AOC - SAYS U.S. IS 'RUNNING CONCENTRATION CAMPS ON OUR SOUTHERN BORDER'

[Sapidus]

One could argue anything. That argument would be easily disproven, making the argument a really bad one.

It is not the same thing to be persecuted in your own country by your government for not being the right race, religion, or sexual orientation (you left out the other things like mental health issues people had that caused them to be incarcerated by their government) and breaking and entering a country illegally. There's just absolutely no validity to the argument that those are the same thing.

So, yes, you could argue it, but you'd easily lose that argument, so....



I'm not using Fox News, I'm using the US Citizenship and Immigration Services Website:

Asylum | USCIS

www.uscis.gov

Please provide the source of your information that states a person who legally applies for asylum without illegal entry into the United States is placed in detention centers, because that would be illegal and should be stopped immediately.



While I have both a secular and religious objection to mothers electively killing babies, I see no comparison to detaining law-breakers.

What is the empathetic thing to do, and why is that the right thing for taxpayers to fund?

So, is it your contention we should throw out the constitution and live under strict Judeo-Christian law? Or, are you trying (and failing miserably) to be edgy and provocative?

Are you stupid? I clearly showed my source for my claims and then you ask for the source of the claim?

What is actually wrong with you that makes you incapable of taking in and digesting information other than what the Trump administration says? ( do you know how many times he has lied in office? Even you admit that so why do you continue to blindly follow without doing any further research)?

It is because you are morally and ethically bankrupt and would rather turn blind eye to the mistreatment of people be they asylum seekers or people who entered the country illegally.

No one should be kept in cages without blankets and basic necessities and denied sleep no matter what. Even hardened criminals.

I don't know how you look at yourself in the mirror

 

[This_person]

Are you stupid? I clearly showed my source for my claims and then you ask for the source of the claim?

What is actually wrong with you that makes you incapable of taking in and digesting information other than what the Trump administration says? ( do you know how many times he has lied in office? Even you admit that so why do you continue to blindly follow without doing any further research)?

Oh, I'm sorry, your ONLY point of reference was a propaganda article? I thought you had something substantive. I should have known better.

That's not how the law works, so your article was wrong. YW

It is because you are morally and ethically bankrupt and would rather turn blind eye to the mistreatment of people be they asylum seekers or people who entered the country illegally.

No one should be kept in cages without blankets and basic necessities and denied sleep no matter what. Even hardened criminals.

I don't know how you look at yourself in the mirror

Agree that no one should be kept in cages and such....except, of course, every person who justifies being jailed. So, I guess I do NOT agree that people awaiting trial or post conviction should not be kept in cages. And, if I'm not mistaken, prisoners in many jails and prisons do purchase their own soap and toothbrush. Is it your contention that these people came to the United States with no ability to clean themselves, and have no personal soap or toothbrush?

 

[Sapidus]

Oh, I'm sorry, your ONLY point of reference was a propaganda article? I thought you had something substantive. I should have known better.

That's not how the law works, so your article was wrong. YW



Agree that no one should be kept in cages and such....except, of course, every person who justifies being jailed. So, I guess I do NOT agree that people awaiting trial or post conviction should not be kept in cages. And, if I'm not mistaken, prisoners in many jails and prisons do purchase their own soap and toothbrush. Is it your contention that these people came to the United States with no ability to clean themselves, and have no personal soap or toothbrush?

Court records and individual cases discovered by The Texas Tribune indicate that a number of asylum seekers who came to international bridges in Texas and California were separated from their children anyway

So now you believe court records verified by the Texas Tribune are "fake news" or "propaganda" because it doesnt align with what Trump and Fox News tell you.

Jesus you are so far down the rabbit hole its no wonder your moral compass no longer works

Can't wait till elderly racists like yourself die out a younger more tolerant and better educated generation takes your place.

Your god would be mighty disappointed in you ( hell any god would)

And yes many of these people come here with nothing not even a bar of soap. Is that really surprising to you that information?

 

[MiddleGround]

Hey Sapidus....

If our "concentration camps" are so evil. And they are the worst thing since the Nazis opened the doors of Auschwitz....

Why are so many people trekking thousands of miles to scale a fence/wall or swim a river to get into these horrible concentration camps?

Were the German Jews stripping and running to be next in line at the showers? Did they travel across kilometers from germany into Poland to climb the fences into Auschwitz?

I am interested in what you have to say to this...

 

[This_person]

Court records and individual cases discovered by The Texas Tribune indicate that a number of asylum seekers who came to international bridges in Texas and California were separated from their children anyway

Show me the court records - I believe the Service before I believe the website.

