Withholding taxes...

[Larry Gude]

Do you think that if we, the people, had to write checks for all our taxes instead of them being taken out of our paychecks, withheld, and piggy backed on other bills (see your cable and phone bills or look at an airline ticket etc) that, on the whole, more people would actually pay attention to their elected reps and become more knowledgeable about how their money is being spent?


Yes vote means better engaged citizenry.

No vote means withholding makes no difference.

 

[Chasey_Lane]

No, and I think there would be a lot of delinquent tax payers.

 

[lnmarsh]

Yes and No. I agree with Chasey that people simply wouldnt pay. But if it were to be done like that, where taxes are something tangible, people would definitely pay more attention to who was getting elected.

 

[Tilted]

For the sake of expediency, can we broaden the poll to something like: 'End withholding and all other continuing policies that began under Roosevelt's reign?'

 

[kwillia]

No.

 

[Larry Gude]

For the sake of expediency, can we broaden the poll to something like: 'End withholding and all other continuing policies that began under Roosevelt's reign?'

If you mean Teddy and the soon to follow Fed, sure!

 

[Tilted]

If you mean Teddy and the soon to follow Fed, sure!

No, I mean Franklin - that's why I used the word reign, so it would be clear which one I was referring to. Teddy may have overseen some bad policy enactments, but he can't be said to have reigned as FDR did.

 

[Larry Gude]

No, I mean Franklin - that's why I used the word reign, so it would be clear which one I was referring to. Teddy may have overseen some bad policy enactments, but he can't be said to have reigned as FDR did.

I knew what you mean, as usual. I just wanted to get a shot in at Teddy because he is, in my veiw, far more revered than he earned.

 

[Tilted]

I knew what you mean, as usual. I just wanted to get a shot in at Teddy because he is, in my veiw, far more revered than he earned.

I know you knew, but I wanted to use the opportunity to take another shot at FDR by emphasizing the notion that he reigned for a period of time (but you knew that).

I don't disagree about Teddy.

 

[vraiblonde]

No, and I think there would be a lot of delinquent tax payers.

And I agree with you.

I'm not convinced the voting public makes the connection between taxes and spendy politicians.

 

[Bird Dog]

Do you think that if we, the people, had to write checks for all our taxes instead of them being taken out of our paychecks, withheld, and piggy backed on other bills (see your cable and phone bills or look at an airline ticket etc) that, on the whole, more people would actually pay attention to their elected reps and become more knowledgeable about how their money is being spent?

I been saying that for years. As an employer if I pay someone $1,000.00 per week I have to pay a total of approx. $1,200.00 for that employee per week.

The employee receives a take home check of about $750.00 per week. The employee feels they are only making $750.00 per week.

At the end of the year if they get a refund, the govenment gave it to them, not the employer in their mind.

I definitley think if they had to write a check to the Federal Government, the State of Maryland, Social Security, Medicare, State Unemployment Insurance,
Workmans Comp Insurance, it would definitly change the way they think about our government.

But, as previously stated they would all be deliquent, so the gov makes us employers make all their payments for them.

 

[Larry Gude]

I been saying that for years. As an employer if I pay someone $1,000.00 per week I have to pay a total of approx. $1,200.00 for that employee per week.

The employee receives a take home check of about $750.00 per week. The employee feels they are only making $750.00 per week.

At the end of the year if they get a refund, the govenment gave it to them, not the employer in their mind.

I definitley think if they had to write a check to the Federal Government, the State of Maryland, Social Security, Medicare, State Unemployment Insurance,
Workmans Comp Insurance, it would definitly change the way they think about our government.

But, as previously stated they would all be deliquent, so the gov makes us employers make all their payments for them.

First off, glad we agree!

Second, where does this common theme of fear of mass delinquency come from? Why will people not pay their taxes?

