Gays in the military...

[bcp]

This is all true but I think BCP is trying to point out that only a man and women are physically capable of engaging in sexual intercourse in the missionary position which is not categorized as sodomy.

Pixie knows what Im saying, and knows that Im right.
its just that as the law reads right now, what she wants is not there.

all I can say is, fight to change the law.

 

[bcp]

This is all silly and getting watered down anyway. DADT isn't about the act of sex its about sexual orientation. Is a gay man any less gay if he's celebate? Is it ok for men to "court" one another and "date" without engaging in sex acts?

So I think about chopping someone up and floating the body parts down the river.

or

I chop someone up and float them down the river.

when did I become a murderer? when I thought about it, or when I actually did it.

 

[pixiegirl]

So I think about chopping someone up and floating the body parts down the river.

or

I chop someone up and float them down the river.

when did I become a murderer? when I thought about it, or when I actually did it.

Look up homosexual in the dictionary.

If a man dates, makes-out with, fantasizes about another man but doesn't have sex with him he's still gay. Would you be comfortable sharing your shower with a man that does all these things?

 

[pixiegirl]

Pixie knows what Im saying, and knows that Im right.
its just that as the law reads right now, what she wants is not there.

all I can say is, fight to change the law.

Good thing for you they took narcissism off the list of personality disorders. The law in question speaks specifically of sodomy which is illegal for all sexes, sexualities.

 

[pixiegirl]

So I think about chopping someone up and floating the body parts down the river.

or

I chop someone up and float them down the river.

when did I become a murderer? when I thought about it, or when I actually did it.

And murder is an act while sexual orientation is not.

 

[toppick08]

I love me some anal sex...just saying..

 

[bcp]

Look up homosexual in the dictionary.

If a man dates, makes-out with, fantasizes about another man but doesn't have sex with him he's still gay. Would you be comfortable sharing your shower with a man that does all these things?

Now you are just being silly

I would not share a shower with any other man regardless of his gayness score.

 

[bcp]

I love me some anal sex...just saying..

Well so much for us sharing a shower.

 

[MMDad]

No, the dictionary does.

As Pixie already pointed out, you are wrong. But in any case, we are discussing the military, so it doesn't matter what the dictionary says. The only thing that matters is what the UCMJ and regulations say.

So, they happen only when there's some form of proof....

No, it's only prosecuted as part of another greater crime, like fraternization, conduct unbecoming, adultry, dereliction of duty, etc.

It hasn't been prosecuted alone in decades.

Looks like you need to take a reading comprehension course. I am able to understand what you write, and I am able to draw logical conclusions from that.

I told you that the military almost never (since they have in the past but not now) prosecutes straights for sodomy. I then said that prosecuting gays for sodomy would not be equal protection. You said that since they prosecute straights (they don't) then it would be equal.

You should probably wait to debate until JPC runs again. He's a good match for you.

 

[bcp]

As Pixie already pointed out, you are wrong. But in any case, we are discussing the military, so it doesn't matter what the dictionary says. The only thing that matters is what the UCMJ and regulations say.



I told you that the military almost never (since they have in the past but not now) prosecutes straights for sodomy. I then said that prosecuting gays for sodomy would not be equal protection. You said that since they prosecute straights (they don't) then it would be equal.

You should probably wait to debate until JPC runs again. He's a good match for you.

You first say that it only matters what the UCMJ and regulations say. I agree.

then you refer to equal protection. Can you find this in the UCMJ?
didn't think so.

and right now, gays would not be prosecuted for sodomy unless it was performed on the ship or on base etc.. and straights would not be prosecuted except under the same situations.
then we have fraternization rules that could apply to the straights even off base if between to opposite sex individuals should one be of a higher rank than the other and in a position of power over the other.

 

[MMDad]

and right now, gays would not be prosecuted for sodomy unless it was performed on the ship or on base etc.. and straights would not be prosecuted except under the same situations.

That's my point!!! People on here want to use Article 125 as a way to prosecute gays if DADT is repealed. I'm saying that they would have to prosecute all sodomy, not just gay sodomy.