Your god would be mighty disappointed in you ( hell any god would)

Why do you refuse to answer whether or not we should be using Judeo Christian values to run the country or the Constitution, but you continually make religious comments? Have I said any of my beliefs on government should be based on religious beliefs, or are you just plain stupid?

And yes many of these people come here with nothing not even a bar of soap. Is that really surprising to you that information?

So, they are already establishing themselves as seeming to not need them, it would seem. I mean, how long have they been without?

 

[Sapidus]

Show me the court records - I believe the Service before I believe the website.

Feel free to do your own research for once. I have shown you much more proof then you ever do. All you do is flap your illogical gums.

Why do you refuse to answer whether or not we should be using Judeo Christian values to run the country or the Constitution, but you continually make religious comments? Have I said any of my beliefs on government should be based on religious beliefs, or are you just plain stupid?

I personally believe we have a responsibility to treat each person to the same ethical and moral standard and I don't believe your book or any book of fairy tales should guide anyone to do anything, Especially in a nation founded on the belief that we are all free to practice or not practice whatever religion we want.

I was pointing out yet another situation where you were hypocritical. You claim to be a godly person but follow only the "rules" of your chosen belief system that are easy for you

So, they are already establishing themselves as seeming to not need them, it would seem. I mean, how long have they been without?

So a dehydrated or starving person has established they don't need food so just let them die.

Again. Why do you make such stupid analogies and comparisons.


Its sad that someone so stupid gets to vote

 

[This_person]

So a dehydrated or starving person has established they don't need food so just let them die.

Are we talking soap, or are we talking food and water? Try to keep your goalposts in one position, please.

If the Trump administration is denying a person food or water, I'd like to hear about that.

You shall also love the stranger, for you were strangers in the land of Egypt.


Deuteronomy 10:19



The alien who resides with you shall be to you as the citizen among you; you shall love the alien as yourself, for you were aliens in the land of Egypt: I am the Lord your God.

Leviticus 19:34

So, is it your contention we should throw out the constitution and live under strict Judeo-Christian law? Or, are you trying (and failing miserably) to be edgy and provocative?



I really want an answer to this - why are you giving me Bible quotes; do you think we should live by the Bible?

 

[GURPS]

Where is your humanity?

Where is yours ? You prefer children dying in the desert ?

U.S. Border Patrol Finds 4 Bodies, Including 3 Children, Near Rio Grande In Texas

and you don't get to whine about children dying in custody, you voted against money for the problem
You should be asking why are there parents risking there lives on such a perilous journey ?

Trump said it is a crisis Democrats refused to do ANYTHING but posture and tell lies .... 144,000 people crossed the border last months a steady increase .... and those were the ones caught .... there are too many process in a timely manner - I know you just want all of them handed a court date and released, but that is NOT how the Asylum System Works they need to be detained until there application can be evaluated

Illegal Immigrants need be dis-incentivized from making the Journey

yeah scream ' but muh asylum seekers' well buck wheat the numbers are in 90% of them never show up for court hardly the actions of someone fleeing oppression and persecution and doing so 'following the rules'


.... then what ....

how do you get 144,000 away from the border


because that is what you get from this:

'Not One More Dollar': Even as Trump Postpones Raids, Ocasio-Cortez, Omar, Pressley, and Tlaib Vow to Oppose All Funding for 'Hateful Border Agenda'


No funding for border security ... yeah that wall wasn't the ONLY item


Washington Post Immigration Reporter:

Sounds a lot like what a nazi would say. "we gave them ample time to leave Germany, if they are still here they deserve to die"

Reductio ad Nazium - argumentum ad misericordiam - non sequitur - fallacy of irrelevance.

false cause
You presumed that a real or perceived relationship between things means that one is the cause of the other.

Have you not shame?

Ad Hominem
You attacked your opponent's character or personal traits in an attempt to undermine their argument.

The border is a port of entry you idiot. How many times do you need to be told that information?

Ad Hominem
You attacked your opponent's character or personal traits in an attempt to undermine their argument.

Its sad the lengths you continue to go to to convince yourself your moral and ethical decline is not directly attributed to Trump.

Ad Hominem
You attacked your opponent's character or personal traits in an attempt to undermine their argument.

Defrauded students to the amount at least $25 million dollars

Be Specific How Did Trump defraud ANYONE where and when was Trump convicted of Fraud in a Civil or Criminal Case

Declare he grabs women by the genitals before asking permission

Be Specific - Where was Trump accused of grabbing ANY Womyn by the Pussy or convicted of the same

Says it is ok to separate and cage children and then argues they need not be provide, blankets, toothbrushes or allowed to sleep

Because we should leave them in the desert to die ?

appeal to emotion
You attempted to manipulate an emotional response in place of a valid or compelling argument.


