Disrespect

inkah

Active Member
Unfortunately, it almost becomes a babysitting gig. I can't imagine having going through this without the help of other family members and even a couple of her true friends. I can't even tell you how many people I threatened to ensure her safety. I wasn't ####ing around, this was it. We weren't losing her to the low-lives and the drugs they were pushing. 4 years sober.

Babysitting. I know it well. This was your daughter?

For me it was a spouse. Not someone I was physically stronger than and not someone I had authority over (not an excuse b/c trust me, I tried) The babysitting was so draining...tough to relive. I never knew what to do with the dealers, but I would have done just about anything. Still would.

Hug her for me? I am so jealous.
 

vraiblonde

Board Mommy
PREMO Member
Patron
Quite literally. I am one tough cookie. But they broke me. And I battle my hatred and disgust for them and all enablers to this day.

But what I did...it didn't work either. Like hank said, I NEEDED a team.

(Ok where is the sobbing smilie?)

Have another hug :huggy:

And that's the way it goes sometimes. At some point the addict (or criminal) has to want to change - you can't do for them. Family, support, treatment, love - it's no guarantee of success.
 

mamatutu

mama to two
This thread has been quite informative, and revealing. That is why I became a member, and will continue to be one. One can never have too much information. Rest in peace, person/subject of this thread. We never really knew you. You are in the arms of God, now.
 

Hank

my war
I NEEDED a team.

I can't even stress how crucial this is! Honestly, witnessing the people that had no such thing affected me and took a toll emotionally. I really ended up wanting to help everyone. I left that whole situation with a new found respect for people who choose in helping people as a profession.
 

Hank

my war
Babysitting. I know it well. This was your daughter?

For me it was a spouse. Not someone I was physically stronger than and not someone I had authority over (not an excuse b/c trust me, I tried) The babysitting was so draining...tough to relive. I never knew what to do with the dealers, but I would have done just about anything. Still would.

Hug her for me? I am so jealous.

No, not my daughter. It's hard and I totally respect what you are or were going through. Like I said, I know it was tough on her, but it was equally tough on us.
 

inkah

Active Member
Glad I happened this way tonight. And thanks for sharing so openly.

Tough love is TOUGH. But I will never do it any other way with or without a team. I pray I never have to.

For you enablers out there. #### you.
 

Hank

my war
Glad I happened this way tonight. And thanks for sharing so openly.

Tough love is TOUGH. But I will never do it any other way with or without a team. I pray I never have to.

For you enablers out there. #### you.

Hey, if you ever need any insight on the subject, please feel free to message me. I won't bite.
 

acommondisaster

Active Member
That's not the way they - and most people in pain - see it unless they've had some really good counseling. Try being an adult who was repeatedly raped by the deceased as a child, then see this outpouring of grief and keening over what a "good person" he was. Especially if it were by people who knew of the abuse and did nothing to stop it. It would take a very strong person to not want to set that record straight.

I can see where it would be cathartic to get something like that off your chest if you were the victim listening to everyone talk about what a good person the deceased was. But the way I read the original post, it seemed that it was based on people churning up dirt just because they could; just because they had access to the police blotter or knew of the person.
 

acommondisaster

Active Member
Have another hug :huggy:

And that's the way it goes sometimes. At some point the addict (or criminal) has to want to change - you can't do for them. Family, support, treatment, love - it's no guarantee of success.

The manipulative addict in our lives would cry and confess and beg to get help everytime things got bad. And we'd whisk them away to the help du jour - outpatient, 4 months inpatient, psychological, NA, whatever we could find. We were always so thrilled that they were ready to quit, to be functional, to stop spending everyone else's money. We justified it by saying we had to help because of the kids. It cost us dearly and we'll be forever affected by the amount of help we gave.

It's been 6 months clean now; it took a broken down vehicle on the side of the road at midnight and the admonishment that they had no more chances; we were going back to their house and taking their spouse and kids back to Maryland and leave them on the side of the road if they didn't clean up. They have. They don't have a dime to spare, unlike times when we paid their rent, their food, their kids birthday presents - because we didn't want to upset them and have them revert to drugs out of frustration. It's day to day, and it's hard to see them struggle with bills, but it's working. That and changing phones with them. Good grief, the number of phone calls I've gotten from "friends" wanting to "help" them if they were "sick". Tempted to turn in the numbers, but I'm afraid for our safety.

And the thing is, to get this back to the topic. I know my addict's failings. If something horrific were to happen to them tomorrow, it would hurt like hell to hear about what a dirtbag they had been in the past. Even though none of you really matter.
 

mamatutu

mama to two
It is easier to be judgmental, than to be tolerant. Tolerance takes up much more energy. One never knows when darkness will cast its shadow on one's own/family life, and, then, where does that leave you, if you have been disrespectful to others?
 
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vraiblonde

Board Mommy
PREMO Member
Patron
I can see where it would be cathartic to get something like that off your chest if you were the victim listening to everyone talk about what a good person the deceased was. But the way I read the original post, it seemed that it was based on people churning up dirt just because they could; just because they had access to the police blotter or knew of the person.

