Coat Color Studies Aid Health Research, Breeding C

[Robin]

Country Lady

Here is the words that came out and somewhat started this.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Robin
In your words I am translating you are breeding because of color and what sells?

In my own words:
I am a breeder, who takes that responsibilty to heart. It's a title i wear proudly.

I am also an analyst. I analyze market trends, so that the "product" i eventually produce, is marketable. Why else do it?

This is a common thing in color oriented breeds, paints, Appys, etc. A solid appy, or breeding stock paint will sell for less, or take longer to sell than a high colored one to the average consumer, who wants that Appy or paint BECAUSE they want the color. It's a reality, and not one that I created.

The associated colors in this breed - chocolate, red chocolate, silver buckskin, etc. are achieved because of the silver modifier, and are in high demand. The silver modifier is linked to a genetic disorder.

SO...if I put the two together (true responsible breeder + market analyst) for me anyway, it equals finding a better way to produce what sells easily.
__________________

The toughest horses turn out the best riders.
Quiet Valley Farm

 

[fredsaid2]

Well, you got me. I bow to your abundant ability to Google. Me, I have no interest in breeding. Yes, I am ignorant about most of its aspects. What I do know is what I like. Most of us can pick out the quality animal over the less desirable one. The well put together conformation creates a very pleasing picture with little to nothing out of balance. My point - yours and Happy's breeding attempts have yet to create that 'wow' factor in a horse. Breed is irrelevant, quality shines. So, when you guys come full bore w/ ‘color makes it better’, I say ‘quality makes it better, color is a bonus’.

 

[Cowgirl]

It would be this gelding, born at Persimmon Creek Farm (thank you Percy!) April 2007, out of my foundation bred mare, Moon Dancer.

He's in KY and will be certified in the next few months, he's racking nicely now.

No WOW factor eh? OK... everybody is entitled to their opinion.

So he's 2 and a half?

 

[Phyxius]

So he's 2 and a half?

 

[Cowgirl]

Yes, as is typical for the breed. He isn't working, only being ridden lightly, and will be certified when his gait is well set which will take (for him) between 6 and 12 months by being ridden this way. You don't know how they gait under saddle and how long it will take to set until they are ridden.

The breed requires that they be certified by age 4. It takes some of them 2 or 3 years to develop appropriate muscle memory and become set in gait, and some never do, hence breeding choices must be made according to natural ability of both parents in order to produce an animal that gaits naturally and doesn't have to be conditioned into it for so long.

That sucks. You'd think the people who set the rules for them to be certified by age 4 would realize there is a good possibility of joint damage resulting from early riding.

 

[CountryLady]

That sucks. You'd think the people who set the rules for them to be certified by age 4 would realize there is a good possibility of joint damage resulting from early riding.

These horses aren't running down a track full throttle nor are they worked to death jumping. They are ridden lightly. The gait isn't hard on their joints like others are.

 

[CountryLady]

 

[CountryLady]

AGAIN

Color should not be the sole objective of a breeding program. There are breeds that are considered by some “color breeds” for instance, Appaloosa, Buckskin, Champagne Horse, Cleveland Bay, Dominant Gray, Friesians, Norwegian Fjord Horses, Paint, Palomino, & Pinto. While some of these actually are color breeds (i.e. registered solely due to color), others are breeds with distinct physical characteristics and/or pedigrees that also usually have distinctive or colorful coats. They might be considered a color breed by some folks but technically they are a pedigree-based breed. Some think that the Rocky Mountain Horse is a color breed. It is a pedigree-based breed that put conformation, temperament and gait first. The RMH also have some of the most impressive color that I have ever seen. That is just a BONUS!

This is a common thing in color oriented breeds, paints, Appys, etc. A solid appy, or breeding stock paint will sell for less, or take longer to sell than a high colored one to the average consumer, who wants that Appy or paint BECAUSE they want the color. It's a reality, and not one that I created.

Appys and paints are a PEDIGREE BASED BREED, with Paints given a little more latitude to where their breeding stock comes from. i.e. To be eligible for registry, a Paint's sire and dam must be registered with the American Paint Horse Association, the American Quarter Horse Association, or the Jockey Club (Thoroughbreds). At least one parent must be a registered American Paint Horse. To be eligible for the Regular Registry, the horse must also exhibit a minimum amount of white hair over unpigmented (pink) skin. See Phyxs QUOTE Below.

*Pinto not paint. Paint is a breed. Pinto is a color.

The associated colors in this breed - chocolate, red chocolate, silver buckskin, etc. are achieved because of the silver modifier, and are in high demand. The silver modifier is linked to a genetic disorder.

There are many colors in this breed. With all the base colors subject to several modifiers/dilutes, such as Crème, champagne, silver, dun. There are also roan, gray, etc… Too many to list here. Yes, Silver has been linked to ASD somehow and I am sure research is being done as we speak to find out exactly why.

 

[Robin]

CountryLady

AGAIN




Appys and paints are a PEDIGREE BASED BREED, with Paints given a little more latitude to where their breeding stock comes from. i.e. To be eligible for registry, a Paint's sire and dam must be registered with the American Paint Horse Association, the American Quarter Horse Association, or the



There are many colors in this breed. With all the base colors subject to several modifiers/dilutes, such as Crème, champagne, silver, dun. There are also roan, gray, etc… Too many to list here. Yes, Silver has been linked to ASD somehow and I am sure research is being done as we speak to find out exactly why.

O.K. Why are you quoting what happy said to my post to you??????

 

[CountryLady]

O.K. Why are you quoting what happy said to my post to you??????

What?