Side-by-side photos show migrant children locked up in cages under both Trump and Obama

I know it is difficult to UNDERSTAND but the Trump Administration is Continuing POLICIES and Procedures set down Under Obama

Refues to release his tax returns

Be Specific Where is Trump LEGALLY Required to hand out his Tax Returns - You have NO RIGHT to Trump's Tax Returns

and refuses to allow his employees to testify before congress.

Liar ..... Hope Hicks gave several Hours of testimony

Strawman
You misrepresented someone's argument to make it easier to attack.

And yet you somehow claim to be a religious person who believes their actions will lead them to heaven

Fantasy, Supposition, Innuendo and Unfounded OPINION

Ad Hominem
You attacked your opponent's character or personal traits in an attempt to undermine their argument.

How sad your god must be at your moral decline.

Ad Hominem
You attacked your opponent's character or personal traits in an attempt to undermine their argument.

You shall also love the stranger, for you were strangers in the land of Egypt. Deuteronomy 10:19

The alien who resides with you shall be to you as the citizen among you; you shall love the alien as yourself, for you were aliens in the land of Egypt: I am the Lord your God. Leviticus 19:34

Ah Yes .... So now the Hater of Religion Sky Monsters and Fairy Tale Books comes along quoting scripture in an attempt to look morally superior or push a narrative that we should all feel guilty of not supporting his Open Borders Philosophy

You know this continues to show what a HYPOCRITE you are Right

Whatever you need to do to convince yourself what is happening is ok. Whether you need to tell yourself its what you sky monster wants or whether you believe blindly following our president is the answer

And Here you go right back to the anti religious attacks

you are still a despicable human being if you believe what is happening is acceptable.

Out the window goes ANY pretext of conversation, tolerance and civility ..........

Ad Hominem
You attacked your opponent's character or personal traits in an attempt to undermine their argument.

Strawman
You misrepresented someone's argument to make it easier to attack.

Appeal to Emotion
You attempted to manipulate an emotional response in place of a valid or compelling argument.

Someone claiming asylum needs to do so once they step foot on US soil which is exactly what these peoplel are doing.

Nope ... they may file for refuge status from their HOME COUNTRY.


Now about the 90% that NEVER show up for their court date ?

 

[GURPS]

The situations are very similar which is why calling these Trump camps concentrations camps is apt.

Fantasy, Supposition, Innuendo and ASSUMPTION

NO it is not .....

1. Nazi Germany aressting citizens and sending them to Camps for Slave Labor and urder
2. Illegal Immigrants COMING to the southern border of their OWN Free Will - being detained until a determination can be made on their case NOT Murdered or forcerd to work as slaves

One could argue the jews, gypsies and gays and no place in Germany and got what they deserved for not leaving just as you argue these people get what they deserve for coming here.

Only someone clueless about History .......

 

[GURPS]

It is because you are morally and ethically bankrupt and would rather turn blind eye to the mistreatment of people be they asylum seekers or people who entered the country illegally.

No one should be kept in cages without blankets and basic necessities and denied sleep no matter what.

Jesus you are so far down the rabbit hole its no wonder your moral compass no longer works

Ad Hominem
You attacked your opponent's character or personal traits in an attempt to undermine their argument.

Strawman
You misrepresented someone's argument to make it easier to attack.

Appeal to Emotion
You attempted to manipulate an emotional response in place of a valid or compelling argument.

Can't wait till elderly racists like yourself die out a younger more tolerant and better educated generation takes your place.

Ad Hominem
You attacked your opponent's character or personal traits in an attempt to undermine their argument.

Strawman
You misrepresented someone's argument to make it easier to attack.

Your god would be mighty disappointed in you ( hell any god would)

Hypocrite You Do Not Believe in Fairy Sky Monsters

 

[Sapidus]

Are you stupid? I clearly showed my source for my claims and then you ask for the source of the claim?

What is actually wrong with you that makes you incapable of taking in and digesting information other than what the Trump administration says? ( do you know how many times he has lied in office? Even you admit that so why do you continue to blindly follow without doing any further research)?

It is because you are morally and ethically bankrupt and would rather turn blind eye to the mistreatment of people be they asylum seekers or people who entered the country illegally.

No one should be kept in cages without blankets and basic necessities and denied sleep no matter what. Even hardened criminals.

