I am the mother of "that child"

[Bann]

In nearly every study ever done physical punishment is linked with worse outcomes. It may "work" in that it frightens younger children into hiding things better as not to experience physical punishment, but it teaches nothing, especially not coping mechanisms or anything useful for the child except avoidance.. Im not saying that as some sort of anti spanking Nazi; when my daughter was younger a well timed swat to make a point happened more than once. But for an older child with behavioral issues, especially with an unknown past experience and possible predisposition to mental health problems, physical punishment sounds llike the very worst idea and would likely make his behavior and mental health worse, not better. And thats not my opinion, that is scientifically upheld fact. Yes, it does appear to be on a scale, ie harsher punishment causes worse issues etc, but with an unknown past, its better not to play roulette with gene and environment interplays, in my opinion.

https://www.aap.org/en-us/about-the-aap/aap-press-room/pages/Spanking-Linked-to-Mental-Illness.aspx

Your point about dynamics,though, is a solid one. Changing them can be helpful. Most of my mental health treatment experience is with adults, but one of my youngest patients was a young teenager with mostly behavioral issues. She was out of control, was kicked out of school, had violent behavior very similar to that described by the OP. She responded really well to simplfying her life (ie her parents took away nearly everything but a change of clothes and a pillow/blanket) and she earned things back with an elaborate chart developed with her parents and treatment team (it included everything from daily responsibilities to handling things appropriately and was no doubt an intense project for her parents). It gave her something to work for, and was a long enough process (over months) that she was able to learn self regulation and other skills along the way. This time did include inpatient treatment in a mental health unit (where I met her and upheld her chart while she was there) and they did get her on a useful med as well as involved her in groups where she could start to learn skills like delayed gratification, anger management and how to communicate your needs to people in a clear and non violent way. Many people that advocate punishment only dont really understand that often learning these skills are the difference between someone who is totally disabled with their mental disorder and someone who can manage, even in severe cases like schizophrenia. It sounds silly, like its something "average" kids learn through life, but sometimes it takes targeted learning and treatment, a tutor if you will, to help people who are not average grasp these things.

OP, I am sorry there arent more resources for you in this area. Our drug and dump mental health treatment is sad and doesn't help anyone. and I don't envy the amount of work it takes to get a child like that on track, its HARD. But you dont have to do it alone! Please find a good support group , even online forums and make sure you are taken care of as well. My father has late stage cancer and we found a WEALTH of knowledge online from other families, things that helped not only with his treatment, but with his comfort as well. Tapping in to that has made all of the "stuff" such so much easier to navigate. Best of luck, adn whatever you need to do to be safe and provide a chance for hima nd your family is the right decision.

Good post!

 

[DannyMotorcycle]

That was a good post.. however I want to contend with "studies show"... nearly? well they didn't study this particular child... and if it's okay for them to do the study on other kids,
heck do it on this one. I wouldn't trust a "study" these days unless i was conducting it myself or something. Now a days people collect money to have the studies make their point.

I highly doubt one week of attempting punishment is going to make him significantly worse, or worse. At this point is he far too broken. He is already abusive to his adopted mother and others.
I certainly would double down on her dishing out the discipline. It's certainly not worse than his previous experiences and he might earn a healthy respect for her from it.

Yes there are at least two types of people in this world, those who behave for the respect of consequences and those who don't. Trying this would help us further see what's going on.
See if he actually response to punishment from mom. They have tried dad punishing him right? then it's only fair to try it with mom, especially if he's showing mom less respect than he's showing dad, but dad has punished him..

 

[Monello]

This might help.

https://www.xmccamp.com/

 

[Monello]

Sort of what the OP is going through.

