Paganism In The Navy

[Christy]

Human nature is to destroy what it does not understand. I disagree that humans were made to kill each other.

There are people out there who will do whatever it takes to reach their end goal, and they don't care who stands in their way. It's when those people get in to power positions that war occurs.

I'd have to say that you have created a very myopic existence for yourself, as do most folks who latch blindly on to a "cause". Whether that cause be a religion or simply an idea of how they wish the world to be.

You have that luxury due to the Country that you were fortunate enough to be born in. That country would not exist if not for lots of killing, and dare I say WAR .

Let me ask you this. If you were in charge, Queen of the United States, how would you yield your power? Actually, let's even step that down. You're the Queen of your home, and your neighbor's decide they hate you and your family. First they start off egging your house, then they progress to throwing rocks through your windows, then they just go all out and light your house on fire while you're in bed sleeping? You manage to survive but your kids are burned up and your husband is dead? Mind you, you are the Queen, the top dog, without the luxury of calling the police to sort it all out. What would you do?

 

[buddy999]

You sure as hell do. There are plenty of wonderful people in the military that haven't hurt a soul. In fact, some of the most admirable people I know are in the military. It takes a special person to sacrifice their wants for the greater good of their country, versus sitting on their soapbox complaining while doing nothing to change things.

Amen to that. Just consider where we would be as a country if we didn't have the military. First and foremost, none of us would have the right to be on the computer and make comments like this, not to mention practice, or in some cases, not practice the religion that we desire to practice.

 

[kris31280]

I'd have to say that you have created a very myopic existence for yourself, as do most folks who latch blindly on to a "cause". Whether that cause be a religion or simply an idea of how they wish the world to be.

You have that luxury due to the Country that you were fortunate enough to be born in. That country would not exist if not for lots of killing, and dare I say WAR .

Let me ask you this. If you were in charge, Queen of the United States, how would you yield your power? Actually, let's even step that down. You're the Queen of your home, and your neighbor's decide they hate you and your family. First they start off egging your house, then they progress to throwing rocks through your windows, then they just go all out and light your house on fire while you're in bed sleeping? You manage to survive but your kids are burned up and your husband is dead? Mind you, you are the Queen, the top dog, without the luxury of calling the police to sort it all out. What would you do?

They could burn my husband if they so desired... because I don't have one nor do I want one.

But in that scenerio I guess I'd like to figure out why it is they decided they suddenly hated me after we'd been neighbors for quite some time. Once I figured out why that was, I'd come up with a plan of attack, so to speak... and it would never progress to burning down my house.

 

[vraiblonde]

But in that scenerio I guess I'd like to figure out why it is they decided they suddenly hated me after we'd been neighbors for quite some time.

Maybe they just now got to know you.

I find anti-Americanism fascinating, especially among Americans. Because you know, Kris, that there's a whole world out there that you can escape to and not have to be a party to the military industrial complex.

 

[in8alpha]

I disagree... everyone in the military is the "bad guy" on a spiritual level. The 19 year old down in the mess hall is enrolled himself in to a killing machine. How is that not being the "bad guy"? That 19 year old in the mess hall could be working on becoming an active member on the front, perhaps he just wanted to see what it was all about before he took the leap.

I have to echo the other reasonable minds in this discussion and say that you are grabbing at straws here. People join the military for a variety of reasons, usually because it is a means to an end that they otherwise do not have access to or limited access to.

Here are some things to consider, or not, as is your wont:

"Military service is the first full-time job for most of them."

"Many enlisted personnel are drawn to the benefits offered by the armed forces that allow them to obtain funding for college. In recent years, incentives to join the military have increased, providing more of the enlisted recruits with additional resources to finance their education."

"Like their peers in 1999 and 2003, recruits in 2004 and 2005 came primarily from middle-class areas... The poorest areas continue to be underrep#resented, while middle-class areas are overrepre#sented. Although the richest income brackets are underrepresented"

"While blacks continue to be overrepre#sented, their representation has decreased during the wartime years and is much closer to being pro#portional in 2005 than it was in 2003."

Wartime recruits come more from rural areas, particularly from the South. However, many states outside of the South, such as Alaska and Montana, continue to have strong proportional representa#tion. Areas classified as entirely urban are strongly underrepresented compared to areas with increased rural concentrations, all of which were overrepresented."

http://www.heritage.org/Research/NationalSecurity/cda06-09.cfm

 

[Toxick]

This calls for an inspirational poster!

 

[Christy]

But in that scenerio I guess I'd like to figure out why it is they decided they suddenly hated me after we'd been neighbors for quite some time. Once I figured out why that was, I'd come up with a plan of attack, so to speak... and it would never progress to burning down my house.

Okay, so you go over and find out that they hate you because you're not Christian and until you repent and become Christian they flat out tell you that they will kill you and all family and all of your friends?

 

[migtig]

And while I'm at it (as I sat here thinking and reading the article)...

What the hell are wiccans doing in the Navy, or any armed forces for that matter?

The Wiccan Creed, which is the one and only law/rule in wiccanism, is stated as follows:
"Bide the Wiccan law ye must
In perfect love, in perfect trust.
Eight words the Wiccan Rede fulfill:
And ye harm none, do as ye will.
And ever mind the rule of three:
And what ye sends out comes back to thee.
Follow this with mind and heart,
And merry ye meet, and merry ye part."

