Does this make you happy, too?

[~mellabella~]

The Church is not a private place and I do not see how anyone can honestly say otherwise.

We do not knock at the Church door but just walk right in.

Also many funeral possessions have police escort with lights and sometimes sirens going down the public highway as a public display, and many people still pull their cars over out of public respect for the deceased.

Calling a funeral at the local church then local cemetary as a "private" event is just not being honest or realistic. I say this is the real issue because if the "protesters" were cheering happy sayings and nice signs then it would be a "public" funeral.

The only demand to stop the protest is because it is denouncing the person and it is a religious effort.

The protesters have the right to free speech and free expression of their religion and if the funeral does not like it then the funeral needs to be done in private and not in the public arena of public Church, public streets and public cemetary.

I will be shocked if the higher Court does not overturn that un-American decision.

The police escort is not done for the public's benefit. Its done so that LARGE funeral attendees can stick together on the way to the cemetary. And most funerals are called private ceremonies with friends/family of the deceased only. But when you die, let me come protest outside of your funeral about all of your ridiculous political musings and how you deserved to die because you don't believe the same as I do. I'll even hold a sign saying "Thank God for dead would-be politicians." Would that be ok in your book? Seeing as how its not a private ceremony, and my free speech shouldn't be overridden by respect for your family's grief.

 

[residentofcre]

Yes exactly, that would be a secretive and private funeral.

I know the Mormons have a private Church (sancuary) where only members can enter,

but the vast majority of Churches and religious buildings are open to the general public.

Princess Diana had a public display and then a private service and it was performed quite well. The funeral is not on the side of the road - it is the protesters are on the side of the road and outside the Church building and at the cemetary.

This is saying that the protesting is illegal like a protester on the side of the road with a sign and screaming decent is not allowed.

That, I say, is un-American. Private property and federal property does not mean it is secretive property and the public has every right to look and scream inside under the first amendment.

There is little privacy in my back yard and in a gov building they must close the door and oftentimes lock the door to get any secrecy and even then the snitches inside will often expose the hidden privacy to the public.

I have even heard of protest at Arlinton National cemetary where the grave was dug up and the body moved to another cemetary to settle down the protest. If the protest is not trying to incite a riot then it would be a poor excuse of a protest.

It is the funeral that is imposing on the right to protest and particularly their religious protest.

Those were nonviolent protest and it did provoke an unjust response so I say that protest was a success so far.

Does it make a difference that this "church" seems to be making a statement about "the end is near... repent" rather than protesting the war.

From what the spokeswoman said in the other threads... she is protesting the fact that America is too promiscuous and has called down the Rath of God on us.... this is pretty scarey stuff... Like biblical prophets... They are calling down a judgement like Sodom & Gohmorrah [sp]...

I'm not sure a funeral was an appropriate place to push this [and if the family did suffer from the protest going on across the road some distance away then they should be compensated] but the prophetic nature of this church's message is worrisome to me...

1st amendment v Rath of God... I'll take 1st amendment...

 

[itsbob]

The Church is not a private place and I do not see how anyone can honestly say otherwise.

We do not knock at the Church door but just walk right in.

Also many funeral possessions have police escort with lights and sometimes sirens going down the public highway as a public display, and many people still pull their cars over out of public respect for the deceased.

Calling a funeral at the local church then local cemetary as a "private" event is just not being honest or realistic. I say this is the real issue because if the "protesters" were cheering happy sayings and nice signs then it would be a "public" funeral.

The only demand to stop the protest is because it is denouncing the person and it is a religious effort.

The protesters have the right to free speech and free expression of their religion and if the funeral does not like it then the funeral needs to be done in private and not in the public arena of public Church, public streets and public cemetary.

I will be shocked if the higher Court does not overturn that un-American decision.

Churches are not public, they are privately owned.. as are cemeteries.

Just because a CHURCH owns them doesn't make them public, nor does leaving their doors open so people can come and go make them public. What it means is they own it, they can leave the doors open if they want, they can lock them if they want.. They can leave the gates to the cemetery open, or close them at dark if they want. It's all privately or "corporately" owned property.

Some times you baffle me with your stupidity..

Oh, BTW, have you got a job yet and stopped receiving (fraudulently) disability and SSI yet? You know there are people out there that REALLY need disability and people like you are preventing them from supporting their families.

 

[This_person]

The Church is not a private place and I do not see how anyone can honestly say otherwise.