I adopted a 7 year old boy about 14 years ago.It was the worst decision of my entire life.
He was, and is, a sociopath. He lies. He steals. He hurts. He cheats. He can be incredibly superfically charming but leaves a truly awe-inspiring wake of emotional and physical destruction behind him everywhere he goes.
I say awe-inspiring because unless you've spent time around this, unless you truly understand how amazingly destructive this can be to a person's very self, you just don't get it.
The psychiatrist during pre-adoption gave some warnings in her brief. The social worker, whose job it is to get kids adopted, pushed and pushed, pooh-poohing the psychiatrist's reports, minimizing them and insisting reports from his placements were biased.
Now, understand, I am not inexperienced. I have other kids. I've worked with special needs kids. I thought I was prepared.
I wasn't.
Nothing, and I mean nothing, can prepare someone to have this inflicted on themselves. It changed me. It fundamentally changed me as a person. It did the same to everyone else in the family, in different ways.
Friends tell me I am less outgoing, slower to laugh and smile and joke, less prone to trust, and far, far, too matter-of-fact and blase about everything. I've developed the latter as a survival defense mechanism. One learns quickly, one simply cannot react emotionally. To anything. At all. Ever. As it will be used brutally against you.

http://www.brainjet.com/random/1675...al-how-they-really-feel-about-their-offspring

 

[littlelady]

If I may ...



There you go again. Criticizing someone when you have no pony in the show. Will you never learn?

We have a year and a half year old grandot with another grandbaby on the way. We moved to help out. We raised two children. What is your point? We have plenty of ponies in the show.

 

[littlelady]

Regardless if he has children or not, I think he offered up some good ideas. You on the other hand...

Go smell your roses in Idaho, RR. Thanks.

 

[littlelady]

REALLY sometimes people without children occasionally have ideas of how to help with them. Where I ride we have a child that is extremely hyper active. My suggestion was the days he rides the parents should bring him early and let him burn some of that energy off around the farm. Always stalls to be clean, horses washed and there is wide open space where he can just run. Shockingly enough - it has worked. They were like how did you know. 1. Been around horses a long time and see many hyper active kids burn that energy off running around the ring, jumping jumps and just being kids.

People without children have no idea. You are welcome.

 

[littlelady]

YOU are an A$$. 9 times out of ten a doctor WON'T give a diagnosis on this type of problem until a child is entering into adulthood (17 or older). And I know this to be a FACT!

I have a story about that, but I won't share it here. I may PM you if that is ok.

 

[littlelady]

You are wrong.

I am not giving advice. I'm just sharing ideas off the top of my head as i stated.

Don't worry about my marriage. If I don't care to keep it, you certainly should not.

Get back to me when you have children. Perhaps, you won't be so flippant.

 

[littlelady]

And you are a lier, doctors and psychiatrists​ give adolescent diagnosis on a daily basis.some of it was posted.
But if you rant loud enough, some will believe you.
Maybe try all caps.

You really are an arse; a self absorbed one at that. You are by far the most egotistical member on this forum. I miss the days of nominating for titles. And, if you are truly a Marine, my hub is embarrassed to identify with you. Ooorah!

 

[black dog]

We have a year and a half year old grandot with another grandbaby on the way. We moved to help out. We raised two children. What is your point? We have plenty of ponies in the show.

Go smell your roses in Idaho, RR. Thanks.

People without children have no idea. You are welcome.

I have a story about that, but I won't share it here. I may PM you if that is ok.

Get back to me when you have children. Perhaps, you won't be so flippant.

You really are an arse; a self absorbed one at that. You are by far the most egotistical member on this forum. I miss the days of nominating for titles. And, if you are truly a Marine, my hub is embarrassed to identify with you. Ooorah!

Lots of worthless posts for someone who keeps saying she's leaving..
You truly have some serious issues.. seek detox and mental health help.

 

[littlelady]

Lots of worthless posts for someone who keeps saying she's leaving..
You truly have some serious issues.. seek detox and mental health help.

You are such a piece of you know. Anything to make yourself feel better about yourself. That is how I know you are not happy, because you berate so many on this forum. Call it a mother's intuition. I get it, and you are nothing to me. Here is a pic of Emmy's first day at the beach. She was overwhelmed at first, but then loved it!

