I can tell you from personal experience with family members, you are wrong on all counts.
I can tell you from personal experience with family members, you are wrong on all counts.
This_person
Well-Known Member
Then fine, call them ALL civil unions. It's the whole separate but equal thing that screws it all up. Just take the word 'marriage' out of it and leave that in the churches where it belongs. NONE of us are married, we all have civil unions. Done.
Somehow, if it were ONLY about the word, there would be a lot less fighting about it. If the solution were that simple it would have been done.
And as far as the liberals in CA are concerned, I do not speak for them...I'm not a liberalThey're just as nuts as the conservatives
Don't forget, you have to convince the society that they should have their marriage nullified in favor of civil union.
This_person
Well-Known Member
Do you know of a state where sexual orientation tests are given for marriage licenses?
You don't get it, If I'm marrying a woman it's implicit. I also don't have to fill in species.
This_person
Well-Known Member
Let 'em. What does that have to do with governmental recognition?
UNA
New Member
Don't forget, you have to convince the society that they should have their marriage nullified in favor of civil union.
Grandfather it in, I'll officially have a civil union but I don't need to actually go have anything nullified...I think you're over-complicating things. Is it really that hard for you to admit that you agree with me?!
This_person
Well-Known Member
Living wills cannot be used? Executors of wills do not exist? What am I wrong about, specifically?
This_person
Well-Known Member
You and Vrai - jeesh. Who said anything about species? Again, you have to argue against what I've said, not against what you have arguments prepared for.
This_person
Well-Known Member
Grandfather it in, I'll officially have a civil union but I don't need to actually go have anything nullified...I think you're over-complicating things. Is it really that hard for you to admit that you agree with me?!
We don't agree, we've come to a reasonable compromise. There's a difference.
You still think there's no difference, I still know there is. But, we've come to a reasonable compromise on what could be done to handle the disagreement legally.
Visitation rights, if you have a living will it has to be pulled and provided to the hospital to prove it, not very convenient when you're partner is dying from a car accident. Especially if you were in the car.
UNA
New Member
Fine, you seem to refuse to agree (even though you did...) so we can drag this out if you want
Aside from the fact that you seem to think it's 'equal' to require gay couple to jump through all these extra hoop...
A living will to allow for the first two: EASILY contested
Adopt together to allow for the third: Gays often are not allowed to adopt
Buy health insurance that meets the needs of the last (in fact, most larger companies are already offering this): they often cannot utilize the health insurance offered by a job. And please, name these companies because I would love to know...(and please, policies I can get in MD...NOT just CA)
UNA
New Member
We don't agree, we've come to a reasonable compromise. There's a difference.
You still think there's no difference, I still know there is. But, we've come to a reasonable compromise on what could be done to handle the disagreement legally.
Redefining all of it under 'civil union' isn't a compromise, I got everything I wanted
I don't really care what you call it as long as there is equality!
This_person
Well-Known Member
Not an argument - who's going to contest it that wouldn't have contested a heterosexual version?
Very different argument - wonder if that's because there are differences in different orientations? Besides, a will can also handle that. And, many wills for heterosexuals are also contested.
You'd have to contact indivudual companies, but I know of several in So MD. Apply and ask. Or, buy your own. Health care covereage is a right - to all who choose to get it.
This_person
Well-Known Member
Redefining all of it under 'civil union' isn't a compromise, I got everything I wanted
You'd have more argument from those who support same-sex marriage than the other way around, I suspect. Prop 8 is a perfect example. All of the poll links I previously posted show people are in favor of civil union.
This_person
Well-Known Member
Since when is convenience a legal requirement?
UNA
New Member
You REALLY don't get it do you, it becomes a big issue because they have to have one in the first place; I don't!
Easy fix, redefine ALL marriages as "civil unions" an include homosexuals like you agreed would be the best 'fix'.
This_person said:
Guardian-ship is contested and it becomes a big issues because they have to have all these easily contested documents when I don't. If I die (and we had kids) they would automatically go to my husband, no issues (unless he was unfit...obviously).
Easy fix, redefine ALL marriages as "civil unions" an include homosexuals like you agreed would be the best 'fix'.
This_person said:
Didn't you get on another forumite for making claims and not providing proof before?
Again, point is that my husband has health insurance provided by his employer and I am covered on it with a click of a button on-line. Homosexual couples (according to you) have to hunt around and buy their own if they're lucky enough to find it, incurring the full burden of the cost when I don't.
Easy fix, redefine ALL marriages as "civil unions" an include homosexuals like you agreed would be the best 'fix'.
UNA
New Member
There is not logical argument against redefining ALL marriages as civil unions...whatever it takes to shut the conservatives up
Not my problem if it's not good enough because my argument is about equality and that would be equal I don't know the details of the issues they had in CA over this, maybe there wasn't true 100% equality between a homosexual and a heterosexual 'union'/'marriage'/whatever...like I said, I'm not willing to weigh in on this, I'm not going to defend anything just because they're 'liberals' as I am not one and quite honestly, I don't feel like doing the research right now so get off it...
UNA
New Member
Seriously??? Are you equating visiting a loved one on their potential death bed a CONVENIENCE??!!
This_person
Well-Known Member
So, we need to legislate their opinion to not matter?