History

[vraiblonde]

Boy, Frank - good thing you put Dems on "Ignore" before you had to read this last offering.

Dems, the reason we don't listen to you is because we DON'T learn anything from you besides how ignorant you are. You don't have anything particularly insightful or intelligent to say - you just want to sing that song that gets on everybody's nerves.

Now I'm not trying to insult you - okay, yes I am - but because one uses leadership and persuasion tactics, and the Nazis used leadership and persuasion tactics, does not mean one is a Nazi.

Like Larry said - the Nazis ate carrots. So if YOU eat carrots, are you showing Nazi traits?

 

[Lexington Punk]

I think he may just say inflamatory things to get peoples goat.

 

[demsformd]

Well whatever...its more of an opinion on leadership tactics. I'm just gonna stop here.

 

[vraiblonde]

One more thing:

Comparing someone to Hitler or a Nazi is a universal insult. If you went over to France and compared someone to a Nazi, they'd get your meaning right away. So to say that you didn't mean to insult Bush by comparing him to a Nazi is disingenuous at best.

 

[SmallTown]

Originally posted by vraiblonde

Like Larry said - the Nazis ate carrots. So if YOU eat carrots, are you showing Nazi traits?

I don't think eating carrots had a direct impact on their foreign policy.

 

[Lexington Punk]

Originally posted by SmallTown
I don't think eating carrots had a direct impact on their foreign policy.

It was at the root of their foreign policy.

 

[vraiblonde]

Originally posted by SmallTown
I don't think eating carrots had a direct impact on their foreign policy.

Neither did leadership and persuasion. Force - that's what they were all about. You show me one instance where Bush released the hounds on anti-war protestors and people who opposed him. Just one. Because I can show you a zillion examples of where Hitler had people killed for opposing him.

 

[SmallTown]

Originally posted by vraiblonde
Neither did leadership and persuasion. Force - that's what they were all about. You show me one instance where Bush released the hounds on anti-war protestors and people who opposed him. Just one. Because I can show you a zillion examples of where Hitler had people killed for opposing him.

We aren't talking about killing people as being the similar notion. Read the original post.
Leadership and persuasion (regardless of means) is the EXACT way people like hitler become and stay in power. Of course, the nazis could have used your famous saying of "get out of the way!" to all the jews who happened to fall into the wrong hands.

 

[vraiblonde]

ST, are you crazy? Hitler didn't get into his position by using leadership and persuasion - he got there by FORCE. You know - killing people? Throwing them in prison if they spoke against him? Or are you in Holocaust denial?

Of course, the nazis could have used your famous saying of "get out of the way!" to all the jews who happened to fall into the wrong hands.

And I have no idea what you mean by THAT. It is my historical understanding that the Nazis were the wrong hands. If that's incorrect, please give me a history lesson.

 

[SmallTown]

Originally posted by vraiblonde
ST, are you crazy? Hitler didn't get into his position by using leadership and persuasion - he got there by FORCE. You know - killing people? Throwing them in prison if they spoke against him? Or are you in Holocaust denial?

And I have no idea what you mean by THAT. It is my historical understanding that the Nazis were the wrong hands. If that's incorrect, please give me a history lesson.

Wow, it does appear you DO need a history lesson. Read a book or two about Hitler. Read about WHY he had such hatred for the jews following WW1, read who he killed and why, read how he could "mesmerize" large crowds with his speeches alone, without a show of force. It is actually pretty creepy how such a sick mind could mesmerize so many people (including americans who heard his speeches)

And to think he didn't go through the military ranks very quickly because of his lack of leadership. So see boys and girls, if you want something bad enough, keep trying and eventually you will succeed.

 

[vraiblonde]

It is actually pretty creepy how such a sick mind could mesmerize so many people

Big deal - WWF guys and Hollywood celebrities do it all the time.

Here's some history:
http://pages.zdnet.com/stanleytech/humanities/history/hitler_timeline.htm

And here:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/education/modern/hitler/hitlehtm.htm

I'm seeing a lot of politickin' but a lot of force as well. So we're both right.

Regardless, Bush isn't Hitler nor is he a fascist. Anyone who says he is is an ignorant bonehead.

 

[SeaRide]

ST, you sure know nothing. Let me see if you can tell me this, how do you describe these people listed below.

William, the Conquer?
Bruce Bruce?
Henry, the 8th?
Alexadra, the Great?
Ceasar?
Bruce, the Brute?

George Washington as General during revolutionary war ( way before being the first president and before Congress ever exist) ??

Don't tell me you wanna use the term "Nazi" or "Hitler" to compare those people before 1900s. Geez.

 

[Penn]

It's amazing how you do that...

Originally posted by vraiblonde
Big deal - WWF guys and Hollywood celebrities do it all the time.


I'm seeing a lot of politickin' but a lot of force as well. So we're both right.

Regardless, Bush isn't Hitler nor is he a fascist. Anyone who says he is is an ignorant bonehead.

...You have managed to describe SmallTown down to the smallest facet; starting at the dullish point at the top of his head!!

 

[SmallTown]

Originally posted by SeaRide
ST, you sure know nothing.

All I know is the rhetoric coming from Bush all the way down to his loyal followers goes hand in hand with what this nazi said. If people want to read other things into that, fine. At least you guys didn't say it was all lies, drudged up by the scary liberal media.