 

[black dog]

View attachment 119288

You are such a piece of you know. Anything to make yourself feel better about yourself. That is how I know you are not happy, because you berate so many on this forum. Call it a mother's intuition. I get it, and you are nothing to me. Here is a pic of Emmy's first day at the beach. She was overwhelmed at first, but then loved it!

I'm sure she was overwhelmed by simple sand, considering her mother is overwhelmed with the simple task of ordering a taxicab and a grandmother with mental health problems.

 

[littlelady]

I'm sure she was overwhelmed by simple sand, considering her mother is overwhelmed with the simple task of ordering a taxicab and a grandmother with mental health problems.

You have just labeled yourself as the biggest arsehole on this forum in my 5 years here. I feel bad for you. I hope you don't fly the American flag in front of your house like we do.
Why do you go after people, as in me? Something is missing in your genetics, or you have Napoleon complex, or someting. What is wrong with you? My hub is a short 5'9", but was a wrestler, is a runner, and an expert with arms. I wish y'all could meet. He would beat your butt.

 

[black dog]

You have just labeled yourself as the biggest arsehole on this forum in my 5 years here. I feel bad for you. I hope you don't fly the American flag in front of your house like we do.
Why do you go after people, as in me? Something is missing in your genetics, or you have Napoleon complex, or someting. What is wrong with you? My hub is a short 5'9", but was a wrestler, is a runner, and an expert with arms. I wish y'all could meet. He would beat your butt.

You truly are a Wackadoodie Loon... Did your mom drink like you?
It would explain alot...
I would guess you can't get a " rise " out of you husband so you just try to get what you are missing here...
Maybe if you just could once in awhile post something relevant in a thread you just wouldn't seem so Wackadoodie... Well probably not but it's worth a shot there doodie..

 

[littlelady]

You truly are a Wackadoodie Loon... Did your mom drink like you?
It would explain alot...
I would guess you can't get a " rise " out of you husband so you just try to get what you are missing here...
Maybe if you just could once in awhile post something relevant in a thread you just wouldn't seem so Wackadoodie... Well probably not but it's worth a shot there doodie..

This is where I have to say F you. My mom never drank a day in her life. She was a great mom, a realtor, a country song writer, a children's book writer, could do The NY Times crossword puzzle in no time flat, and the best grandmother ever. She died of Alzheimer's 10 years ago. Just to say to all out there if you keep your mind active, it will prevent that. It is wrong. Her docs and nurses said that in their experience, it seems to be linked to processed foods.


#### you. Dog. Go after someone else if you feel comfortable in knowing their life. You truly are an arsehole.

And, you think the posts you replied to tonight are relevant? I think you might have a problem. Hello? Why do you think you can go after a member's family on here? Especially, when you tout that you and your son are so great. That is the giveaway, right there. You have problems, too, but won't admit it. There is no other reason for you to be so venomous.

 

[black dog]

This is where I have to say F you. My mom never drank a day in her life. She was a great mom, a realtor, a country song writer, a children's book writer, could do The NY Times crossword puzzle in no time flat, and the best grandmother ever.
#### you. Go after someone else if you feel comfortable in knowing their life. You truly are an arsehole.

And, you think the posts you replied to tonight are relevant? I think you might have a problem. Hello? Why do you think you can go after a member's family on here? Especially, when you tout that you and your son are so great. That is the giveaway, right there. You have problems, too, but won't admit it. There is no other reason for you to be so venomous.

I think you have venomous confused with truthfull..
You forgot to mention your husband can beat me up and to bash my service time,
Do you do all of the speaking for your husband...
He's most likely glad you are on here otherwise you would be bothering him.
Have either of your children served ? Well first they would have to get a higher score on the asvab than 32.. And that crack thing might be a small problem.

 

[littlelady]

I think you have venomous confused with truthfull..
You forgot to mention your husband can beat me up and to bash my service time,
Do you do all of the speaking for your husband...
He's most likely glad you are on here otherwise you would be bothering him.
Have either of your children served ? Well first they would have to get a higher score on the asvab than 32.. And that crack thing might be a small problem.

