fabrication of God, I do believe in a higher power, but religion as a whole is a fabrication of man..

What's the difference between Sears, JC Penny, Wal-Mart and the Catholic, Baptist, Mormon churches?

They are all multi BILLION dollar corporations..

They all have a product to sell..

They all have billions if not trillions of dollars of assets...

They all have a sales staff.. (half of them don't get paid)

They all have CEO's COO's, presidents, etc. just by different names





Half of them get to do it tax free, year after year.

I wish they sold stock in churches.

Man, I'm Baptist. Where's my bonus?

 

[ylexot]

So now its Who Cares? i would say its the Fanatics who get all bent when EVERYONE doesnt share the same Fanatic beliefs, in making some arbitrarily picked date a holy day.

Got an example of said "fanatics" getting "all bent when EVERYONE doesn't share the same Fanatic beliefs"?

 

[itsbob]

Got an example of said "fanatics" getting "all bent when EVERYONE doesn't share the same Fanatic beliefs"?

Muslims..

 

[ylexot]

Muslims..

I thought we were talking about Christmas and Christians :shrug:

 

[ylexot]

Did you miss the thread about the Muslim Congressman?

Or the threads and Posts about refuting the fact that the Founding Fathers were Christian? (some were, some may have been, alot werent)

And i cant find it now, but there was a thread about the Earth only being 5,000 years old, (and certain members posting its true) because thats as long as the Bible stretches back.

You seem to be singling out Christians. However, every belief has that same problem. Even atheists "get all bent when EVERYONE doesn't share the same Fanatic beliefs". I.e. Slotted, itsbob, and elaine. Of course, they will argue that their beliefs are not "fanatic"...but then, so do the Christians, Muslims, Scientologists, etc, etc, etc. Personally, I think it is the fact that they do "get all bent when EVERYONE doesn't share the same" beliefs is what makes them fanatics. But hey, that's me. If you disagree, I'll come to your house and beat you to a pulp (I'm just kidding...in case somebody can't figure that out)

 

[Dondi]

Definetly glad for the day off, but the original thread was about how terrible it is that Toys for Tots didnt accept a Jesus Doll, because they didnt think it was appropriate to give for ALL who celebrate Christmas (they have since changed that position).

The position of the person who gave the Jesus dolls was :



The fact that someone of another faith might not, ya know, actually want their kids playing with a Jesus doll, well, that never entered his mind, did it? Of course not.

This thread has so many twists and turns it's easy to get derailed.

But as to the OP, I will agree with you. Even as a Christian, I object to the Jesus doll. (Unless they can make one that can walk on water.)

 

[itsbob]

I thought we were talking about Christmas and Christians :shrug:

Sorry, I just pinged on the fanatics part..

 

[Frank]

Not singling anyone out, you asked for an example of Fanatics :shrug:

But there are examples a' plenty, muslims have already been mentioned, how about the Hindus/Buddhists who drench themselves with gasoline then turn themselves into human tiki torches for a political point?

I remember those during the Vietnam war - but there's actually one small difference. I don't really know what part of Hinduism and especially Buddhism that would encourage such behavior. At least with the Muslims, their own Scriptures say some of the things they do.

I was reading something about Muslims the other day - maybe it was some guy on C-SPAN radio, I don't remember - but they mentioned that to the Muslim mind, secularism really doesn't exist. The ideal government is one that is run by GOD, and not by man - and therefore, leaving Islam isn't just a religious choice, but a betrayal of your nation. It's treason. They just don't have the concept of religious tolerance in their vocabulary. The concept is as odious to many of them as, say, you allowing someone the freedom to practice pedophilia. You wouldn't. You'd want them shot.

 

[beerlover]

By which historians?

Its generally believed that he had younger siblings - And the bible specifically mentions 4 brothers and an indeterminate number of sisters.




I'm not sure where you got this information either.





What do you care what people believe?

And some of us were atheists at one point, and didn't become "Jesus Freaks" until after much study and contemplation.

But I hope that doesn't interfere with your "buying what your parents fed you as a kid" theory.

Are you going to tell me that you honestly believe the virgin birth story? There is just no possible way that's true. That's all I'm sayin'.

 

[Toxick]

Are you going to tell me that you honestly believe the virgin birth story?

Actually, I have no intention of discussing my beliefs with you at all.

I'm not here to argue about my beliefs. It's more than apparent that in doing so, all I'll get out of you is insults and mockery, and that's not my idea of a good time.

There is just no possible way that's true. That's all I'm sayin'.

If that was all you were saying then I would not have responded to you.

You said that historians generally say Jesus had older siblings. I asked which historians, because I've never heard that.

You said (presumably citing the same historians) that Joseph and Mary were married when Mary became pregnant... I've never heard historians say that either.

I then disputed your sanctimonious declaration that "Jesus Freaks" are just people who mindlessly bought into what their parents shoveled them as a kid.




I notice that you didn't address these points, and I have no desire to discuss my faith with you, nor explain myself to you. So I'll catch you on the flip side.

 

[itsbob]

You said (presumably citing the same historians) that Joseph and Mary were married when Mary became pregnant... I've never heard historians say that either.

.

OK, if they weren't married, then Mary was looking at being executed for being an adulteress.. if you were looking at being stoned to death, what kind of half baked story would you come up with to save your bacon? Almost good as the Southern "Lady" that got inpregnated by a black man when he got shot in the gonads during the Civil War.. amazing what you can get people to believe.