I don't know how you look at yourself in the mirror

Why must everything be explained to you like a toddler?


You said since these people came here without soap they must not require soap

To show you how dumb your argument was i asked whether a starving or dehydrated person would then not require food or water?

You would think to be consistent you would advocate these people have proper hygiene and sanitation since last week your straw man argument was these people would bring in diseases. We know by now you don’t believe most of the crap you say. It’s just parroted form Faux need.

 

[RoseRed]

They may not bring soap or toothpaste, but they sure have their phone chargers somewhere.

 

[SamSpade]

Damn if this thread isn't weird to read with all those folks on ignore.

These are not concentration camps. My grandfather spent 3 years in one and survived, albeit half the size he was when he arrived.
These are the Waldorf-Astoria in comparison. What exactly did these people live in on the way north? Motel 6?

They're detention centers. No one would need to spend more than a day in one, if there was enough funding or the laws
were changed to curb the flow of entrants. My son has camped in much worse accommodations, and he goes back to do it again.
Are children being given diseases, or are they being treated - or are there just too many?

So we have a problem - there's a couple very simple solutions - fix the laws so they may be turned back and wait.
Allocate more funding and hire more people - but that won't happen.

Or we could do it the Democrat way - f*** the laws - just turn 'em loose. Yeah. Just let 'em in.
Ring the dinner bell to ANYONE across the world - if you cross our southern border, you're just going to walk right in.

 

[Kyle]

Damn Gurps... You got Stupidus arguing with himself now!

 

[MiddleGround]

Hey Sapidus....

If our "concentration camps" are so evil. And they are the worst thing since the Nazis opened the doors of Auschwitz....

Why are so many people trekking thousands of miles to scale a fence/wall or swim a river to get into these horrible concentration camps?

Were the German Jews stripping and running to be next in line at the showers? Did they travel across kilometers from germany into Poland to climb the fences into Auschwitz?

I am interested in what you have to say to this...

Sapidus?? Still waiting....

 

[GURPS]

Are children being given diseases, or are they being treated - or are there just too many?

Some had preexisting conditions one got the flu, another had a heart ailment

the problem is their so many they cannot be processed fast enough - children are supposed to have 3 day stay and be forwarded on

remember Democrats refused to fund Border Security yeah including A WALL / Barrier .... so we have over crowded facilities put up during the OBAMA Administration .....


Deaths Of Children At The Border: The Rest Of The Story


In the first news report a 7-year-old Guatemalan girl died, “after being taken into U.S. Customs and Border Patrol Protection,” the story said. Her father dragged her on a 2000-mile journey from northern Guatemala. Her father stated she was in good health during the screening process. Her health deteriorated on a 90-minute bus ride to the Border Patrol station. She was immediately transported to a hospital. An autopsy report indicated that she died from sepsis, a bacteria found in her lungs, adrenal glands, liver, and spleen. I am not a doctor, but I can safely presume that she had that bacteria in her long before she hit the U.S. border.

In the second death, an 8-year-old boy, again from Guatemala died after being dragged by his father on a 2000-mile journey and illegal entry into the U.S. The media made a point of indicating that Felipe Alonzo-Gomez was the second child to die, “in Border Patrol custody.” The boy became ill and was treated by medical personnel in the U.S. including being hospitalized several times. The autopsy showed that his cause of death was from the flu.

In the third case, a 16-year-old unaccompanied migrant died after several days in intensive care at a children’s hospital in the United States. Clinicians observed no health concerns when he arrived at a shelter. He became ill the next day the story said and was taken to a hospital, treated and released. He did not improve and was hospitalized again and later died. The cause of death from the autopsy was that the 16-year-old died from a brain tumor.



There is another issue that the media conveniently leaves out. Asylum laws dictate that a person fleeing danger in their country of origin are to claim asylum in the first country they reach outside their own. For Guatemalans and Hondurans that would be Nicaragua, El Salvador, Belize or even Mexico, not the United States. President Trump has correctly labeled this a humanitarian crisis that is not of our making. We can’t allow somebody else’s problem to become our problem. These migrants illegally cross into the U.S. It’s a violation of U.S. sovereignty. It is a domestic and national security issue and a public health issue. It puts a strain on limited U.S. resources such as public health facilities, schools, and our welfare system.


More children arriving very sick at the U.S. border





Where Was The Media Outrage When 18 Migrants Died In Custody Under The Obama Administration?