Well, it seems you are up all night, too. Oh, I remember when you criticized me for that, hypocrite. My hub doesn't do this forum. He is smarter than I am. Actually, I am posting this right next to him in bed. He is asleep. He is getting up at 6am to go run with his Sat group for 4 hours. Do you do that? No, my children did not serve. Did yours? What is this crack thing you can't let go of? Again, what is wrong with you and your obsession with me? Again, I know my hub would beat your butt. The internet is such a good buffer. One thing I cannot be accussed of on this forum is not telling the truth. You are lucky you don't know my hub in real life. You have absolutely no idea. Just looking out for you.

Your son just grad from HS, so he couldn't have served yet.
Do you have additional children that have served? If, so you have not disclosed that.
As, far as serving, I lost family members in the Revolutionry War, the Civil War, WWI and WWII. I didn't lose a fam member in Vietnam or the current ME War, but I did lose someone close to me in the VM War. His name is James Jerson. I have mentioned him before here. His name is on the Wall. He was a neighbor's son that used to babysit for us when I was young...Eagle Scout and all that. I will never forget him. Also, my father, being a geophyiscist and all was in the special forces during the Korean War...he missed being in WWII by a hair. Also, my hub's dad was in the Navy in WWII. Also, currently, we have a neice and nephew in the Coast Guard in the high uppity up of intelligence. We always say to them that we know they can't tell us anything, but maybe give us a sign. My entire family have been patriots from the beginning. Not to mention, I am part Shawnee; which is another story. And, a sad one.

 

[black dog]

Well, it seems you are up all night, too. Oh, I remember when you criticized me for that, hypocrite. My hub doesn't do this forum. He is smarter than I am. Actually, I am posting this right next to him in bed. He is asleep. He is getting up at 6am to go run with his Sat group for 4 hours. Do you do that? No, my children did not serve. Did yours? What is this crack thing you can't let go of? Again, what is wrong with you and your obsession with me? Again, I know my hub would beat your butt. The internet is such a good buffer. One thing I cannot be accussed of on this forum is not telling the truth. You are lucky you don't know my hub in real life. You have absolutely no idea. Just looking out for you.

I'm working Wackadoodie, being a productive citizen / small business owner,,. between laughing at you..
You wouldn't understand things like ordering materials, shop supply's, payroll ,taxes and adult things like that..
Has my kid served you ask.... Well he's not 18 quite yet but so far he's done 4 years of JROTC through High School, how's that for a minor young man.. he scored a 92 on his asvabs.. your husband can explain it to you. And yes he's been talking to recruiters the last few weeks and with his test scores he can just about pick and choose where and how he wants to serve if there's a opening in that MOS.


And as far as you speaking for your husband,,,,just like with yourself.. he ain't getting no cherry here..

 

[littlelady]

I'm working Wackadoodie, being a productive citizen / small business owner,,. between laughing at you..
You wouldn't understand things like ordering materials, shop supply's, payroll ,taxes and adult things like that..
Has my kid served you ask.... Well he's not 18 quite yet but so far he's done 4 years of JROTC through High School, how's that for a minor young man.. he scored a 92 on his asvabs.. your husband can explain it to you. And yes he's been talking to recruiters the last few weeks and with his test scores he can just about pick and choose where and how he wants to serve if there's a opening in that MOS.


And as far as you speaking for your husband,,,,just like with yourself.. he ain't getting no cherry here..

Your last sentence is why you are disgusting. I applaud you for keeping your small biz in tact in these days and times. Why are you laughing at me? My hub has worked hard, and I did, too. Hub used to own a small biz back in the day, and then he went to work for USBank. Good for your son. I wish him the best. Can you lay off me now?; so to speak. : My son was in the Honor Society, grad with a 4.0, was first pitcher on the baseball team, and top golfer on that team. Things happen. One more thing. My dot never did a wrong thing in her life, but got diagnosed with MS last year.
So, F you again, and Uber. She is expecting her second child in 6 months. Can't wait for you to make fun of that innocent child, too. How do you live yourself?

Shoo, fly.

Edit: You must not have to work very much since you are on this forum all day, every day.
Good for you!