Late fees, the threat of garnished wages, lien on your home? Will there be some problems? Sure but, I don't get why it is so widely feared that, absent withholding, no one will pay. :shrug:

 

[SamSpade]

Do you think that if we, the people, had to write checks for all our taxes

We're a nation awash in debt, a substantial portion that consistently overdraws bank accounts, impulse shops and carries large balances on their credit cards - do you doubt for even a moment that people would fail to pay their taxes?

Worse, I think the majority of folks would - even if implemented - not do a damn thing, because they feel as some of my non-voting friends feel. They can't do anything about it. They might be aware of their tax bill, but it won't get them engaged. They'll ##### and moan, but - it won't go anywhere.

 

[SamSpade]

Sure but, I don't get why it is so widely feared that, absent withholding, no one will pay. :shrug:

Because you must only know people who pay their bills on time?

Or never had a roommate who failed to pay their share of rent, utilities or paid back what they owed you, because, well, you were just their roommate?

Or been part of a property owner's association, and find that 20-30% delinquency was common?

Or been in a club that had to fold, because no one paid? Or had to bail out a friend who, month after month, had HUNDREDS of dollars in overdraft fees?

Or done the taxes of hundreds of people who couldn't even get a savings account, because their credit was so bad?

Need I go on?

 

[vraiblonde]

We're a nation awash in debt, a substantial portion that consistently overdraws bank accounts, impulse shops and carries large balances on their credit cards - do you doubt for even a moment that people would fail to pay their taxes?

Worse, I think the majority of folks would - even if implemented - not do a damn thing, because they feel as some of my non-voting friends feel. They can't do anything about it. They might be aware of their tax bill, but it won't get them engaged. They'll ##### and moan, but - it won't go anywhere.

Yup.

#1, they don't pay their other bills - what makes us think they'd pay their taxes?

#2, they don't understand the correlation between government and taxation.

 

[SamSpade]

I already have several bills which are automatically deducted every month. If Uncle Sam did this to me, I'd do this immediately.

And some smart bank or employer would find a way to make this easier for people by offering it as a service.

And people would pay for it.

 

[Larry Gude]

Because you must only know people who pay their bills on time? LOL far from it!

Or never had a roommate who failed to pay their share of rent, utilities or paid back what they owed you, because, well, you were just their roommate?

Or been part of a property owner's association, and find that 20-30% delinquency was common?

Or been in a club that had to fold, because no one paid? Or had to bail out a friend who, month after month, had HUNDREDS of dollars in overdraft fees?

Or done the taxes of hundreds of people who couldn't even get a savings account, because their credit was so bad?

Need I go on?

I say a hardy 'so???'. I see the government as taking second place behind we, the people, not the primary position. I say the first step in no longer seeing government as our opponent is that we start treating it like it works FOR us, not the other way around.

 

[Larry Gude]

I already have several bills which are automatically deducted every month. If Uncle Sam did this to me, I'd do this immediately.

And some smart bank or employer would find a way to make this easier for people by offering it as a service.

And people would pay for it.

Good! Choice, not compulsory!

 

[vraiblonde]

Need I go on?

And like Social Security, those of us who are responsible and planned our finances would end up paying for those who pissed their money away.

Any idiot can look at their paycheck and see what was taken out in taxes. And most idiots at least realize that their employer matches their SS and Medicare payments. And a smaller number of idiots are aware that their employer pays both state and federal unemployment.

And, last but not least, the vast majority of idiots have access to a calculator so they can tot these numbers up. (We'll leave out all the other taxes they pay outside of payroll - that might be too much for most idiots.)

 

[Bird Dog]

Why would the Fed and State want to collect taxes from all the individuals when they already have businessmen doing the work for them. It also hides the amount of taxes the employee pays.

For the government it is a win win.
For the employers it is a lose lose.

When the Democrats raise taxes next year and our employees are taking less home, guess who the are going to complain to, the govenment or their bosses? Then they will tell us they cannot afford a cut in pay, but we did not cut their pay, the government did.