It doesn't surprise me that honesty is a problem for you. This is, yet again, another problem you're demonstrating with a grip on reality. Can you just walk into any church at any time? Of course not. If you stumbled in on someone's wedding, do you really think you could use the excuse that you believed it was a public wedding? Of course not.

So, people can honestly say otherwise - because they're being honest.

Also many funeral possessions have police escort with lights and sometimes sirens going down the public highway as a public display...Calling a funeral at the local church then local cemetary as a "private" event is just not being honest or realistic.

People have to transit from one spot to the other. At no point does this stop the ceremony from being private. It's called "reality". You should try it one day.

I say this is the real issue because if the "protesters" were cheering happy sayings and nice signs then it would be a "public" funeral.

No, they simply would not be being disrepectful, thus causing problems. Sort of like if you'd cleaned up the courthouse walls instead of coloring on the walls with your temper tantrum, you wouldn't have gone to jail.

The only demand to stop the protest is because it is denouncing the person and it is a religious effort.

That it is "religious" on the part of the disgusting people is neither here nor there. It's their disregard for common decency, for the general welfare of their fellow citizen. They broke the peaceable assembly and became unruly and in general outside of the common good.

The protesters have the right to free speech and free expression of their religion and if the funeral does not like it then the funeral needs to be done in private and not in the public arena of public Church, public streets and public cemetary.

No one wants to deny them their right to protest the country that gives them the ability to protest. They just need to not violate the common peace. They can say whatever idiotic thing they want without harming anyone else during their private ceremony. Much like you can shout all you want, but not at three in the morning because it violates other people's rights, you can't violate someone funeral, because it violates the rights of the grieving.

I will be shocked if the higher Court does not overturn that un-American decision.

I will be anything less than shocked when you're shocked.

 

[itsbob]

Does it make a difference that this "church" seems to be making a statement about "the end is near... repent" rather than protesting the war.

From what the spokeswoman said in the other threads... she is protesting the fact that America is too promiscuous and has called down the Rath of God on us.... this is pretty scarey stuff... Like biblical prophets... They are calling down a judgement like Sodom & Gohmorrah [sp]...

I'm not sure a funeral was an appropriate place to push this [and if the family did suffer from the protest going on across the road some distance away then they should be compensated] but the prophetic nature of this church's message is worrisome to me...

1st amendment v Rath of God... I'll take 1st amendment...

Do you REALLY believe that Westboro Church can bring down the wrath of God??

And you are/were running for public office??

 

[amotley]

i am all for people having their rights but its called respect! respect for the the dead and the grieving. how would you feel if that happened to you? please tell me it wouldn't have made it harder on you paying your respects and hearing this, them making you feel your son died in vain. if you agree with this then you are no man or woman and i would NOT want to call you my friend or family. we all can agree or disagree but a funeral is no place to do so!

 

[~mellabella~]

i am all for people having their rights but its called respect! respect for the the dead and the grieving. how would you feel if that happened to you? please tell me it wouldn't have made it harder on you paying your respects and hearing this, them making you feel your son died in vein. if you agree with this then you are no man or woman i would want to call my friend or family. we all can agree or disagree but a funeral is no place to do so!

Well said!

 

[Plan B]

i am all for people having their rights but its called respect! respect for the the dead and the grieving. how would you feel if that happened to you? please tell me it wouldn't have made it harder on you paying your respects and hearing this, them making you feel your son died in vain. if you agree with this then you are no man or woman and i would NOT want to call you my friend or family. we all can agree or disagree but a funeral is no place to do so!

Why do y'all get so personal?

 

[JPC sr]

Mr. Ferrari

Why do y'all get so personal?

It is not likely that any of them would actually answer such a question,

so here is my opinion as to why they do that.

It is because without personal attacks they have no defensible position at all.

They feel personally weak so they try to make others weak in the same way.

 

[amotley]

this is a place for all to state their opinions, when things that are held close to the heart come up we all weigh in with our feelings. you stand and believe what you want to stand and believe in, thats what we all do. as far as my statement i stand by it, i would not disrespect anyones funeral or memorial service for any reason no matter what my beliefs. anyone that would, i wouldn't call a friend. thats me "hate me if you want to, love me if you can!!"
so i guess someone did answer for themselves and i bet many more will, i am not weak i can and will answer for anything i say.

 

[~mellabella~]

Why do y'all get so personal?

Why do I get so personal? Because in this case I am a soldiers wife. If my husband were to die while in Iraq, or anywhere for that matter, and someone stood outside the doors of my church saying "Thank God for dead soldiers." and yelling out that this is God's punishment for homosexuals, I would be highly offended. Its bad enough to protest beliefs that have nothing to do with the poor soldiers death, but to say thank God for it? Flat out wrong. Do you think the family needed that added stress to their time of grieving?