 

[bcp]

That's my point!!! People on here want to use Article 125 as a way to prosecute gays if DADT is repealed. I'm saying that they would have to prosecute all sodomy, not just gay sodomy.

Then we agree
under the UCMJ, they can suck all the crank they want as long as they dont get caught doing it on military property, or get caught doing it in a public place while wearing a uniform.

 

[MMDad]

then you refer to equal protection. Can you find this in the UCMJ?
didn't think so.

Explicitly? No. But.......

Under Lawerence v. Texas, the Supreme Court essentially invalidated sodomy laws based on the due proces clause of the 14th Amendment.

The United States Court of Appeals for the Armed Forces has found that the Lawerence decision applies to Article 125 in all but some very narrowly applied cases.

The military has exceptions to the due process clause, but there must be a good reason for it. Using Article 125 in order to get around a DADT repeal would not be a valid reason.

 

[MMDad]

Then we agree
under the UCMJ, they can suck all the crank they want as long as they dont get caught doing it on military property, or get caught doing it in a public place while wearing a uniform.

Yep. If it is illegal for a man and woman to do it, it would be illegal for two men or two women to do it.

 

[oldman]

In my 20 years I only knew of one gay. Aboard a ship and he made the mistake of attempting to openly demonstrate it on another. He received a blanket party and the next day was no longer a crew member.

 

[bcp]

Yep. If it is illegal for a man and woman to do it, it would be illegal for two men or two women to do it.

Of course, unless its changed since I was in, if a male and female were to be caught alone in berthing, or some other place that could appear to look inappropriate, they would have been in some deep doo doo.

how are you going to insure that two gays are not in the same place at the same time where possible exchange of body fluids could take place.

 

[MMDad]

Of course, unless its changed since I was in, if a male and female were to be caught alone in berthing, or some other place that could appear to look inappropriate, they would have been in some deep doo doo.

how are you going to insure that two gays are not in the same place at the same time where possible exchange of body fluids could take place.

Do you see a sudden mass enlistment of flaming homos or something?

They're already there. Sometimes they work together - just like straight people. Sometimes they do things they shouldn't - just like straight people. Sometimes they get caught and get punished - just like straight people. The rules against pole smoking in berthing are not changing.

The only thing that might change is that gays wouldn't be prosecuted if someone found out they are gay or if they admit they are gay.

I understand there are two sides of the issue, but can't we at least talk about the issue and not some off the wall tangent? There is no effort by anyone to make gay sex on duty or on ships legal. The only thing that repealing DADT would affect is off duty conduct or past conduct.

 

[craberta]

I went to plenty of concerts in my younger days and have used the mens room many times opposed to waiting in line for the ladies room. You know what happens when a woman walks in the mens room? The men make an effort to cover their stuff. I'm certain it's because I don't have a wanker and has nothing to do with sex or sexuality. The same reason my young boys cover themselves around their step sisters but not around other boys.

I have a male buddy who is in the desert right now, men and women are using the same, no stall latrine, He told me it was kind of weird when she asked him for paper, but then it seemed normal, cause everyone has to go at one time or another, unless you get a weird a$$ who is into "bathroom-exotic-erotic-golden shower-poopoo fetish" wich affects both males and females, and don't forget the boot lickers, and pillow mashers....I don't know why people can't understand that gay people are not attracted to EVERYBODY...!

 

[glhs837]

We do get that. Would we expect that men and women be bunked together, knowing that not all men are attracted to every woman?

 

[This_person]

Wrong. I have a Webster's II New College Dictionary right here at my desk.

Sodomy - A form of sexual intercourse held to be unnatural or abnormal, esp. anal copulation or copulation with an animal.

Says nothing about gender.

From dictionary.com:
sod·om·y   /ˈsɒdəmi/ Show Spelled
[sod-uh-mee] Show IPA

–noun
1. anal or oral copulation with a member of the opposite sex.
2. copulation with a member of the same sex.
3. bestiality ( def. 4 ) .

Not the only definition (as I said), but one of the definitions.