Bush decries border project

[sleuth]

I don't see how this is any different than a "Neighborhood Watch" program. It didn't say they were hunting them down, only monitoring them via aircraft and reporting them to INS.

 

[2ndAmendment]

because he doesn't want a bunch of ordinary citizens using their own judgement in deciding when and where to shoot people coming across the border. Could it be that he'd prefer our Homeland Security folks get their act together with regard to the Mexican and Canadian borders?

None of them have been shot or even shot at. They have been reported to the Border Patrol who often have done nothing about it. Bush apparently does not want Homeland Security or anyone involved. If the feds wanted it stopped, it would stop.

All we need for the liberals to be reinvigorated is to have a bunch of rednecks gunning down a bunch of wetbacks and posing for pictures next to their field-dressed carcasses hanging from mesquite trees on the border.

Again, no shooting taking place except with cameras.

 

[2ndAmendment]

Stupid question--would anyone object to a 50-foot wall along the entire border, with military patrols along it?

Not me. But where they have built walls, the illegals have dug tunnels, so .... Reminds me of the Berlin wall only there, we dug lots of the tunnels.

IF we just enforced the immigration laws, this would stop or at least be severely curtailed. Find an illegal, deport them immediately, period. If you can't find their family, so what, deport them anyway. Let the family find them. Sounds harsh, but it is time for tough measures to put an end to this invasion and it is an invasion.

 

[2ndAmendment]

This is still going on.



I have just signed a national petition urging our elected officials to do everything in their power to Secure Our Borders and stop the flow of illegal aliens entering into our nation.

This is an issue of national security that demands your immediate attention. Please click below for more information:

http://www.grassfire.org/42/petition.asp?PID=7603800&NID=1

Please consider taking action with me.




For more information, please read below.


+ + +
Special Petition Alert from Grassfire.org Alliance
+ + +

With the President's new "temporary worker" plan unveiled, it is time the American public respond and let our elected officials know that "We want our borders secure!"

That is why Grassfire.org has launched this petition to "Secure Our Borders." It calls on our leaders in Congress and President Bush to make stopping the flow of illegal immigration the first priority BEFORE any other reforms are even considered.

+ + 100,000 Citizen Petitions Needed

Over the next 30 days, Grassfire is urging citizens from across the nation to take immediate action with us by signing our petition to "Secure Our Borders":

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This issue poses a very real threat to every man, woman and child living in our nation, and demands attention. That's why Grassfire wants to rally 100,000 citizen responses at double speed.

We want our elected officials to know that the American people are demanding action NOW to stop the flow of illegal immigration.

Once we reach our target goal, we will deliver these petitions to the White House and key elected officials--demanding they make the issue of illegal immigration a NUMBER ONE PRIORITY this year.

Unless strong, decisive action is taken, the flow of illegals into our nation will only increase, and further threaten the lifestyles of American citizens.

+ + Let them know where you stand.

The time has come for Americans to stand united against programs that reward illegal activity. It's time to tell our leadership we want real action and real results.

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Thanks for taking action with us.


Grassfire.org Alliance

P.S. This is a total grassroots effort whose success depends wholly on you. After signing this petition, please alert your friends, family, and co-workers, letting them know that Grassfire is standing up for secure borders and a secure nation!

Thanks for your help.

 

[ylexot]

Done!

 

[somdcrab]

And, PS, Mr. President, you're overstepping your boundaries and creating a dangerous precedent by getting involved in the Terri Schiavo situation.


What the hell has gotten into him????? Wanting to let illegals come waltzing into our country unfettered is supposed to be what Democrats do, not Republicans. I'm trying to figure out his angle on this illegal immigration thing and it's just not coming to me.

if he has'nt relapsed and is into the sauce again he ought to or is he really that chit simple :shrug: :shrug:

 

[Sparx]

And, PS, Mr. President, you're overstepping your boundaries and creating a dangerous precedent by getting involved in the Terri Schiavo situation.


What the hell has gotten into him????? Wanting to let illegals come waltzing into our country unfettered is supposed to be what Democrats do, not Republicans. I'm trying to figure out his angle on this illegal immigration thing and it's just not coming to me.

What's gotten into him? It's just a matter of you waking up and seeing the things a majority in 2000 and a SLIGHT minority in 2004, of Americans have been seeing in him for over 4 years.

 

[dems4me]

What's gotten into him? It's just a matter of you waking up and seeing the things a majority in 2000 and a SLIGHT minority in 2004, of Americans have been seeing in him for over 4 years.

 

[Toxick]

What's gotten into him? It's just a matter of you waking up and seeing the things a majority in 2000 and a SLIGHT minority in 2004, of Americans have been seeing in him for over 4 years.

I just coughed and vomitted at the same time, and now my nose burns.

 

[2ndAmendment]

What's gotten into him? It's just a matter of you waking up and seeing the things a majority in 2000 and a SLIGHT minority in 2004, of Americans have been seeing in him for over 4 years.

You should love him now. I'm sure he said to himself, "Self, Sparx doesn't like me, so I'm going to do a bunch of it doesn't make any sense liberal stuff."

 

[Larry Gude]

My note to the Big Cheese

Dear President Bush,

The fact that US citizens in our Southwestern States have decided the illegal immigration invasion of our nation is bad enough for them to take time from their busy lives and take action to report to the authorities when they see likely illegal activity is sign enough that the illegal situation is bad enough.