 

[~mellabella~]

It is not likely that any of them would actually answer such a question,

so here is my opinion as to why they do that.

It is because without personal attacks they have no defensible position at all.

They feel personally weak so they try to make others weak in the same way.

I am not weak, JPC. I am passionate and strong willed. Don't be fooled.

 

[amotley]

I am not weak, JPC. I am passionate and strong willed. Don't be fooled.

 

[PsyOps]

Why do y'all get so personal?

Personal? Are you telling me these "protesters" aren't getting personal?

 

[residentofcre]

Do you REALLY believe that Westboro Church can bring down the wrath of God??

And you are/were running for public office??

I don't believe that Westboro Church can bring down the wrath of God... NO...

BUT... I do believe that there will come a day when God's Wrath will be poured out... And I wonder if that time isn't really near!

For decades I've seen people standing on the street corners saying "the end is near! Repent!" and for decades people have been ignoring them.... They've been saying it since Jesus Christ rose from the dead.

Now this woman has said basically the same thing and she is getting national press.... It calls the question... are we in the end times?

Yes... I ran for County Commissioner to draw attention to the needs of the common ownership communities....

I am a born again Christian...I'm also ProLife.... I like the Baptist Church... but this church that she and her family attend is not one that I would go to .... I am evangelistic but her church is more prophetic then evangelistic...

It just calls the question... are we in end times? I think it says that everyone will be given the opportunity to choose salvation... and if she is calling this much attention to the church [notice I use little c not big C] then maybe we're closer than we were to the end of days....

It also says that when the end comes... the churches will be judged. I hope mine is not luke warm... I also hope my church doesn't turn people away from the Gospel.... Her's definitely has people talking...

I wouldn't like it if she was picketting at my father's funeral... I might not be so bothered if she was across the road and out of sight of the funeral service itself. After all... My dad gave 22 years in the Navy for his country... he said he faught [Daddy was on the ground field corpsman in Korea] so some people could say and do things he didn't particularly agree with... but he was proud to give them the right to do so...

I'd be happy to discuss this further in my private forum "Becky's Corkboard"

 

[This_person]

Why do y'all get so personal?

I think most of us get personal with specific individuals (yes, Jimmy, I'm talking about you now) because of past associations with them on other issues, and the depth of emotion that runs from those issues. So, when a contentious issue arises, the flood of emotion from those issues overflows and seems beyond what's appropriate for the current issue.

I was surprised, though, that someone who began attacking people personally through assumptions of ideology from very early posts asked such a question. Why do YOU get so personal, so insulting so quickly on issues?

 

[This_person]

I am not weak, JPC. I am passionate and strong willed. Don't be fooled.

It's kind of his thing, so..... :shrug:

 

[amotley]

It's kind of his thing, so..... :shrug:

i agree

 

[Plan B]

I think most of us get personal with specific individuals (yes, Jimmy, I'm talking about you now) because of past associations with them on other issues, and the depth of emotion that runs from those issues. ...
I was surprised, though, that someone who began attacking people personally through assumptions of ideology from very early posts asked such a question. Why do YOU get so personal, so insulting so quickly on issues?

Inquiring into the true perspective of a poster is different than calling someone a snivler, etc., ad nauseum...
Tho' I am guilty as charged re SMIB!

 

[Toxick]

It is because without personal attacks they have no defensible position at all.

Let me say this about that:

I have in the past made personal remarks against you, and your intellect, but for some time now, I have been making a conscious effort not to resort to these ad hominem attacks any more. There have been a few times where I was staggered by the mind-blowing vacuousness and/or arrogance your posts contain, and made replies which contain comments about you personally, but I ended up not sending them.

Overall, I attempt to respond to you on the basis of what you write, rather than trying to insult the source of your responses (i.e. your brain).

Having said that, you make it very difficult for someone to engage in useful dialogue with you. I'm not certain that this is unintentional, but that's beside the point. You invariably refuse to address points you disagree with and you often dismiss them out of hand without any thought or logical coherence. This is a communication technique that tends to put people's asses up on their backs. Incidentally, this is why I argue with you so infrequently these days. The frustration of engaging with you far outweighs any benefit that may be obtained.

So, I submit to you that it's not that people have indefensible positions without personal attacks, but rather you ignore/dismiss people's positions, and respond with a mind-numbing lack of coherent logic. I just find it amusing that you continue to wonder why people get a burr in their britches at this behavior.