Well, some people are just busybody aholes. I don't know who Hoover is referencing; I was only giving one possible reason.
 

Railroad

Routinely Derailed
Addiction is an incurable disease, regardless of the thing the addict is addicted to. The whole family and the true friends are affected by it one way or another, despite the best efforts of the addict to the contrary. And even when the object of the addiction is removed, it's useful to remember that the drugging or drinking (or other addictive behavior) is a symptom and not the root problem. The sickness remains and must be treated, though it can never be cured. And it does take a team - better stated, a family - to participate in the life-long process of recovery.

We don't vilify someone who comes down with cancer and dies; the things a cancer patient does are less damaging to others than the things the addict does. But in both cases the sickness is just as real.

Having been through the hell which is being a family member or close friend of one who is addicted, mentally ill (the terms are synonymous), the survivors and participants have given more than one expects, or should ever have to give. When the torture comes to an end, those people are left with healing of their own to do. And they need support every bit as much as their loved one did.

Rape is a special case, because the victim is irrevocably damaged and changed by the experience. I don't know of anything that could be said or done to fix that hurt. Rape victims will always know what was done to them, and will always have some dysfunctions that were caused by the rapist. Though the anger is in some cases replaced in time by sadness, I don't see how any honors bestowed on the rapist can do anything but grate upon and tear open old wounds in the victims. As Vrai said, setting the record straight is very hard to resist. It can be done, but the cost is incredible.

But, scarred though we may be, life doesn't end with the horrible effects of evil in our lives. Might as well seek to enjoy what's left, and leaving the past behind is a key step in doing so. Beating the dead memory is a waste of energy better spent on making new ones.
 
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ZARA

Registered User
I am amazed at the disrespect some people have for the families of deceased. I have had several acquaintances killed this month either by motor vehicle accidents or by long suffering of cancer. In their online postings, "a certain poster" has posted and has gone out of their way to dig up their background. Also felt the need to post it publicly. I guess, because they are "Anonymous" they feel they can dig these peoples past and post it publicly even though it has happened numerous years ago. I don't understand how people can do this to other people and their families they don't even know. How unspeakable horrid this is to their families to have to relive this when they are going through and burying a loved one, especially after loosing them in a tragic accident. Then to have their past mistakes relived and posted for the PUBLIC to read under the accident report. Its amazing how little it takes to amuse people. All I can say is SHAME on you.

I'm sorry for your losses and I can understand your distaste for the actions of others that you deem improper.

It's kind of a double edge sword. I will use my own life as an example so you understand what I mean.

My bio-father died last year. He was not a good man and I refused to allow him to know anything about me or my life. I tracked him over the years and kept tabs on him so I always knew where he was. (I do the same with my bio-mother)

He was a mean alcoholic, thief, physically abusive, verbally abusive, and schizophrenic. I also think he was a child molester, although I have no proof. Now, all these things that made him a bad person, he never once did to me except steal from me. I watched him beat my bio-mother to a bloody pulp and tried to kill her. I was 2. I remember every second from the beginning to the end when the cops put the cuffs on him as if it were yesterday. I remember the blood curdling screams my bio-mother made and how they turns into mushy gurgling sounds. Some times I wish my memory wasn't as good as it is.

Now, fast forward to last year because I don't feel like over sharing, but now you have an idea of what he was like.

He was living at his mother's homestead and dying. He was suffering from complete liver and kidney shut down due to his severe alcoholism. He died in August and my one Aunt whom I allowed in my life the year before called me crying and telling me he was dead. She said she was sorry that she didn't tell me before that he was dying. I asked her why and then followed with, "It's better that you did not tell me. I knew he was dying and it would serve no purpose for me to be there. He was a bad person and never a dad. What am I suppose to do? Say sweet loving words before he died to make him feel better?" She did not take offense to my words because she is a lot like me, rather cold and very much a realist. She knows her younger brother was a F* up.

Now, I spoke to my Gma also after his death. He was her baby and that damn woman would do anything for him. Which is why she was never a part of my life until he died. But to her, I did not speak plainly. To her, I said the few good things he did do for me. I do not see the point in hurting an old woman any more than she is already hurting.

I do not mourn his death. I do not revel in his death. I am relieved that he is dead because he is no longer fighting the demons he harbored his whole life. His mental illness was not his fault and I know that. But his inability to overcome his weaknesses was his fault. I feel nothing for him, no sadness, anger, empathy, sympathy, nothing. Just relief that he is no longer suffering.

Soo...The way a person is remembered depends on how the person lived their life and how they affected the lives of those around them. My Gma will always love her youngest son that she buried and I have never loved my father. Same man. Lived one life. Affected 2 people differently.

:shrug:
 

Railroad

Routinely Derailed
I do not mourn his death. I do not revel in his death. I am relieved that he is dead because he is no longer fighting the demons he harbored his whole life. His mental illness was not his fault and I know that. But his inability to overcome his weaknesses was his fault. I feel nothing for him, no sadness, anger, empathy, sympathy, nothing. Just relief that he is no longer suffering.