Basically there are two things in that "law" that would make it pretty clear that a military career is not the best choice for a wiccan...

"As long as ye harm none, do as ye will" - That means, as long as it's hurting no one, go ahead and do it. This includes harm to yourself, btw. I think that, personally, shooting a gun at someone with the intent to kill or maim or injure is willfully doing harm... and willfully doing harm (and even unintentionally doing harm) goes against the Wiccan Rede.

"And ever mind the rule of three: what ye sends out comes back to thee." - Again, killing someone comes back to you threefold. Plotting against someone, no matter in who's name it is and for what purpose, comes back to you threefold. Basically anything bad you do comes back threefold... but anything good you do comes back threefold as well.

I don't know, just my 4 cents there on that.

Corpsman, doctors, dentists, nurses, medics, ambulance drivers...etc. Just as Quakers have a belief in harming none and helping others and have served in the US military in those positions. Don't assume or presume that every person that joins the military goes around shooting, killing, maiming, pillaging, etc. There are plenty of jobs in the military that do not involve violence.

 

[kris31280]

Maybe they just now got to know you.

I find anti-Americanism fascinating, especially among Americans. Because you know, Kris, that there's a whole world out there that you can escape to and not have to be a party to the military industrial complex.

When did anti-military become anti-american? I still like baseball and apple pie and I still hold on to the American Dream...

It's a difference of opinion, a different point of view. I realize this is a heavily military populated area and my ideas and opinions may not be well received here.

 

[kris31280]

Okay, so you go over and find out that they hate you because you're not Christian and until you repent and become Christian they flat out tell you that they will kill you and all family and all of your friends?

Well that's a whole other can of worms, isn't it... that would actually go back to my claim that christianity has started more wars than any other belief.

 

[Christy]

Well that's a whole other can of worms, isn't it... that would actually go back to my claim that christianity has started more wars than any other belief.

You really aren't getting my point are you?

The fact of the matter is, you can hold on to your beliefs, and more than likely never be in the position to re-evaluate that stance because it won't be presented to you due to the "killing machine" in this Country that keeps it from getting to your doorstep.

 

[Vince]

When did anti-military become anti-american? I still like baseball and apple pie and I still hold on to the American Dream...

And how do you think you get to enjoy baseball, apple pie and freedom of worship? It sure isn't fought for by the dayum tooth fairy. You're anti-military, but you want to enjoy all the freedoms that this country has to offer without anyone fighting for them.....

 

[in8alpha]

"The hippies had in mind something that they wanted, and were calling it "freedom," but in the final analysis "freedom" is a purely negative goal. It just says something is bad. Hippies weren't really offering any alternatives other than colorful short-term ones, and some of these were looking more and more like pure degeneracy. Degeneracy can be fun but it's hard to keep up as a serious lifetime occupation."

Author: Robert Pirsig

 

[Vince]

But the biggest difference between the two in terms of the "law" and the "ten commandments" is that the commandments say "Do unto others as you would have then do unto you."

I know the Ten Commandments by heart and don't remember one like that.

 

[Pete]

When did anti-military become anti-american? I still like baseball and apple pie and I still hold on to the American Dream...

It's a difference of opinion, a different point of view. I realize this is a heavily military populated area and my ideas and opinions may not be well received here.

So in a nut shell ; You like to suck the teat of liberty and freedom as long as you don't get your hands messy in any of the unsavory stuff that supplies that teat?

 

[appendixqh]

When did anti-military become anti-american? I still like baseball and apple pie and I still hold on to the American Dream...

It's a difference of opinion, a different point of view. I realize this is a heavily military populated area and my ideas and opinions may not be well received here.

Explain how you can embrace the American Ideals and Freedom without embracing those people and institutions which defend and fight for them?

Anti-military??? Your damn right that is anti-American. Get rid of the military and next thing you know you will have someone with a gun to your head reciting the Koran, and you can kiss your religous freedom good-bye. The analogy may be extreme...but not to far from the truth.

 

[Vince]

Explain how you can embrace the American Ideals and Freedom without embracing those people and institutions which defend and fight for them?

Anti-military??? Your damn right that is anti-American. Get rid of the military and next thing you know you will have someone with a gun to your head reciting the Koran, and you can kiss your religous freedom good-bye. The analogy may be extreme...but not to far from the truth.

Not far from the truth at all.

 

[MMDad]

my claim that christianity has started more wars than any other belief.

Could you back this up? You used the 100 years war in a previous post, but you didn't ever explain how two christian nations fighting over property can be blamed on christianity.

Just FYI, I am not christian, and am not trying to blindly defend christianity. I just don't like people throwing out false claims condemning any religion.

 

[MMDad]

Because you know, Kris, that there's a whole world out there that you can escape to and not have to be a party to the military industrial complex.

Actually, I don't believe there is anywhere on earth she could do this. There is a military industrial complex of some sort in every country, whether that be making nukes or carving spearheads. She's burying her head in the sand and wishing that humans were not human.

 

[appendixqh]

Actually, I don't believe there is anywhere on earth she could do this. There is a military industrial complex of some sort in every country, whether that be making nukes or carving spearheads. She's burying her head in the sand and wishing that humans were not human.

She can hop her a$$ a ride to Antarctica! Doh....That's right...it is our military aircraft (albeit USAF ) that provides the transportation to there. Perhaps the Artic Circle is a better fit.