That criminal gangs are now boldly and publicly threateing the lives of these law abiding citizens makes the situation intolerable. Is there worse indictment of the job we're doing on the borders than international CRIMINALS expressing concern about law abiding citizens threatening their illicit trade?

My fellow citizens know the situation in their towns and counties. I trust their judgment based on the actions they are willing to take and risks they now face for trying to PROTECT our nation.

My God sir. Help them! Don't condemn them!

Sincerely,


Larry Gude
Middletown, MD

 

[Tonio]

According to the first article I saw about the Minutemen, they are not taking the law into their hands nor are they "gunning down wetbacks". They are just patrolling and reporting illegal border crossers to the Border Patrol (the proper, yet short-handed authority). They even have several private pilots and will be partolling from the air as well...not quite deserving of anyone's ire.

I wasn't thinking of the Minutemen specifically, but I have seen mentions of other groups in Arizona shooting people trying to cross. Don't know if that's accurate. In the case of the Minutemen, I still say INS ought to officially deputize them--they have good intentions.

 

[alex]

I wasn't thinking of the Minutemen specifically, but I have seen mentions of other groups in Arizona shooting people trying to cross. Don't know if that's accurate. In the case of the Minutemen, I still say INS ought to officially deputize them--they have good intentions.

The news outlets were reporting that this organization helped Border Patrol arrest 18 people just over the weekend. Way to GO!

 

[Tonio]

Not me. But where they have built walls, the illegals have dug tunnels, so .... Reminds me of the Berlin wall only there, we dug lots of the tunnels.

Then should we go a step higher? Close down the border altogether? Turn the border into a Korea-style DMZ with land mines and barb wire and Army snipers in watchtowers?

 

[2ndAmendment]

Then should we go a step higher? Close down the border altogether? Turn the border into a Korea-style DMZ with land mines and barb wire and Army snipers in watchtowers?

I don't think we want to go there. Of course the Berlin Wall and the East Germany border were set up to keep people from escaping East Germany. Different purpose altogether.

There is a bill before Congress that mandates no driver licenses or benefits for illegal aliens. If that could be passed and the INS actually deport illegals as soon as they are caught, then maybe some of this would stop. I don't think we should just shuffle them back across at the nearest crossing either. Put them on a plane to Mexico City. Let the Mexican Government figure out how to get them home. Then maybe the Mexican government would quit publishing the boarder crossing guide to help their citizens cross our border illegally.

 

[Tonio]

2A, do you think some of this would stop if US employers faced criminal penalties for hiring illegals, such as 5 years in prison? I wouldn't separate it by "knowingly hired" verses "not knowingly hired", because that would probably get pleaded down to the lesser offense.

 

[Bruzilla]

I've seen quite a bit of video footage of these guys doing their thing, and they are all armed. While I'm sure they aren't hitting the trails to shoot up an illegals, I'm also sure that it's just a matter of time before someone accidentally shoots someone else.

I think that Bush is opposed to closing the borders because he has a better understanding than most of what would happen if we only allow legal immigrants in. That would mean that all of the positions held by illegals would then be held by legals, who would demand, and receive, higher wages, which would increase the costs of produce and domestic services. Also, while many folks are wanting illegals to pay for the services (schools, police, fire, etc.) that they use by paying income taxes, they fail to realize that 99% of illegals don't work at jobs that pay enough to get them past the earned income tax credit range. So not only would these people not pay any taxes, they would also put a severe drain on the EITC pot.

 

[Tonio]

Bruzilla, that makes a lot of sense.

I haven't even thought of the issue from an economic standpoint. I've only thought about it from a security and image standpoint. What message do terrorists get when the US can't keep a even friendly border secure? Do you think that makes the US look weak and helpless?

 

[ylexot]

I've seen quite a bit of video footage of these guys doing their thing, and they are all armed. While I'm sure they aren't hitting the trails to shoot up an illegals, I'm also sure that it's just a matter of time before someone accidentally shoots someone else.

I think that Bush is opposed to closing the borders because he has a better understanding than most of what would happen if we only allow legal immigrants in. That would mean that all of the positions held by illegals would then be held by legals, who would demand, and receive, higher wages, which would increase the costs of produce and domestic services. Also, while many folks are wanting illegals to pay for the services (schools, police, fire, etc.) that they use by paying income taxes, they fail to realize that 99% of illegals don't work at jobs that pay enough to get them past the earned income tax credit range. So not only would these people not pay any taxes, they would also put a severe drain on the EITC pot.

So what we effectively have is a class of people that don't get minimum wage, EITC, etc...a sub-lower class. I'd rather kick them out and get rid of the EITC and minimum wage. I have no problem with immigration and I think the system should be revamped to make it easier to process application. However, I do have a problem with illegal immigration. Should we allow illegal activities if it benfits us? I don't think so.

 

[Bruzilla]

I think that the whole idea that securing the border with Mexico is going to slow down or stop terrorists is shear stupidity. There is no way, no way, to prevent anyone wanting to attack the United States from getting here no matter how many border guards you have. The old Soviet Union had border controls that would make the most ardent supporters of stricters controls in the US pass out from joy if they were implemented, yet smugglers, spies, and just regular folks penetrated the borders all the time. There is no defense that anyone can put into place that can't be analyzed and overcome by a determined enemy. That's why the only way to win a war against terrorists is to kill them in place, i.e., before they come over here.