Soo...The way a person is remembered depends on how the person lived their life and how they affected the lives of those around them. My Gma will always love her youngest son that she buried and I have never loved my father. Same man. Lived one life. Affected 2 people differently.

:shrug:

Well said. :yay:
 

dontknowwhy

New Member
And the thing is, to get this back to the topic. I know my addict's failings. If something horrific were to happen to them tomorrow, it would hurt like hell to hear about what a dirtbag they had been in the past. Even though none of you really matter.

And this is where you're wrong. To the victim, they matter very much... They didn't matter when they were robbed. They didn't matter when they found drugs on their property that the addict put there without concern of them losing it to forfeiture. They didn't matter when lost a loved one years before to somebody else"s callous act.

I didn't matter to you or your little eff up before but I'm gonna make sure you know the FULL EXTENT of the damage your little eff up has done in life...

Some of us, who might be harboring some sort of long term hate or pain call this closure...it's kinda necessary to move on in life
 

bilbur

New Member
I am amazed at the disrespect some people have for the families of deceased. I have had several acquaintances killed this month either by motor vehicle accidents or by long suffering of cancer. In their online postings, "a certain poster" has posted and has gone out of their way to dig up their background. Also felt the need to post it publicly. I guess, because they are "Anonymous" they feel they can dig these peoples past and post it publicly even though it has happened numerous years ago. I don't understand how people can do this to other people and their families they don't even know. How unspeakable horrid this is to their families to have to relive this when they are going through and burying a loved one, especially after loosing them in a tragic accident. Then to have their past mistakes relived and posted for the PUBLIC to read under the accident report. Its amazing how little it takes to amuse people. All I can say is SHAME on you.

First I would like to say that I wish people would stop referring to a person's crimes as mistakes. A mistake is grabbing sugar when you thought it was salt and what criminals have done is make a conscious decision to commit a crime and by calling it a mistake it is an attempt to diminish what they have done to a victim. As for the ones that bring up the criminals past, the family and friends should try and not let it bother them. I have a couple of people in my family that have done things in their past and if they die and someone brings up their past I would not care. This does not change the person I know them as. Even if someone posts lies about someone I love who has died it does not bother me because the ones that truly know that person know the truth. The only true way to ensure that nothing bad is said about you or a loved one when they die is to live a clean life which is not that hard to do.
 

vraiblonde

Board Mommy
PREMO Member
Patron
And this is where you're wrong. To the victim, they matter very much... They didn't matter when they were robbed. They didn't matter when they found drugs on their property that the addict put there without concern of them losing it to forfeiture. They didn't matter when lost a loved one years before to somebody else"s callous act.

I didn't matter to you or your little eff up before but I'm gonna make sure you know the FULL EXTENT of the damage your little eff up has done in life...

Some of us, who might be harboring some sort of long term hate or pain call this closure...it's kinda necessary to move on in life

Nice post :yay:

Tutu said in one post that stolen things can be replaced, and that's true. What cannot be replaced is the fear and sleepless nights caused by the robbery. When my house was robbed, replacing what was taken took a couple of days. But I dozed on my couch for the first two weeks after because I was afraid to be in my bedroom where I couldn't hear someone break in. I was afraid to leave my house for fear someone would break in while I was gone. Two and a half years later, it still affects me and I still feel a low-level dread.

So thieves take much more than money and a few items. And that was just a robbery, not a death or physical assault. Like Bilbur said, they are crimes - not mistakes.
 

MarieB

New Member
Nice post :yay:

Tutu said in one post that stolen things can be replaced, and that's true. What cannot be replaced is the fear and sleepless nights caused by the robbery. When my house was robbed, replacing what was taken took a couple of days. But I dozed on my couch for the first two weeks after because I was afraid to be in my bedroom where I couldn't hear someone break in. I was afraid to leave my house for fear someone would break in while I was gone. Two and a half years later, it still affects me and I still feel a low-level dread.

So thieves take much more than money and a few items. And that was just a robbery, not a death or physical assault. Like Bilbur said, they are crimes - not mistakes.


The feeling of being violated.
 

MarieB

New Member

It's a "funny" feeling

Though I'm sure it was nothing like you are feeling, but I even felt that way when my car was broken into, not once but twice. Having the police at your door at 3am because your doors are wide open and your personal belongings strewn about is unsettling. It happened to also be not long after I had my second child and I was particularly forgetful. I had my camcorder in my glove box, and i forgot to take it out. I didn't often take video, so a tape would last a long time. I lost 2 tapes of the kids, and that can never be replaced. It still bothers me to this day. They could have left the tapes.

Another time someone stole a case of beer from our garage fridge in broad daylight. I did not report it, and when I mentioned it to the police during the car incident they said that's a mistake and that people often escalate their actions. I had no idea that it was actually a felony.
 
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