All i've heard since I posted it was a bunch of "but, but, hey, but..." All i've heard are attacks against the notion, when a simple "its just a coincidence" would suffice.

As for others, does it matter? Republicans compare all democrats to clinton and all republicans to reagan, but there were others that are both better and worse than each in history

 

[SmallTown]

Re: It's amazing how you do that...

Originally posted by penncam
...You have managed to describe SmallTown down to the smallest facet; starting at the dullish point at the top of his head!!

:silly: :stooges: :weak:

 

[vraiblonde]

Okay, ST - you're last post made me laugh out loud! Touché!

(The one with all the smilies, not the other one - THAT one was just filled with more backpedaling )

 

[vraiblonde]

Occasionally I troll the DU just for fun - if you ever want to check out some really mean, vitriolic, ugly and just downright insane people, point your browser to
http://www.democraticunderground.com/cgi-bin/duforum/duboard.cgi?az=lobby

In one thread they're comparing Bush to Hitler (which must be where ST got it). Here's a priceless retort:

JesseLman
ooo-kay.
Saying "Bush is like Hitler w/o the genocide" is like saying "Keanu Reeves is just like Einstein, just without the intelligence."

 

[SmallTown]

Originally posted by vraiblonde

In one thread they're comparing Bush to Hitler (which must be where ST got it).

Actually, I saw it on snopes awhile back while browsing around. Then I came across the picture on the politcalhumor website. When I saw it the second time, my jaw just dropped because I had been hearing the exact words over and over again. I actually went back to snopes after seeing it, thinking it was one of the "false" items on there.

But for me, if something works, no need to break it. Hitler showed this mentality worked (even to support something that is obviouly wrong). Now, if we started on the genocide track then I would have to say stop.

If you'll read the first post, it clearly states that we did learn something from hitler, and I gave the example of what we learned. Nowhere in my brief message, nor the quote, does it mention genocide or any of the other horrible things hitler did. Of course, people get really bent when they hear their style is traced back to something like nazi germany. The good thing is, it worked back then, and it is working now. The only time you would be upset with this is if one or the other failed (Again, remember. We are talking about simply gaining support, not what you do with that support once you have it. I think that is where people are stumbling)

 

[Larry Gude]

st...

...you don't need to clarify.

Leadership and persuasion (regardless of means) is the EXACT way people like hitler become and stay in power

You've offered up a point for conversation and the point is simply a flawed corelation, such as eating carrots.

What Adolph Hitler (part Jewish BTW) attained in post "Great War" Europe in a county absolutely devestated physically and economically is no more comparable or relevent to leaders of a representative republic (the US) than to say, "he spoke to crowds of people". So did MLK. So did Lenin. So did Ghandi. So did Jesus H. Christ Himself.

Hitler took misery as it existed, offered a Grand vision of return to National Glory and laid out the catalyst: Jews. The "bad guy", a "thing" you could put your hands on and hold responsible, to blame. Then he exported it.

His "leadership" and "persuasion" murdered German citizens, millions of them. His "leadership and persuasion" invaded and took over Poland, France (proving that the worst of us may not be all bad) most of Eastern Europe, parts of the Middle East, almost Great Britain and almost the entire 'effing Soviet Union.

His "leadership and persuasion" the, as you say "EXACT" way, set off a truly global conflagration that took over 55 million human beings lives before it was over, one out of roughly every 45 people alive at the time.

Now, probably a more interesting feature of the Nazi methodology that many leaders DO NOT emulate is “vilification” and “de-humanization”.

Hitler vilified his own citizens, pouring blame on groups of people (never individuals) Jews, gypsies, homosexuals, retards and others of all sorts of physical weaknesses and/or imperfections then he dehumanized them. Then, he disposed of them. He had a global plan.

Now, you are touchy about being called "un-patriotic" even though EVERYBODY stands up for your right to protest, even arguing that you are being VERY patriotic to argue against our government.

So, as your thesis is wrong, then the real problem is being stuck with being wrong which must be impossible so it MUST be that someone is attacking YOU. Therefore you must invalidate, vilify and/or dehumanize you supposed "opponent".
Thus, W the NAZI. Why he's just like Adolph Hitler, EXACTLY, in fact in his methods of leadership!

Nah. You're simply wrong and you don't like it and refuse to hold yourself accountable.

How Hitler-esque.

 

[SmallTown]

Larry, there you go bringing up carrots again. Doctors would say you have a phallus fixation, but that is a whole different thread all together.

That was a very nice post you made. It flowed very well, heck I was even impressed by the content. Too bad the content had NOTHING to do with what we are talking about here. We were simply talking about ways to gain and maintain power, and the ways and means by which people do it. The comparison is obvious, and like I said, it works so I don't necessarily see it as a bad thing. This goes back to the old ethical question of "If you were on your death bed on the only cure available is one obtained through the horrible medical tests done in the nazi prison camps, would you accept the treatment?" I would say yes. Though I oppose the means by which the information was obtained, if something good can be pulled from it, by all means do.


If you wish, we can start another thread to discuss the world reaction to this power, and the struggles of people outside the ring of power. I'm not sure what we could cover that countless books haven't already covered, but we can try