 

[GURPS]

What the Viral Border-Patrol Video Leaves Out


Unsurprisingly, it is not that simple. Indeed, the hearing in the video was related not to actions taken by the Trump administration, but to a challenge of a 2017 ruling that the CBP under the Obama administration had violated the Flores Settlement agreement with its treatment of children in custody. The judge in that case cited specific infractions that she felt were in violation of the “safe and sanitary” requirement under the Flores agreement and recommended a special monitor be appointed to ensure these facilities were complying with the original standard. The DOJ attorney in the video, Sarah Fabian, was not arguing that the United States should decline to provide those items to children, but rather that the Flores Settlement agreement didn’t specifically require those items. The notoriously liberal Ninth Circuit judges disagreed with this argument, preferring to read Flores narrowly. Fabian has been arguing similar cases on behalf of the Justice Department for years; that is her job. Some of her legal arguments have upset immigration advocates before. But they have never led to this type of media coverage, or to the claim that her fulfilling her legal role is indicative of a moral shortcoming.

Predictably, the vast majority of the people and the outlets that shared this exchange failed to note that the violations being discussed had occurred during the previous administration, while those who did know failed to ask themselves (and others) why the violations didn’t receive similar coverage when they were first exposed. Instead, they jumped straight to the conclusion that the federal government, headed up by President Trump, was deliberately inflicting pain on babies. This isn’t true.

It wasn’t true during the Obama administration either. Then, as now, the violations weren’t part of an intentional or evil ploy, but were the product of the system’s being overloaded. Then, as now, the intended care at these facilities was humane, and consistent within the requirement under Flores. In 2014, the Obama administration was dealing with a serious crisis: a large influx of unaccompanied minors that strained the facilities. In 2019, the Trump administration is dealing with a serious crisis: a large influx of unaccompanied minors that strains the facilities. In consequence, across multiple years and multiple administrations, the DOJ has repeatedly argued in court that the Flores Settlement agreement should be read narrowly, or allow for exceptions in difficult times. Certainly, governments make mistakes. Certainly, some facilities have taken shortcuts, as the result of either bureaucratic incompetence or limited resources. But those infractions will be fixed by additional funding, additional facilities, better oversight, and quicker processing, not by pretending that the president is a tyrant. The situation at the border is a difficult one, but selective outrage based on misleading facts won’t do much to address it.

 

[This_person]

Why must everything be explained to you like a toddler?


You said since these people came here without soap they must not require soap

To show you how dumb your argument was i asked whether a starving or dehydrated person would then not require food or water?

Oh, I see, you're saying my argument that them not bringing soap and toothpaste on a thousand+ mile trek shows they don't seem to choose to think they "need" it because they didn't have it themselves is the same thing as saying they must mean they don't need food if they're hungry. A stupid argument, because the implication of your argument/analogy back is that I'm saying if someone does not have a Bugatti it proves they don't need a Bugatti, whereas your position would necessarily be that if they don't have a Bugatti that proves they need it.

Neither of those is actually true - it doesn't mean they don't need food if they're hungry, and it doesn't mean they do need a Bugatti if they don't have one. Just like it doesn't mean they need food by virtue of not having it.

Soap is a pretty important thing for hygiene, but if they don't already have it then they probably don't value it the way our culture does. Food, on the other hand, is not a cultural thing - it is a requirement for existence.

I just don't understand why the Democrats in Congress felt the need to not properly fund to supply things like this.

You would think to be consistent you would advocate these people have proper hygiene and sanitation since last week your straw man argument was these people would bring in diseases.

A lot of diseases have nothing to do with hygiene. But, I'm guessing you are an anti-vaxxer if you don't think their lack of proper medical records and previous treatment status is a concern for us. You know vaccines are important, right? And, you know they don't have the same level of vaccinations we do, right? So....which side are you on - vaccines are good and important, or vaccines don't matter?

We know by now you don’t believe most of the crap you say. It’s just parroted form Faux need.

You know a lot that isn't true, don't you? I don't parrot anyone's form, and the faux need here is the one for them to come here illegally.

 

[This_person]

You shall also love the stranger, for you were strangers in the land of Egypt.


Deuteronomy 10:19





The alien who resides with you shall be to you as the citizen among you; you shall love the alien as yourself, for you were aliens in the land of Egypt: I am the Lord your God.


Leviticus 19:34

So, is it your contention we should throw out the constitution and live under strict Judeo-Christian law? Or, are you trying (and failing miserably) to be edgy and provocative?

 

[MiddleGround]

So, is it your contention we should throw out the constitution and live under strict Judeo-Christian law? Or, are you trying (and failing miserably) to be edgy and provocative?

HEY!!! Wait your turn. Sapidus still needs to answer my question