 

[Robin]

you did

an article on (realitively) new ASD research is here:
http://www.biomedcentral.com/1471-2156/9/88

psssst having a senior friday moment

 

[Robin]

we could use one of those in this thread.
thanks for giving her the opportunity to have one!

R we cool?

I am always cool

 

[Robin]

Happy I was quicker than you

 

[CountryLady]

SIGH!

Happy and Robin I guess I should have had an extra cup of Joe this am.




I was quoting Robins post from: 10-09-2009, 12:16 PM

 

[persimmoncf]

Nope, I don't take an opposing position on purpose (that's suicide by forumite on this board ). I've always maintained my position(s), and I'm not the argumentative one in this (or any) thread by a long shot. I've had a number of phone calls and pms between yesterday and today thanking me for the informative posts in here and also expressing fear of consequences if they replied publically, which is quite sad, but also true.

I believe that adults should be able to disagree without making it personal, but on here, behind the monitor, when they run out of real ammunition...the personal (or in this case a chosen breed!) attacks begin.

You won't find a post by me anywhere on this forum that attacks a person. An issue, yes, but never a person. Thats why I've been married for almost 30 years and we're still great friends.
I didn't mean for it to sound like I was arguing with you. I was trying to bring the thread back on track so I quoted you and asked "Is breeding for color a bad thing?" then i went into the origin of a color based breed specifically mentioned in the thread.

You are the one person who has commented in the thread whose face I can't remember...but i will someday.

thats about the biggest crock of crap I have ever heard. Too bad I cant sight the thread to show your lies cause it magically when poof

You really need to just shut your endless trap.

 

[tallyhoe]

you are all insane. I amazed at all the horse people I have met in my life they all know it all. usually the shorter someone has been in to horses the more they think the know. they feel the need to prove themselves by acting like dominating azzes. i can think of plenty around here that havent been into horses long but they talk a big talk. sound like anyone?

 

[Robin]

you are all insane. I amazed at all the horse people I have met in my life they all know it all. usually the shorter someone has been in to horses the more they think the know. they feel the need to prove themselves by acting like dominating azzes. i can think of plenty around here that havent been into horses long but they talk a big talk. sound like anyone?

welcome back!

 

[Phyxius]

Phyx when at what age did Devine start Paso's Hurricane Katrina fillies? or Devine, you can answer that one.

Oh wait, I found it..they turned 2 in Sept of 07, and they were backed backed by March of '08 at 2 1/2. Doing lots of stuff by that following April same age as mine....
http://forums.somd.com/horses/132746-s-about-time.html

http://forums.somd.com/horses/136551-todays-diosa-pics.html

This is common practice for horses who don't weigh as much as a Volkswagon when they're grown.

Soooo what were you saying Phyx?

I was saying it was pretty darn funny that you're expert who has been doing this for 30 some odd years but the oldest horse you're the breeder of is only 2.5 years old. And it's funny that according to you your stallions are 4 and a yearling. But, hey I guess we have different ideas about quality. You've still not yet educated us on what it is that rockies are supposed to look like or move like. Visuals!

While each individual horse is different regardless of breed I would start a horse ground driving at 1-2 years of age. Then, if they're ready light walk-trot as a three year old. Begin cantering at four. My experience in starting horses is with warmbloods. There is a reason there's a minimum age limit at dressage shows for the horses. While many of them are heavier than my stallion I don't think they're as heavy as a VW. My stallion weighs a bit under 1400pds. My mare who is a different, heavier breed is shorter and weighs 1600pds. As both were originally used for driving neither was started undersaddle until age 6.

The weight of the horse is not a determining factor in when a horse should be started undersaddle. Bones and joints are.

 

[BlissfulJumper]

• "I think you mean peanut roller! Has nothing to do with shuffling appaloosas. Has everything to do with how showing horses can really take a turn for the worse. Let’s torture our horse with running reins, draw reins and tie-downs and unnecessary crap. People try to make these peanut roller Quarter Horses with their heads dragging down on the ground instead of having their head alert and looking like they know what they're doing. No horse can travel with his head down between his legs. THIS IS ONE OF THE NEGATIVE INFLUENCES OF SHOWING!!!!!!!!!! Not to mention if you have ever been to a Susan Harris or Peggy Brown clinic they would tell you that you are tearing the horse up if you practice this forced technique. I am assuming by you comment, you were a bit confused as to the definition of “Peanut roller”."

Sorry but I must be one of those peanut roller people. How about you come down to my house tomorrow, ride my mare who's head is level at the poll, rounds her back, uses her hind end to move, and not stay heavy on the front end and you tell me how hard it is to get it right. Just because our horses have low heads doesn't mean they aren't paying attention, trust me they are!

It is much more comfortable for a horse when they round their back and use their hind( any knowledgable horse person will say that) have a head that is to high or behind the verical causes the horse to hollow its back which isn't a good thing. Level poll incase you don't know means having a straight line fron hind to ear. I'll attach a photo of a level or clost level poll so you can notice. It's actually more work to have a horse properly do this and a rider also. Most draw reins and such really aren't used when you go out to Breed shows they are there as a reminder. But most Anti-QH people just assume everything and talk sh!t about use.

Let me tell you too, I use to be a jumper until recently and I like doing both but my new QH training as helped me in the hunter ring.

Oh, and before you even ask.. I DO BELIEVE IN INJECTIONS when it is needed for a heavy show horse since it HELPS preserves the joint now!

 

[persimmoncf]

It would be this gelding, born at Persimmon Creek Farm (thank you Percy!) April 2007

Dont thank me for past foolish kindness